My Dragon Thoughts

[paulherrin]

i'm pretty sure i remember hdr mode getting the go-ahead (eventually) for the sake of taking still and motion at the same time... as most of you guys know it helps for getting sharp captures and for pulling mattes/tracking. if it's not planned on being implemented it can be really helpful, i'm sure i'm not the only one that would like to see it continue. and there's always things like explosions that are tricky to plan exposure for, nice to lessen the stress. and some people may really like magic motion/mnmb from a philosophical standpoint. i think it's cool conceptually, maybe sometime i'll shoot a whole short that way. seemed like lots of thoughtfulness went into the development, would hate to see it eol.

 

[Jarred Land]

Hdrx will come.. Likely not till December or January though.

 

[paulherrin]

saweeet, thx - rock on

 

[Kemalettin Sert]

Hdrx is reduntant MysteriumX vs Dragon test nonsense...cant describe what i have seen on dragon

 

[Phil Holland]

Taking the Dragon out for a walk... Starting in LA shooting Kobe Bryant on stage... Off to Turkey to shoot plates and exteriors... with a meet up with Kemalettin... and now in Barcelona to shoot Messi!

Biggest athlete in the world shot in 6K. Love it. Can't wait to see this final spot.

Hdrx will come.. Likely not till December or January though.

Excellent and exciting news.

 

[paulherrin]

Hdrx is reduntant MysteriumX vs Dragon test nonsense...cant describe what i have seen on dragon

did you really not read my post? it's very useful simply because you get two different streams at the same time. among other benefits (read it)

hopefully that will develop into an alpha/depth channel one day soon... <ahem>

 

[paulherrin]

haha, i get you - forget the haters, shoot your stuff... apparently that's the best argument you can make

 

[Jeremy Torrie]

Great to hear about HDRx. I was also wondering if the Motion Mount is going to help with blending of the two frames? Since I'm not an engineer and don't know the science behind HDRx I assume the sampling of the '2nd' frame is a fraction after the first, and hence sometimes I have seen a ghosting effect on moving subjects...will the overall experience improve? I love the concept as is -just wondering if it benefits at all with the new mount.

 

[paulherrin]

the motion mount isn't designed specifically for that, although in general it will help with motion blur so it will have some effect on the image, but again not what you're talking about. the foundry has made MNMB (more normal motion blur) attempting to address that, and otherwise you can use something like reelsmart to try to match the two, but as i'm aware mnmb attempts to blur the x track in order to closely match the a track.

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?76858-Interpolating-frames-on-the-X-track-for-HDRX

come to think of it, anybody know what the deal is with the foundry's MNMB tool?

 

[Will Keir]

What about low light performance? How many more stops are we gaining? Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

Christopher,

Now that you've shot a bit more with Dragon, what is your opinion? What are you finding out now that you couldn't have known without using it thus far? What are your thoughts on the 16.5+ stops of DR and what ISO level are you comfortable pushing it to if need be?

Thanks for your time!

 

[Will Keir]

Kemalettin,

What about low light shooting with Dragon, did you get a chance to test how many stops we are gaining? How much more sensitive is this Dragon?

Hdrx is reduntant MysteriumX vs Dragon test nonsense...cant describe what i have seen on dragon

 

[Will Keir]

Yes, it's nice to be an early believer and see this guys working hard as hell to go way beyond expectations.

This year, Jim & Jarred share an Oscar!

im so damn happy with being on RED side of the world.

 

[Jeremy Torrie]

the motion mount isn't designed specifically for that, although in general it will help with motion blur so it will have some effect on the image, but again not what you're talking about. the foundry has made MNMB (more normal motion blur) attempting to address that, and otherwise you can use something like reelsmart to try to match the two, but as i'm aware mnmb attempts to blur the x track in order to closely match the a track.

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?76858-Interpolating-frames-on-the-X-track-for-HDRX

come to think of it, anybody know what the deal is with the foundry's MNMB tool?

Paul -Yes I know Motion Mount was not built for this purpose, which is why I asked the question.

With HDRx, Dragon, Motion Mount, and Meizler, this will be the camera of all cameras....until Red creates another beast.

BTW has anyone seen that Toyota commercial with the Epics or Scarlets zipping along and doing flips in the commercial? Thought that was pretty cool.

 

[paulherrin]

+1

that commercial rocks the house

 

[Christopher Probst]

Kemalettin,

What about low light shooting with Dragon, did you get a chance to test how many stops we are gaining? How much more sensitive is this Dragon?

Kemalettin wasn't involved with the actual shoot, nor handling the camera. There was no specific scientific analysis done. I have done some private quick testing prior to the shoot and have made some personal observations, but nothing formal that I could present at this point. I can say that there IS more dynamic range... exactly how much, I'm still working on getting an exact number. It matters little in terms of this shoot, but it would be nice to know.

Based on Kemalettin's response, I suspect he's had some time with the DIT on our job and played with the footage... which is more than I have been able to do! Technically, not ethical on a professional/legal end for our DIT... If that is so. But that's just an assumption for now. And I'd almost rather not know!

 

[luigivaltulini]

More and more happy every day that goes by choosing this company.
They work hard and these are the results.

Hdrx will come.. Likely not till December or January though.

Ohhhh nice nice notice Jarred
i am happy for my timelaps



Luigi

 

[paulherrin]

Based on Kemalettin's response, I suspect he's had some time with the DIT on our job and played with the footage... which is more than I have been able to do! Technically, not ethical on a professional/legal end for our DIT... If that is so. But that's just an assumption for now. And I'd almost rather not know!

depends on your pov... i'd say it's unethical not to see those things - you're gettin gypped!

 

[Gavin Greenwalt]

Great to hear about HDRx. I was also wondering if the Motion Mount is going to help with blending of the two frames? Since I'm not an engineer and don't know the science behind HDRx I assume the sampling of the '2nd' frame is a fraction after the first, and hence sometimes I have seen a ghosting effect on moving subjects...will the overall experience improve? I love the concept as is -just wondering if it benefits at all with the new mount.

HDRx Frame is from the same exposure not a second exposure.

Start: [HDRX]
Start: [REGULAR.... Exposure]

It's like if you started writing a word doc and then versioned up and continued working in a second file. The first file has the first paragraph or so... but the second file has the first paragraph and everything after it. Motion Mount wouldn't help. If anything it would most likely interfere with HDRx if you tried to use the new softened motion blur Motion Mount feature.

Who needs 4k?

I just shot a spot for a YouTube pre-roll ad (1080p) and even the Epic MX's resolution was insufficient to avoid up-rezzing the 5k RAW footage. I could have shot it on a 1080p camera but I would have needed an extra shoot day and 3x more crew. Dragon 6k would have been very welcome (assuming the lens could resolve the full 6k).

But not to throw more fuel on the fire... I edited in DNxHD to get the concept locked and approved, only rendering the RAW for finals.

 

[John Marchant]

Common misconception - HDRx is not like that. A frame comes first, X frame comes second starting immediately the A frame finishes exposing. Red have described it as 'motion conjoined' - there's no overlap, but if there's a gap I've had little luck finding it.


Click for larger

If the exposures were concurrent you'd be able to have 360 shutter in HDRx, which you can't. Its also currently a reason why Motion mount and HDRx don't play together - the motion mount wants the camera's shutter at 360, to allow the MM shutter to control things.

 

[Phil Holland]

Nice graphic John!