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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

NEW WORKFLOW FOR EASY 2K MASTER from "M" proxies - THE ROWLAND WORKFLOW

Brandon said:
problem: After grading, I rendered the clips and sent back to FCP, but the FCP clips are not changing to the graded versions. I also, changed the sequence setting to the 2k res, but now I'm just looking at the old non graded M clips with a lot of black space around them.

Any tips?
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I think this is Color itself. Sometimes it doesn't send back right. I have also had it lose clips in the timeline, playing fragments of other clips.

Color has never been rock solid but it is definitely worth fighting with as you can get great results cheap! :w00t:

Best idea is to close and reopen the program, often does the trick.
 
jimhare said:
I think this is Color itself. Sometimes it doesn't send back right. I have also had it lose clips in the timeline, playing fragments of other clips.

Color has never been rock solid but it is definitely worth fighting with as you can get great results cheap! :w00t:

Best idea is to close and reopen the program, often does the trick.
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Thanks Jim. I closed it, reopened it and tried again, but it still isn't working. Rebooted my computer and even tried creating a different project and it still isnt working.

any advise?
 
Brandon said:
Thanks Jim. I closed it, reopened it and tried again, but it still isn't working. Rebooted my computer and even tried creating a different project and it still isnt working.

any advise?
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You sound as if you are just looking at your original sequence, and expecting it to show the graded version. Apologies if I am misunderstanding.

You need to choose 'file/send to FCP' in Color, which will create a new sequence in your FCP project with '(from Color)' appended to the name.
 
Hi, in my experience sometimes to have an accurate timeline in final cut back to color I import manually the corrected clips. Find the folder where color placed the color corrected clips (for every clip there's a folder) and drag or import the folders in the timeline (it's best duplicate the timeline first).
 
Nick Shaw said:
You sound as if you are just looking at your original sequence, and expecting it to show the graded version. Apologies if I am misunderstanding.

You need to choose 'file/send to FCP' in Color, which will create a new sequence in your FCP project with '(from Color)' appended to the name.
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ah HA! Thanks Nick! Like I said, I'm a color newb and never actually used it in my workflow before. Thanks for explaining this to me! :)
 
That would do it! :bleh:

I was under the impression that you already had it working, but one sequence was misbehaving!

Glad it's working. Pretty cool huh?
 
jimhare said:
That would do it! :bleh:

I was under the impression that you already had it working, but one sequence was misbehaving!

Glad it's working. Pretty cool huh?
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lol you overestimate me :) But yes, this is really fantastic! Far better than RE-wrapping the quicktime, which not only takes time, but doubles my storage.

So, just so I'm totally clear, is color reading the .r3d's, not the proxies, right? Color is grading from the highest quality source?
 
This has just renewed my interest and enthusiasm for posting this footage. Testing shall begin.
 
guys this workflow drops into 8 bit...which can lead to artifacting, if thats ok then fine. But when you start seeing weird shimmering after your stuff has been horrendously compressed for broadcast, and you didn't realize that it mattered, well have fun.
 
Jeff Brue said:
guys this workflow drops into 8 bit...which can lead to artifacting, if thats ok then fine. But when you start seeing weird shimmering after your stuff has been horrendously compressed for broadcast, and you didn't realize that it mattered, well have fun.
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what makes you say that? as long as you set your sequence settings to 10 bit processing, why would it be 8 bit?
 
If it lets you do corrections off the RAW file, I don't see any reason why it would restrict you to 8 bits over 12.

What I think is the most interesting thing is that RED hasn't said anything about this workflow yet, either for or against. They only mentioned their way of doing it and that was it. I wish we could get some sort of answer why or why not to do this straight from the source.
 
As long as you select "Floating Point" all the calculations in Color should be done at 12bits or greater. I haven't seen any evidence to the contrary, Jeff do you have a theory?

Graeme Nattress said:
The underlying RAW data is the same, you don't loose any through the process. For one reason or another the decode is 2k only, but the full 4k data is still underlying. The RAW room decodes the RAW with the parameters as is, and from there it's float so you can concatenate the feature of Color referring back to that RAW data. Because the curves are done as LUTs, there's effectively a clamp on the float data which means super whites are lost at that point and can't be pulled back later.

Graeme
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Tim Sutherland said:
If it lets you do corrections off the RAW file, I don't see any reason why it would restrict you to 8 bits over 12.

What I think is the most interesting thing is that RED hasn't said anything about this workflow yet, either for or against. They only mentioned their way of doing it and that was it. I wish we could get some sort of answer why or why not to do this straight from the source.
Click to expand...

I've contacted Red via PM about this workflow, and their workflow guys are looking into it. I have not seen any evidence of this workflow restricting you to 8 bits unless at some point along the way you force this restriction yourself with a setting in Color or a particular codec choice. Unless Jeff Brue can provide some evidence otherwise, I cry foul.

This workflow seems to work very well. I'll let you guys know what I hear back from Red.
 
Matthew Rogers said:
I wish I could figure out why 3k when sent as a "native" file from FCP renders out fine, but a 3k proxy renders out crap... If 3k files worked fine then this workflow would be great and I could recommended it to clients.

Matthew
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Any way that you can send me a 3K file to test with? I don't have any readily available. (I only have 2:1 4K files right now). Contact me via PM.

Thanks.
 
Jeff Brue said:
guys this workflow drops into 8 bit...which can lead to artifacting, if thats ok then fine. But when you start seeing weird shimmering after your stuff has been horrendously compressed for broadcast, and you didn't realize that it mattered, well have fun.
Click to expand...

I give, why does it drop into 8 bit?
 
Just did a test with 3k proxies. If you render out higher than 720P, then they will be screwed up and only some of the image will render. If you render at 720P or lower, then it works and looks great.

Will someone at RED let us know when we might be able to expect to send 3k proxies to Color for a 1080p or higher finish? It stinks to have to basically do an online with the "native" files before you got to Color if using any 3k footage. Sigh...workflow is still an issue with this camera:(

Matthew
 
FCP COlor

FCP COlor

Rowland said:
I think I may have figured out a very easy way to end up with a 2K master using the "M" proxies generated by the camera.

The basics:
I cut a sequence in FCP using the "M" size proxies (1024x512) - they work well.
I sent that sequence to Color.
I changed the Project settings in Color to the 2K red dimensions (2048 x 1024).
I graded in Color and rendered to ProRes HQ with dimensions of 2048 x 1024 (2K).
From Color I used the "Send To Final Cut Pro" command.
This creates a new sequence in FCP with the rendered files connected.
In FCP, change the sequence settings of this new sequence to 2048 x 1024.
You now have a graded 2K sequence in FCP that you originally cut using "M" proxies. SOOO SIMPLE! I tried it, it works.
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This is great info. I'm gonna try it out today. Thank you.
 
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