List the 5 most important things you want from scarlet

[killfilm]

yes, the red has audio capabilities so should the scarlet, no hiss, no hum
just clear 24bit/48kkhz audio with nice meters

 

[JustinC]

However, if it's a kick ass lens with mechanical focus capability (think EX-1) then I'll be happy.

Yes definitely would want a mechanical lens so I could spend hideous amounts on Croszeil follow focus and matte box set up.

How about Graham Nattress figures out a way to let me use my iPod touch as the LCD? That would get some publicity! And make me smile! GRAHAM?!

 

[Aiden Cornwell]

I wonder if Scarlet will be a HDR Cinema camera with the capabilities of doing multiple exposers at the same time?

 

[Zhibo Lai]

I was ready to purcahse a Sony EX1, until I found out about Scarlet. If my wait will be worthwild, this is what I'd like to see on Scarlet as a narrative indie filmmaker:

1. combine all the pros of the HVX and EX1, and throw in some extra to blow them away
2. super 16mm CCD or CMOS, no rolling shutter
3. write to CF or other tapless medium
4. native 2K sensor
5. very low noise and great in low light < 1 lux
6. variable frame rates from 1-72
7. color can be 4:2:0 to keep price and storage down
8. super nice if they could throw in a USB output that taps the RAW sensor data and output 4:4:4 10bit uncompressed, like the andromeda did for the DVX for around $2.5K extra,
9. so say everything 1-7 for $5k, plus #8 for total of $7.5K

 

[DSNR]

I wonder if Scarlet will be a HDR Cinema camera with the capabilities of doing multiple exposers at the same time?

Now, wouldn’t that be something...In a way, this could be a good explanation for Scarlet not to compete with Red (or any other camera for that matter), I daresay, give it couple (or more) years but who knows, the Red team have already proven themselves to the world with technological innovation and market breakthroughs.

Especially now that Dolby acquired BrightSide Technologies Inc we should start seeing more and more HDR applications being researched and developed.

 

[lordtangent]

1. LinLog 16:9 s16 sensor
2. 2.5k res
3. RAW acquisition w RedCode
4. Variable frame rates up to highest possible.
5. 10-bit HDMI out

LinLog CMOS would solve the hard clipping problem that all digital cameras have.

 

[Mike Bozulich]

I was ready to purcahse a Sony EX1, until I found out about Scarlet. If my wait will be worthwild, this is what I'd like to see on Scarlet as a narrative indie filmmaker:

1. combine all the pros of the HVX and EX1, and throw in some extra to blow them away
2. super 16mm CCD or CMOS, no rolling shutter
3. write to CF or other tapless medium
4. native 2K sensor
5. very low noise and great in low light < 1 lux
6. variable frame rates from 1-72
7. color can be 4:2:0 to keep price and storage down
8. super nice if they could throw in a USB output that taps the RAW sensor data and output 4:4:4 10bit uncompressed, like the andromeda did for the DVX for around $2.5K extra,
9. so say everything 1-7 for $5k, plus #8 for total of $7.5K

Hey Realogist, you cheated with 9 items. I love your list though.

I'd say it's safe to assume that the Scarlet will have a CMOS sensor, same as the Red, but I doubt the rolling shutter problem will go away anytime soon. It's pretty minimal on the Red, so I expect that to be case on the Scarlet as well. I'm pretty sure it will be tapeless as well since that seems the way everything is going these days anyway. I would love it if it was very low light sensative. The EX-1 is pretty good in that regard. I think the EX-1 really sets the benchmark at the moment. The real worrying thing is that in no shape or form is the EX-1 a "pocket" camera. So to cram all these things into a camera that's much smaller will be a true challenge. Anyway, it should be interesting to see what Red comes up with.

 

[Peter Majtan]

My top 5 features for Scarlet

My top 5 features for Scarlet

1) HD or 2K 4:4:4 RGB RAW (RED CODE)
2) Variable frame-rate 1-120 with ramp
3) Interchangeable lens mounts (especially Canon EF / EOS)
4) SDHC and (not "or") HDD media
5) Bellow $ 2500,- (body, no lens, etc...)

"Flip" LCD is not important, as I always use external monitor. Even the highest quality "flip" LCD will not match quality of a good external monitor (7"+), while adding huge cost to the camera body. "No LCD" will allow everyone to get what they prefer...

Let's see at NAB...

Keep up the good work!!!

 

[shalom]

1) 1080p (essential) or better
2) 4:4:4
3) VFR (up to 120fps or higher)
4) Interchangeable lenses
5) <$5k

My credit card awaits...

 

[Joel Kaye]

1) 1080p (essential) or better
2) 4:4:4
3) VFR (up to 120fps or higher)
4) Interchangeable lenses
5) <$5k

My credit card awaits...

How does a pocket camera have interchangeable lenses?

If it's REALLY a pocket camera I can put in my jeans pocket then it'll have a fixed lens. It might be a little zoom with full manual control. I can see it now... no auto anything - ergo "professional".

I just think some of you guys are setting yourself up for a letdown... unless they build a HV20 killer for under $1k. That would be interesting to me.

 

[chuckt]

I am shocked that people are still talking about what they want in Scarlet.
Jim has not asked anybody for an opinion.

SI has contracted a German company to manufacture their 2K (pocket sized)camera (a tiny camera head connected to a remote disk drive by long chord).
The financially strapped SI was bought off by an unknown buyer.
The German comapny that manufacture SI camera said they will show their ware in NAB.
At the same time, RED has announced a new pocket camera for NAB, under the name Scarlet.
So, put 2 and 2 together.


Whatever the OEM has been manufacturing will be showed in NAB and will be sold to public under name Scarlet.
(that might look like SI camera)
That is all. So, don't waste your time advising Jim what a pocket camera should look like.
(Or, If you have millions of dollars, you can get a camera made to your specifications. ).
That is my spculation.

 

[Bill Anderson]

joelnet:
We might equally ask how one makes a pro pocket camera that has a built in lens. Internal lens mechanisms don't make the camera any smaller. And since it is described as a professional camera we might safely assume that the sensor size will be significant even for this form factor. I'd love to see a set of mini lenses with mechanical focus barrel, and f/t stops. Remember the size of the lenses for 2 1/4 twin lens reflex cameras? not to mention the smallest 16mm format lenses. Beautiful movies are still being made on super 8- check out Guy Maddin's "The Heart Of The World". Removable lenses might also help keep the camera system viable as technology progresses. Every time I update my SLR, I don't throw away my lenses. I'm not gonna hold my breath, but it's neither impossible or impractical.

 

[Joel Kaye]

joelnet:
We might equally ask how one makes a pro pocket camera that has a built in lens.

There are a bunch of tiny, but high quality consumer cameras out there already. So I'm not real worried that they'll be able to come up with something small.

I guess you could come up with a set of tiny interchangeable lenses. But, it's de facto not going to take SLR lenses and be a pocket camera.

I'm as curious as anyone to see Scarlet (ok, not as curious as most of you) bit if it's got a raw workflow then they've really entered technogeekland. Technogeeks that travel a lot. I can see that. Throw it in your backpack, climb a mountain and get stunning wide angle stuff.

Pocket rangefinder cameras have always been good for that.

 

[JustinC]

I am shocked that people are still talking about what they want in Scarlet.
Jim has not asked anybody for an opinion.

So, don't waste your time advising Jim what a pocket camera should look like.

If you are shocked by people chatting about their wishes for a product on that product manufactures forum pages then you are shocked easily.

I've included the dictionary definition of the word forum for your reading.

I don't think that anybody here is advising Jim what a camera should be like, we are discussing what, as consumers, we would like in our ideal camera. Many would think that any product manufacturer would be well advised to allow such a discussion to happen and I commend RED for allowing and encouraging such a healthy forum on this website.

I can only hope that you dont ever start a camera company for the sake of your consumers.

forum -
3. an assembly, meeting place, television program, etc., for the discussion of questions of public interest.

 

[Andrew Madu]

I've included the dictionary definition of the word forum for your reading.

I wonder what a psychologist would make of all these threads with their differing ebbs and flows! :biggrin:

 

[JustinC]

I wonder what a psychologist would make of all these threads with their differing ebbs and flows! :biggrin:

Something related to playground experiences as a child I guess!

My excuse it that its all about killing time after a long day on set or in an edit.

 

[Bill Anderson]

Joelnet:
Who told you that scarlet should be designed to take SLR lenses? that's cookie.

I think our definition of a professional camera differs. There are pocket sized consumer cameras available, however, their lens constructions are flimsy, and far from "professional" quality; that is, the focus is uncertain, you take what you get, and so on. The quality, generally considered acceptable, relies mostly on depth of field from focal length/ tiny chip size ratio, rather than having an ability for critical focus- let alone manual focus. And that is one reason, among many, they are called CONSUMER. Making something small and making something small that can be considered professional are two different things.
OK, let's go over this one more time Scarlet: "POCKET PROFESSIONAL DIGITAL CINEMA CAMERA".
And yes, it is smaller than a bread bin, and no, you wouldn't put it in your mouth.

 

[Joel Kaye]

Joelnet:
Who told you that scarlet should be designed to take SLR lenses? that's cookie.

OK, let's go over this one more time Scarlet: "POCKET PROFESSIONAL DIGITAL CINEMA CAMERA".
And yes, it is smaller than a bread bin, and no, you wouldn't put it in your mouth.

I think some of the people on here seemed to be hoping for it take those kind of lenses. Many of the descriptions of what people want don't seem to fit into "pocket".

As far as the rest of your comment I agree. I don't think I ever asserted RED couldn't make a pocket professional camera. In fact, my description of what that would be is similar to yours.

I'm not convinced the other major manufacturers won't produce very high quality, tiny cameras though. I think RED's going to in for a serious run for it's money from Sony and Canon.

 

[Paul Ramsbottom]

My two-penneth

My two-penneth

I'm not sure that I'll be adding anything new to this thread at this point but here goes.

I nearly bought a Sony EX-1 but cancelled the order and will wait to see what NAB brings from the Red folks. I’ve also been tempted by the Z7 but put off by the cost of adding a good 35MM lens adapter and lenses.

Note, everybody’s needs are different, my wish-list was not written to provoke flames or even much debate, it’s just formulated based on the kind of work I do.

I suppose my first observation, made elsewhere in various ways, is that they will probably want to 'game-change' with this camera, e.g. go after the current portfolio of smaller 24p capable HD cameras (EX, HVX, V1, Z1, Z7) but not impinge on the USP of the Red One (especially as they have only shipped 750+ units as of writing).

I just spent several years filming around Asia with a HDR-FX1 and a HVR-A1U. Aside from the better low-light performance of the FX1, the A1U ultimately became my camera of choice, for one obvious reason - its small size.

I can get in and out of many situations with the A1U that a bigger camera would not permit. Remove the Mic, lens hood and hang it around your neck and you look just like any other tourist.

So, I am really excited by the 'pocket' nomenclature, very excited indeed. Even the compact nature of the EX isn't really discrete enough for me.

So... #1 'pocket' should really mean pocket. It should still be small with lens, onboard audio/mic, recording media etc. and hopefully it won't look like an alien ray gun. I’m not expecting it to fit in my shirt pocket but if I can hang the whole shebang unobtrusively under my arm, then I will be a very happy camper.

I guess to go after the HVX200 and the EX and all the other 1080 cams, 2K must be the differentiator. Leaving 4K for the Red One. 2K digital workflows are also more established / feasible for the majority of serious Indies, so there must be a competitive upgrade sweet-spot for them to go after (the marketing proposition is simple, ‘why pay for that 1080 video camera, when the same money will buy you true 2K digital cinema’).

I guess that makes my#2 = 2K +1080i/p with 4.2.2 color off a sensor that performs respectably in low light and is sized to deliver a cinematic style depth of focus. Others will want more color, non-rolling shutters and so on but those things don’t bother me much.

#3 Lots of talk about interchangeable manual lenses here but again that might be what ends up distinguishing the Scarlet from the Red One. What I really need is a reliable auto-focus lens with a true manual setting (ideally with a geared focus ring, not rubber). I'd be happy with a fixed lens that could deliver that. Oh, and let’s not forget a viewfinder that compares with, say, the one on the EX for some degree of on-board focus-assist.

When I travel, I do a lot of 'run and gun' work, so in addition to size it is imperative that I can fire the camera up in a heart-beat, so onboard audio (although maybe not a mic) is essential but, most important of all, is a VERY QUICK start and record time. If I'm belting along in a jeep and I suddenly see something interesting out of the window, I need that camera on and up and running in less than a second or two.

That makes my number #4 actually two things = Audio + fast start-up and record to inexpensive and readily available solid state media. No hard drives please (I work at altitude a lot and, AFAIK, only the Seagate EE25.2 is rated over 10K feet). Over/under-cranking and a timed still shot function for time-lapse would be good but their absence wouldn’t stop me buying.

#5 Under $5K for a camera that is ready to go (The least expensive Red One config that I priced was well over $25K by the time you added a battery/Charger, media caddy and the cheapest cine lens. Then there’s audio on top of that.

 

[Ethan Cooper]

I suppose my first observation, made elsewhere in various ways, is that they will probably want to 'game-change' with this camera, e.g. go after the current portfolio of smaller 24p capable HD cameras (EX, HVX, V1, Z1, Z7) but not impinge on the USP of the Red One (especially as they have only shipped 750+ units as of writing).

I just spent several years filming around Asia with a HDR-FX1 and a HVR-A1U. Aside from the better low-light performance of the FX1, the A1U ultimately became my camera of choice, for one obvious reason - its small size.

I can get in and out of many situations with the A1U that a bigger camera would not permit. Remove the Mic, lens hood and hang it around your neck and you look just like any other tourist.

So, I am really excited by the 'pocket' nomenclature, very excited indeed. Even the compact nature of the EX isn't really discrete enough for me.

So... #1 'pocket' should really mean pocket. It should still be small with lens, onboard audio/mic, recording media etc. and hopefully it won't look like an alien ray gun. I?m not expecting it to fit in my shirt pocket but if I can hang the whole shebang unobtrusively under my arm, then I will be a very happy camper.

I guess to go after the HVX200 and the EX and all the other 1080 cams, 2K must be the differentiator. Leaving 4K for the Red One. 2K digital workflows are also more established / feasible for the majority of serious Indies, so there must be a competitive upgrade sweet-spot for them to go after (the marketing proposition is simple, ?why pay for that 1080 video camera, when the same money will buy you true 2K digital cinema?).

I guess that makes my#2 = 2K +1080i/p with 4.2.2 color off a sensor that performs respectably in low light and is sized to deliver a cinematic style depth of focus. Others will want more color, non-rolling shutters and so on but those things don?t bother me much.

#3 Lots of talk about interchangeable manual lenses here but again that might be what ends up distinguishing the Scarlet from the Red One. What I really need is a reliable auto-focus lens with a true manual setting (ideally with a geared focus ring, not rubber). I'd be happy with a fixed lens that could deliver that. Oh, and let?s not forget a viewfinder that compares with, say, the one on the EX for some degree of on-board focus-assist.

When I travel, I do a lot of 'run and gun' work, so in addition to size it is imperative that I can fire the camera up in a heart-beat, so onboard audio (although maybe not a mic) is essential but, most important of all, is a VERY QUICK start and record time. If I'm belting along in a jeep and I suddenly see something interesting out of the window, I need that camera on and up and running in less than a second or two.

That makes my number #4 actually two things = Audio + fast start-up and record to inexpensive and readily available solid state media. No hard drives please (I work at altitude a lot and, AFAIK, only the Seagate EE25.2 is rated over 10K feet). Over/under-cranking and a timed still shot function for time-lapse would be good but their absence wouldn?t stop me buying.

#5 Under $5K for a camera that is ready to go (The least expensive Red One config that I priced was well over $25K by the time you added a battery/Charger, media caddy and the cheapest cine lens. Then there?s audio on top of that.

You sir have just stated everything that I feel this camera will be. Small, 2K, better than 4:2:0, and around $5,000.
I think those who are clamoring for the Red One at 1/4th the price are barking up the wrong tree.
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Marijuana test