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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Kinefinity in full atack mode

4K is a number. So is 3K, 6K or 8K.

And then there is aesthetics.

Which require utilised different modality of the mind than the one dealing with numbers.
And when that one dominates no one counts pixels.
 
Misha Engel said:
Yes it does big time, same as 6,5k..8k with vintage lenses.
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Just did a TVC recently shot on Helium and Kowas. Not the sharpest glass.
DoP didn't get the memo so seems like 100 or so of us on the set wasted time on suckage.
 
I worked on Grace and Frankie and those were some of the softest 4K images I've seen in a long time.
 
Jacek Zakowicz said:
If you have the lens side you have the camera side...
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Meaningless because they will license to lens manufacturers but not camera manufacturers. So to do it as a camera maker on a camera you do so at your own risk (a big one).
 
Yeah the terra 4K is too expensive especially when BM will drop the pocket 4K. Ok the terra outspecs the pocket 4K a tad. But not worth 4K more. Kinefinity should reconsider their pricing model. They should try to get to the Blackmagic pricing point.
 
This is more a MAVO 6k thread (FF and s35), it has enough bayer pixels to give you a true 4k RGB matrix at a starting price of $ 8k body only and a total package for $ 14k.

We have to wait and see how it performs in the field, but from specs alone the price look pretty descent.
 
Kinefinity just had a serious problem with a series of Terra4K ... There had been a lot of delays for a while ... and it's now worse ... We can say that they are victims of some success ... all the same ...
What I do not understand is; why add a camera (the Mavo) while their capacity in technical maintenance remains limited? ...

That said, in other proportions, it's a bit of what is happening right now with Red whose support is overloaded.
So what's going on? ... the hardware is evolving to be more reliable ... or not? and in the latter case, the after sales service can not manage the problems in time?

So what's going on? ...
 
Christophe Deshoux said:
Kinefinity just had a serious problem with a series of Terra4K ... There had been a lot of delays for a while ... and it's now worse ... We can say that they are victims of some success ... all the same ...
What I do not understand is; why add a camera (the Mavo) while their capacity in technical maintenance remains limited? ...

That said, in other proportions, it's a bit of what is happening right now with Red whose support is overloaded.
So what's going on? ... the hardware is evolving to be more reliable ... or not? and in the latter case, the after sales service can not manage the problems in time?

So what's going on? ...
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It might have to do something with the price and what you can deliver for that

Ready to shoot without lenses:
MAVO $ 14k
Gemini $ 40k
Alexa LF $ 90k
 
Savannah Miller said:
Is there anybody on the camera-side that uses E-mount or is it only lenses?

EF mount is mostly reverse-engineered as far as I know, but Sony gives documents if you license their tech.
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Sony won’t allow anyone to make an E mount camera.

Sony are happy for anyone to make an E mount lens.

JB
 
Joe Cage said:
Yeah the terra 4K is too expensive especially when BM will drop the pocket 4K. Ok the terra outspecs the pocket 4K a tad. But not worth 4K more. Kinefinity should reconsider their pricing model. They should try to get to the Blackmagic pricing point.
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Terra 4K is already cheaper than the URSA Mini 4.6K (or the RED Raven...), which is their real competitor? Rather than the BMPCC4K.
 
David Peterson said:
Terra 4K is already cheaper than the URSA Mini 4.6K (or the RED Raven...), which is their real competitor? Rather than the BMPCC4K.
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It depends. Terra 4K PRO pack is about the same price as the Ursa Mini Pro but lacks built-in ND filters, AES digital audio, and Prores 4:4:4 recording. If strictly looking at dynamic range and color, the Ursa Mini Pro is a big step above the Terra 4K images, and likely the new Pocket 4K too.

Kinefinity is getting more expensive, but they do seem to at least be innovating and doing things Blackmagic isn't which gives you more options on the low end which is good for everyone. But strictly in terms of image, I still don't think there's any other camera kit under $10K that comes close to Ursa Mini Pro images.
 
Yeah I am not seeing why the terra 4K is competition for the Ursa mini pro. In my eyes the competition for the terra 4K, is the pocket4K.(heck it even has the same sensor, in a even smaller body at 1/4th the price)
 
Joe Cage said:
Yeah I am not seeing why the terra 4K is competition for the Ursa mini pro. In my eyes the competition for the terra 4K, is the pocket4K.(heck it even has the same sensor, in a even smaller body at 1/4th the price)
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My guess is that terra will be phased out pretty soon in favor of the MAVO and leave the cheap 4k..4,6k to the blackmagics.
 
If the Mavo is the same sensor as the DJI X7, then it does look like a promising camera. I wonder what sensor is in the LF version? That looks really promising as well.

I still think for a 100% cinema use camera, the Ursa Mini is still a better image, but otherwise the Mavo does offer a lot in terms of low light and noise compared to the Ursa Mini. Size/weight/olpf and pro accessories is another huge selling point, too.

What's interesting to me is Blackmagic spent millions designing the 4.6K sensor, yet the camera is still priced so low. They must be planning to use the 4.6K sensor for a while. But in the future, I could see them eventually ditching fairchild and using Sony Sensors. Overall, it does seem the gap between more expensive cinema cameras and their lower-cost options is getting pretty small, and in some ways Kinefinity and BM are even innovating and providing features that other manufacturer's won't.
 
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I intercut a lot of 5K R3D and CDNG from a DJI X7, so I thought this was pretty interesting to see on Kinefinity's Website: "...MAVO can record cinema DNG now, and the compression ratio can be set to 3:1, 5:1, or 7:1". CDNG gets pretty huge when you're used to the compressibility of R3D! This or Apple ProResRAW... I'm curious!
 
MAVO LF $12.000 body only and $ 18.000 with a premium kit which also includes Movcam’s DarkTower DT2000 Wireless System.

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KineRAW 2.0 (CineformRAW) at the end of the year.
 
Misha Engel said:
It might have to do something with the price and what you can deliver for that

Ready to shoot without lenses:
MAVO $ 14k
Gemini $ 40k
Alexa LF $ 90k
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Tell me why this thread even exists on RED User and why Misha is pimping this brand so hard? If these asshats can reverse engineer and produce a shit version of a RED camera, then perhaps then can also copy and host their own MAVOUser.net

I don't get why the Mod's her are so accommodating with this spamming of knock-off products. My vote is to have these MAVO promotions, and their authors, fuck off this site. I have a substantial investment in RED products and see no value in having this forum assist Mandarin 'copy watch' companies.

Perhaps Trump can get one thing right and slap a 100% Tariff on these companies who clearly lift American IP then sell into our markets. Keep in mind that China limits the quantity of Hollywood movies to like 10 per year or some shit. The worlds biggest market for the products everyone on this forum makes a living at is one of the most restrictive. Yet we allow this MAVO shit to happen. I can't stand Trump . . . but it's shit like this that gets idiots like him elected.


Edit: "34 foreign films are allowed to be released in China each year" As in from any other country. Not seeing a limit to what Walmart can bring into small town America to wipe out Main Street businesses
 
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Zeb B said:
...can reverse engineer and produce a shit version of a RED camera, then perhaps a limit to what Walmart can bring into small town America to wipe out Main Street businesses
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...and all the while with the assistance of their entire government. Goddamned right Zeb, but Trump will be no help. All they have to do is tell him he can build a hotel with Chinese kickbacks and compliment his suit and he'll be eating out of the palm of their hand.
 
Zeb B said:
Tell me why this thread even exists on RED User and why Misha is pimping this brand so hard? If these asshats can reverse engineer and produce a shit version of a RED camera, then perhaps then can also copy and host their own MAVOUser.net
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There is nothing "reverse engineered" here (which would be legal to do anyway https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_engineering#Legality).

And Kinefinity is not at all shit, I'd happily shoot with a Kinefinity camera, I've often considered buying one.

As for why discuss it here, why not? Am sure it is of interest to many cameraman here (and others from related fields, like me in the sound department), just like we also see cameras like say the Panasonic GH5S or the new BMPCC4K get discussed a lot.
 
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