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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

NAB13- Dragon Sensor Upgrade Program begins

Adam Watson said:
Is there ANY footage someone can point to? Can't find any and I'm surprised so many people are upgrading their cameras to a sensor that no one has seen any footage from. A picture of a fake lizard doesn't cut it.
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Woah, woah, woah.... To be sure it wasn't a fake lizard, that was a real Frilled Dragon, a lizard, a real animal and it was alive and well in those photos. :thumbsup:


Chlamydosaurus kingii
http://www.biolib.cz/en/taxon/id59093/

27425.jpg


This is not a dragon photo... just a photo of a dragon. Lizard.
 
Ryan Sauve said:
end up costing more than buying new
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YES, it ends up costing more than buying new TODAY... But you didn't buy it today, you bought it a year ago and NOW you can UPGRADE IT without having to buy it ALL AGAIN AT FULL PRICE. You get a portion of what you have already paid towards the theoretical cost of buying it new today. The remainder, consider as depreciation or use cost.
 
Elsie N said:
Some of us just willing to take a leap of faith, based on RED's track record of getting it right in the end.
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Leap of faith was in 2006/7 with a new company with no track record, with skepticism and ridicule from professional community, with unknown reliability and with recording format having no practical workflow. And without gadget sites hype.
 
Buying a cam shouldn't be about pure maths, it should be about a passion for what you can do with it whether business or art.

Seriously, look around what happened to the pure finance industries - they tanked in 2008. Regular people didn't get an upgrade on their assets - they got evicted.

Be at least realising that our industry is built on something tangible.
 
Bob Gundu said:
REDRAY in a couple of weeks with Beta Software.
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Bob,

Fact?? Where did you get this info? I haven't seen anything on it yet. I ordered REDRAY on Nov. 30th 20min after it went live in the store.

Hope to have it soon.

Was really hoping for some info on this. Thanks in advance for your source.

Frazier
 
:thumbsup::thumbsup:
Tyrone Braithwaite said:
Buying a cam shouldn't be about pure maths, it should be about a passion for what you can do with it whether business or art.

Seriously, look around what happened to the pure finance industries - they tanked in 2008. Regular people didn't get an upgrade on their assets - they got evicted.

Be at least realising that our industry is built on something tangible.
Click to expand...
 
Very interesting how many people are mad that they can't see any footage from Dragon. Man you can't even see full 4K unless your an industry guy and you work for a company that has embraced it already. How do you expect to see 6K and judge if it's "worth it?" I mean if its all "seeing is believing" then there is a mess of guys out there with a "blind faith." At the RED Digital Short Fest there were guys who won who had never even seen real 4K footage until the festival. And this was stuff they shot!
 
Christopher Probst said:
Steve, you again miss the point. Joe Blow off the street is not going to get an Epic Dragon in their hands next week! It's again a factor of considering the cost of getting the premium technology early when it's hot and will command a premium rental.
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That would be a totally valid point. Except Scarlet upgrades appear to be at the back of the line. Which is why I am hoping that the Scarlet -> Epic upgrade policy starts immediately so that we can at least have a working Epic while we wait for Dragon.
 
Micah Brown said:
Very interesting how many people are mad that they can't see any footage from Dragon. Man you can't even see full 4K unless your an industry guy and you work for a company that has embraced it already. How do you expect to see 6K and judge if it's "worth it?" I mean if its all "seeing is believing" then there is a mess of guys out there with a "blind faith." At the RED Digital Short Fest there were guys who won who had never even seen real 4K footage until the festival. And this was stuff they shot!
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It's about DR and new color science too.
 
Christopher Probst said:
Steve, you again miss the point. Joe Blow off the street is not going to get an Epic Dragon in their hands next week! It's again a factor of considering the cost of getting the premium technology early when it's hot and will command a premium rental. You first need to work on getting clients to hire you. Not fussing about costs of upgrades. If and only if you are working gangbusters, THEN consider buying a camera....

Owning a camera doesn't make your reel sellable, or your personality better that people have to have you on set with them. Make your abilities your asset you're selling, not a piece of depreciating technology.
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Very very well put. Mr Probst you should be a motivational speaker.
Just to make one point clear though, the Arri Alexa Phenomenon is not going away soon, broadcasters, indie distributors, AD agencies, Record labels etc have been sold on its performance. Those are the check signers besides the new XTERM upgrade allow you to record Arriraw and sharper 2k Prores simultaneously. I was praying the new module combined with the new DR and 6k would put the Dragon Ahead, but alas.....
The Alexa's DR on the sensor is not the only thing going for it, there's something very organic about the images it puts out, even when put side to side with the F65 you can clearly tell the difference. The Sony is tack sharp, just as the Epic is due to the double bandwidth in resolution but the Alexa just has instant sex.
 
Hrvoje Simic said:
Leap of faith was in 2006/7 with a new company with no track record, with skepticism and ridicule from professional community, with unknown reliability and with recording format having no practical workflow. And without gadget sites hype.
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True dat. That was like falling backwards and trusting someone to catch you before you bust your head on the concrete. But the poster I was answering wondered why anyone would buy a sensor upgrade without seeing pics. Apparently he is a skeptic.
 
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Paul Harb said:
Would you need to be looking at a 4k monitor to see a difference between MX and Dragon sensors?
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Paul, according to something Graeme said in another thread (or maybe it's in this one 20 or 30 pages ago) the new sensor will have what sounded to me like an entirely new Color Science. He said there might be some noticeable difference under normal viewing IIRC.
 
shashbugu said:
Very very well put. Mr Probst you should be a motivational speaker.
Just to make one point clear though, the Arri Alexa Phenomenon is not going away soon, broadcasters, indie distributors, AD agencies, Record labels etc have been sold on its performance. Those are the check signers besides the new XTERM upgrade allow you to record Arriraw and sharper 2k Prores simultaneously. I was praying the new module combined with the new DR and 6k would put the Dragon Ahead, but alas.....
The Alexa's DR on the sensor is not the only thing going for it, there's something very organic about the images it puts out, even when put side to side with the F65 you can clearly tell the difference. The Sony is tack sharp, just as the Epic is due to the double bandwidth in resolution but the Alexa just has instant sex.
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One day i decided to do a test.

I put a 1/4 low contrast filter in front in from of my samyang/rokinon 35mm lens on my Epic. I shot an interview, softened the curves up a touch, then I showed some established DP friends of mine about the footage. I told them I shot the footage using an Alexa with Cooke s4i. They told me how good it looked. They said, this is why Epic has fallen out of favour with DPs. Look at the rolloff and the creamy skintones. I didn't have the heart to tell them my trickery.

Since that day I keep my 1/4 lowcon filter handy, and that curve I can load up with an instant's notice.

My point? Not trying to be argumentative. Just an amusing POV on "instant sex".
 
Ivan Kovax said:
One day i decided to do a test.

I put a 1/4 low contrast filter in front in from of my samyang/rokinon 35mm lens on my Epic. I shot an interview, softened the curves up a touch, then I showed some established DP friends of mine about the footage. I told them I shot the footage using an Alexa with Cooke s4i. They told me how good it looked. They said, this is why Epic has fallen out of favour with DPs. Look at the rolloff and the creamy skintones. I didn't have the heart to tell them my trickery.
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Great story and nice tip. I just wish you had called them out.
 
Paul Harb said:
Would you need to be looking at a 4k monitor to see a difference between MX and Dragon sensors?
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I imagine a 5k and 6k still raw image from each would be a great comparison. That's what I'm looking forward to.
 
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