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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Mini Mac Pro?

It's an intriguing development. There is likely still a market for a smaller tower provided it still has a decent amount of PCIe slots.
I think Apple Silicon and what they actually deliver is a big issue regarding the future Mac models.

We'll see the beginnings of this on 11/10.

Brian Timmons
BRITIM/MEDIA
 
Patrick Tresch said:
Hope it's also half the price.
Click to expand...

Haha yea I know I do :)

If its a starter system to get you into Apple Silicon, Im game.

I was there from Motorola, PowerPC to Intel so bring it on ;)
 
It will be fascinating to see if Apple ‘allows’ an Infinity fabric to continue into is AppleSilicon Mac Pro’s - or replaces it with alternative (open or closed) standard.

With Nvidia promising to play by a different set of values in order to procure ARM / and Apple one of the companies publicly against the takeover - I also wonder if a deal will be struck to mend previous bad blood, and for both companies to work together to strengthen the ARM ecosystem (and respective tools) - and NV GPUs finally ‘allowed’ back into the Apple fruity empire.

With their chance to grow their PC penetration above 10% - their value proposition and, in the case of their Mac Pro - their size, will no doubt need to be more enticing.
Apple are already living on the leading edge of TSMCs fabs, and own the bible on miniaturisation.
I hope they reduce the XY Mac Pro size by 40% - and still allow enough 3rd party internal expansions to keep the high end happy.

AJ
 
Personally, the small computer form factor is nowhere near the top of my list. Actually, if recent history is any indication, GPUs are only getting bigger, 3090 comes to mind.
As far as I know, Apple isn't able to rewrite laws of physics, therefore more computing power means bigger power supplies, bigger cooling fans, bigger enclosures etc. I do not want proprietary enclosures, that although may be smaller and more elegant, cost twice or three times of standard solutions, like it is done in a present Mac Pro.
Also, while Apple pushing T2 "security" means, that commodity hardware will not be welcomed on Apple hardware. Example new "non repairable" iPhone 12 by anyone, but Apple, even if parts are genuine Apple parts and repairs are done by a knowledgeable personnel.
Apple makes no secret for their desire to control the whole enchilada- software and hardware and in addition to CPUs they are planning to introduce their own GPUs, so not only you need to say goodby to nVidia, but also get used to the idea of missing AMD GPUs as well.
So based on that, it is pretty clear, that Apple silicon will be cheaper in the long run both for Apple and the end consumer and it will be great for low powered iPad, iPhones and MacBooks, but it may take a few years before Apple silicon will start showing up in Mac Pro's.
 
Yay, I can talk now that the announcement has happened. I’ve got a new 13” MBP here. Apple is kicking ass with this new chip. It’s a HUGE improvement over the 2018 MBP13 I have. Still not as powerful as my 16” MBP, yet it’s a lot snappier overall. And actually to take that back, things that can use the ML cores and are optimized for the M1 chip absolutely scream. I didn’t know what all they were going to announce today, but now we see that the bigger chip(s) for the 16” MBP, iMac and Mac Pro are not here yet. They’re still saying this is about a 2 year transition process. I just wanted to chime in previously about the Apple chips, but couldn’t really say anything on it until now. Apple is now making the most powerful CPUs in terms of power per watt. How that will scale up to their larger systems will be interesting to see. All things considered, I think the new Air, Mini and MBP13 are a great start.


FWIW, I know Intel is pretty butt-hurt over this. But Apple has been on them hard for a while about getting their process shrink implemented, trimming the bloat and a bunch of other things that Intel just can’t seem to get done.
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
FWIW, I know Intel is pretty butt-hurt over this. But Apple has been on them hard for a while about getting their process shrink implemented, trimming the bloat and a bunch of other things that Intel just can’t seem to get done.
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Apple hung in there for a long time with Intel.
Do you think we will still have options for a few more years yet?
To me, if not all apps are ported over, I cant be too excited.
I went through this with Motorola and PowerPC :P
 
The way the new Rosetta2 works, it’s a whole lot smoother than PowerPC to Intel. Overall there’s much greater compatibility and developers have minimal work to rebuild a native app compared to the last time around. That said, I’ve encountered a few little gotcha’s in my testing so far. And depending on what you’re coming from, it may or may not be the right time to consider one of these vs. an Intel Mac. Apple will continue to sell Intel Macs until their transition is complete and maybe even a bit beyond. But I wouldn’t expect any real innovation on that side of the product line, just a minor update here and there to accommodate a new CPU or GPU. The 13” Pro is great for working in Xcode and moderate photo work, can edit videos in a pinch. For now, if I know I need more power, I’ll grab my 16”. This is a nice replacement to my 2018 MBP13. But if you have a current 13”, then probably best to wait a year or two. Waiting is probably the best course of action unless you just need a new Air, Mini or MBP13 now.
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
Waiting is probably the best course of action unless you just need a new Air, Mini or MBP13 now.
Click to expand...
Well, you know most Apple followers tend to buy too early :P
I for one always wait (if it's my personal budget) till a few revisions.
On that note, I am looking at a laptop this January so hoping to find a 16" at a decent price then.
 
Jeff:

How does the new 13" MacBook Pro compare to the earlier 2020 I bought a few months back? Paid a lot more than $1995.

MacBook Pro (13-inch, 2020, Four Thunderbolt 3 ports)
2.3 GHz Quad-Core Intel Core i7
32 GB 3733 MHz LPDDR4X
Intel Iris Plus Graphics 1536 MB

BTW Apple promo for new one says first 13" configurable to 32GB - when obviously mine was configured with 32gb

------


PS:

The store wasn't updated when I first looked at this. It appears the M1 chip is only for the the two lower end and max 16gb ram - higher end is still Intel like I have.

Still curious how the m1 chip versions compare for editing on non apple programs like Resolve.
 
Should be pretty comparable for general CPU tasks that don’t utilize more than 4 cores, but it’s not that simple. The new one has 8 cores and absolutely crushes through stuff built as a native app. It’s a much tighter integrated product and a lot more efficient. The new one is said to be configurable to 32GB, but we can only order with 16GB. They sent me one with 16GB, which is fine for my 13”. The biggest improvement I see vs. my 2018 is the whole system just being a lot snappier and it is definitely more powerful. Noticeably a lot faster building Xcode projects. Working in Unity is actually possible on the 13” with their GPU. My 2018 was a dog in Unity. OTOH, it’s not a great system for Unity anyway just because the screen is too small, but that’s a different problem.

Final Cut is way more responsive and capable on the system with ProRes footage. I have not tried R3D clips lately and will revisit, I had some issues with getting R3D to work last week. I have not attempted DaVinci Resolve. R3D support may need a native update from RED and I haven’t asked if they have it up and running. I’m curious to see how the Metal acceleration for R3D will translate to these systems.
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
Final Cut is way more responsive and capable on the system with ProRes footage...
Click to expand...
As I refresh this topic Im suffering in Premiere on a 2019 Mac Pro :P
For some weird reason, its been acting like a dog for the last few days.
And im in Proxy mode.
Just getting that sticky interface feeling :P

Okay back to the topic.
I will def wait for a 16" M1 and maybe M2 ;)
 
They mentioned briefly in the keynote that the Mbp could playback 8K without dropping frames (while showing Resolve on the screen).
Guess we are talking prores and not R3D, but still
 
If these M1 chips are that good, couldn't they just add multiple sets of M1 chips and memory to work together for the Pro lineup? We had dual processor Mac Pros, why not double or even quadruple that into a multicore all in one machine? Seems a bit silly to just hold back and make us wait a year or more if something like that would be possible already.
 
Zack Birlew said:
If these M1 chips are that good, couldn't they just add multiple sets of M1 chips and memory to work together for the Pro lineup? We had dual processor Mac Pros, why not double or even quadruple that into a multicore all in one machine? Seems a bit silly to just hold back and make us wait a year or more if something like that would be possible already.
Click to expand...

You know were talking about Apple ;)
 
The M1 is designed around a GPU ceiling - met by an integrated GPU with a high speed (and very low latency) fabric.
It may be an exemplary design to minimise the average power consumption - but is Not architected to reach maximal desktop performance.

Rather than multiple M1s (4 high power cores, medium speed shared memory with a medium power GPU, and 4 lower power cores), a more optimal solution could entail 12 (or 16) high power cores, (very) HBM memory - and a lot of it (>= 32GB).

It will be interesting to see if Apple adds additional hardware accelerators, TB4, and what they are going to do about a desktop GPU fabric.
There are also ARM (ISA) language extension that Apple have not yet supported that can more effectively target certain (research) workloads (than a GPU).

AJ

Zack Birlew said:
If these M1 chips are that good, couldn't they just add multiple sets of M1 chips and memory to work together for the Pro lineup? We had dual processor Mac Pros, why not double or even quadruple that into a multicore all in one machine? Seems a bit silly to just hold back and make us wait a year or more if something like that would be possible already.
Click to expand...
 
Hi Jeff, maybe you can offer some advice. I have been struggling with my MacBook from Early 2014 always using proxies. Now got into the Sony A7s III, everything suddenly is 4K 120 fps etc and of course my laptop is a pain in the ass to deal with. I was looking at the 16 inch full specs and $3400 suddenly looks too much compared to the new 13 inch M1 with 16 RAM, should I go with the new MB (13 " M1) ? I mainly do small corporate gigs, very few effects, some DaVinci every now and then...
 
Enrique Blein said:
Hi Jeff, maybe you can offer some advice. I have been struggling with my MacBook from Early 2014 always using proxies.
Click to expand...
What do you edit in?
Currently, FCP(X?) and I think Resolve is coded for the M1.
 
We’re going to see more variants of the M1 that have additional clock speed options, more RAM, more CPU/GPU cores... These are the first pitch, the initial offering. Honestly, I think the ones who will benefit the most from these new M1 systems at this time are developers who are building universal or Apple SoC native apps who didn’t get the DTK. But the systems are great. If you need a new MB Air, it’s a great time to buy one. If you need a new 13” Pro, hmmm... maybe. It’s a much more powerful system than the Intel based one, but you’re also going to be restricted by software translation and some compatibility concerns until you can get running mostly native apps. I don’t have specific benchmark scores for my MBP 13. And if I did, I couldn’t share just yet. Apple doesn’t want us posting such things until the various tech bloggers and reviewers can do their thing in a few more days as systems arrive. But as we’re seeing with the MB Air benchmarks leaking out on GeekBench and some other such things, it’s no slouch of a system. I’m doing some testing on mine here, but I’m really using it 90% for Xcode and real dev work. The Pro is more powerful than the Air as it’s clocked faster and has a cooling system, the Air is passively cooled.

At this time, I can speak to how powerful it is and that it looks very, very promising. But I just can’t make any direct recommendation as to buying one. I know I wouldn’t feel comfortable taking it on location for any serious video/film/photography project. No doubt in my mind about the hardware being up to the task. This is a software concern at the moment. I’m sure I’ll have a better answer to that in the coming weeks. That said, I’m getting some native apps. Affinity Photo and Designer are now native. MS Office being native is helpful but in no way shows anything about performance. And once I have native versions of Resolve and other things, it will be interesting to see how they run. But running Resolve on a 13” notebook isn’t really how I want to run it. And the 16GB RAM is a non-starter for a lot of uses.

@Enrique - this is a tough one. I think you, and many here, would be best served to wait a bit longer for an updated 16” with Apple SoC and 32+ GB RAM. There will be a lot more native software available by then and a lot of the kinks worked out. I’m not sure how long it will take for those to arrive. I’m betting we’ll see the 16” and iMac offerings early next year.

Of course, if you need it now, you need it. The 16” is a great system. I bought a 16” when it came out. It’s great, I use it almost daily. And it should last me another year or two and I can replace it with a 2nd or maybe 3rd generation Apple SoC system.
 
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