Interested in 4K LUT Box ?

[Danko Dolch]

Hi Mike,

Eizo is the only thing that can be looked at in this regard - as ENTRY level - the FSI CM LCD series is better than the Eizo LCDs. (IIRC) NEC and HP have 3x3 internal LUTs, absolutely useless. HP DC uniformity issues are an absolute no go.

Advantage of an external LUT box is that u can re-use on any screen and usually has larger LUT size than built-in screens. Also - and this depends on the product - some devices introduce signal distortion when the LUT is processed, Eizo does this to a small degree, the eeColor for example is very, very clean.

u have a dE report u can share ? how many points did u run in the val profile ?

For sure FSI has some higher quality offers ;-) But with the EIZOS - a highend Monitor for photo & print sould do fine also if some video related issues are solved - and it seems EIZO has done a nice job on that.
Havn't had a deeper sook to the NEC and HP DC for some time - interesting if they arn't on top with the EIZOS...

External LUT box has some benefits but also some drawbacks... for smaller systems I like the idea of an monitor with integrated LUT and a display menue that locks out all the settings after calibration.
(If you come back to a NLE suite and think if maybe someone changed the display settings and doesn't knew about the LUT box...)

Internal LUT box also can be much much cheaper because of the complete integration into the main component. So if I take a look at the crystal ball - integrated 3D LUT's will become the default very soon. (The same thins as for class 1 reference monitors that all come with their own integrated LUT.)

"u have a dE report u can share ? how many points did u run in the val profile ?"
--> Currently I only had a quick and dirty calibration session - ethernet port worked fine (manual and internet telling to use wifi instead). After some issues in the first run I now have isf prof profile 1 calibrated to a REC.709 gamma 2.4 target and it matches the TVLOGIC XVM-325W - Calman reported no huge delta E's after the run...

But before I post something here I'll double check all settings and do a dedicated 4000 points measument to confirm it... ;-) (hope I find teh time - next thing on the to do list is checking DCI P3...)

 

[Mike Nagel]

Danko, sounds good !

 

[Mike Nagel]

alright, somebody is kicking off this round... ;-)

Fujifilm will be releasing a 4K LUT box in the near future...

HDMI in/out only

1.4b

 

[Stacey Spears]

Advantage of an external LUT box is that u can re-use on any screen and usually has larger LUT size than built-in screens. Also - and this depends on the product - some devices introduce signal distortion when the LUT is processed, Eizo does this to a small degree, the eeColor for example is very, very clean.

Some boxes, like AJA, also expand the range and clip levels. The eeColor does have one issue and that is the LUT does not cover the entire range. I think (speaking in 8-bit only for simplicity) does not work on bit levels 252 and above.

1.4b

Someone mentioned at Cine Gear that the final unit should support HDMI 2.0 w/ HDCP 2.2. W/o HDCP 2.2 a 4k LUT box (HDMI only) would be useless. Studios have mandated HDCP 2.2 is mandatory, which is why up until now Netflix UHD has only been built into TVs. NVIDIA Shield is the first product to support Netflix UHD outside of a display.

If anyone is looking for a 3D LUT box for the home, the Prisma is a great choice. It is a 17x17x17 and supports up to 1080p. eeColor claims 65 points, but the FPGA it has does not have the memory for true 65-points, but is a nice box too except for the issue I mentioned above. That and it is not 100% reliable. Lumagen is another great option, but is a lot more expensive. The FPGA in the Lumagen is probably more expensive than the Prisma selling price.

There is another consumer 3D LUT option that will be announced in September / October for the consumer space that I hope to demo at the Home Theater Forum event that will excite a lot of people.

For SDR 17x17x17 would be minimum. For HDR, 32x32x32 would be minimum, assuming PQ is the EOTF. I would also recommend a 1D LUT between the 3D LUT and display for a calibration LUT, which will improve gamma and grayscale. Most beneficial if using BT.1886 as the gamma.

 

[Mike Nagel]

Some boxes, like AJA, also expand the range and clip levels. The eeColor does have one issue and that is the LUT does not cover the entire range. I think (speaking in 8-bit only for simplicity) does not work on bit levels 252 and above.

Someone mentioned at Cine Gear that the final unit should support HDMI 2.0 w/ HDCP 2.2. W/o HDCP 2.2 a 4k LUT box (HDMI only) would be useless.

re eeColor: it's 254 and up (8-bit)

re Fujifilm: I've asked the rep at Cinegear 5 times, he confirmed HDMI 1.4b. He stated pricing as one of the reasons... but one can only hope that HDMI 2.0 makes it into the final unit.... ;-)

 

[Stacey Spears]

re eeColor: it's 254 and up (8-bit)

It fully supports up to 254 as in it does not clip, but values 252-254 are not corrected by the LUT. They are simply passed through as is.

Wonder what they plan to do with the box if it is only HDMI 1.4. It won't work with the NVIDIA Shield for Netflix since that requires HDCP 2.2. Maybe you can do HDMI 1.4 w/ HDCP 2.2? One of the reasons HDMI is dropping version number is that most features are optional and saying you support HDMI n.n means very little. They want specific features called out.

 

[Steve Shaw]

With Full Range signals you can use the 1D input/output LUT capability of the eeColor to deal with the final cube step not being processed through the LUT due to the final point being fixed.

The Prisma is also a good HD LUT box to look at, and is also LightSpace CMS integrated (integration is just being finalised as I write this).

The AJA limits a TV Legal signal path to 'legal' levels... for good reason.
But when used in a data level signal path the full signal is passed through.

4K LUT boxes are an interesting question - and we are working with a couple of manufacturers on new developments.
But noting is yet available, other than the rather expensive Pluto.

Steve

 

[Arthur To]

As 4K monitors take flight, I'm sure I'll eventually be running 16 of these 4K lut boxes on my cart soon enough