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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

IMS news please

ARRI said that "80% of the light passes straight up" so thre is also some light loss.

viewfinder_drawing.jpg


1. Mirror Shutter
The light from the taking lens is reflected up by a spinning half moon shaped mirror. Since this mirror rotates, half the time the light is projected onto the film, the other half up into the viewfinder. While the light is reflected up, the mirror covers the film, which is transported to the next frame. Since this mirror's function is both reflecting and shuttering light, it is known as a "mirror shutter".

2. Fiber Optic Screen
The light is projected onto a screen (a fiber optic screen, in case of the 416), which acts as a rear projection screen.

3. Field Lens
The field lens (named as such because located close to the image field) refracts the light into the entrance pupil of the primary viewfinder lens and the video assist lens.

4. Video Assist Beam Splitter
80% of the light passes straight up, while 20% is reflected to the side and projected through the video assist optics (not pictured) onto the video assist CCD sensor.

5. Supplementary Lens

6. Protective Glass
An optically clear glass plate on the top surface of the camera body protects the components underneath from dirt contamination.

7. Supplementary Lens

8. Partial Mirror
The light from the fiber optic screen is reflected into the viewfinder.
At the same time, the light from the ARRIGLOW LEDs above is let through. This light is then
reflected off the frame line markings on the fiber optic screen, providing illuminated frame lines when needed.

9. 90 Degree Prism

10. Primary Lens
Picks up the image from the fiber optic screen.

11. Mirro

12. Pechan Prism
Automatically keeps the image upright when the viewfinder is rotated.
Also allows for manual image rotation.

13. Secondary Lens
Provides the image for the eyepiece.

14. Mirror

15. Protective Glass
Located at the mechanical interface to the eyepiece or eyepiece extension, the protective glass prevents dust from getting into the viewfinder optics.

16. Eyepiece
 
Akube said:
IMS is dead to me.
Click to expand...

For me not at all.

I'm still very comfortably moving between PL and many still lens brands in seconds :sorcerer: .
 
Me either. I want to go between my canon F lenses and my Red 18-50.

I'm in till the end.
 
The Third Man said:
How do you know?

Still has to be made.

Btw, I do not know anything how does P+S Technik viewfinder work.

Here is the link How Does an Optical Viewfinder Work? by ARRI.
Click to expand...

The P&S viewfinder is a great product. It will be based on the existing viewfinder they build for the SI 2K camera. I talked to P&S about it and they told me that it works with a 50/50 beamsplitter that will reduce the amount of light reaching the sensor by half. It´s basically the same way a video tap works. If you have enough light this is no problem. But indoor and night shooting will definetly be compromised by that fact. I would love to have an optical viewfinder and was hoping the P&S version could be a solution for me. But I don´t want to be limited to 160 ASA because I´m a big fan of shooting with available light. I will take a close look at it anyway and still feel very tempted by the idea and I will definetly buy the IMS once the guarrantee issues have been solved.
 
The Third Man said:
ARRI said that "80% of the light passes straight up" so thre is also some light loss.
Click to expand...

That´s right, but the lightloss you are talking about only concerns the image in the viewfinder. With the Arri viewfinder you are talking about the sensor or negative still gets 100% of the light because the system works with a rotating mirror. The P&S viewfinder has no rotating mirror but works with a beamsplitter between the lens and the sensor that makes you loose one stop and leaves you with 160 ASA.
 
If IMS for RED 'Get through' RED warranty issue and P+S Technik could deliver on time the optical viewfinder then RED would be only one digital acquisition system with option of both viewfinders, optical and electronic.

Then for available light shots you could use EVF and for daylight shots OVF.

Amazing.
 
Is there any new concerning this affair? Any hope by the magic date of 13th, we could also have good news on this side?

Sorry for my ignorance but what other option i have if i want to use my canon EF L lens, Contax Carl Zeiss ? I guess i could for sure forget using my much loved Carl Zeiss CFE lens from my Hasselblad ...?

Please, would someone be kind enought to inform me here or privately ?

Many Thanks for your help

vincent*
 
You can use the Hasselblad CFE's with a Nikon adapter,there are lots available,some better than others,I use the Novoflex one.The IMS is obviously a much better solution if the problems can be solved.
I've given up on the IMS for the moment and decided to go the PL cine lens route,I'll look at the whole thing again if the issues get worked out.
Tom.
 
viny said:
Is there any new concerning this affair? Any hope by the magic date of 13th, we could also have good news on this side?

Sorry for my ignorance but what other option i have if i want to use my canon EF L lens, Contax Carl Zeiss ? I guess i could for sure forget using my much loved Carl Zeiss CFE lens from my Hasselblad ...?

Please, would someone be kind enought to inform me here or privately ?

Many Thanks for your help

vincent*
Click to expand...

Hey Vincent, we have arranged to meet with this issue in the new year, there will not be any news regarding this before that time.
 
Viny,

one possible solution for you,would be to get a dumb Cannon mount.I think you can get a Contax to Cannon adapter,and you can certainly get a Hasselblad to Cannon. Not as good as the IMS,but it might be a reasonable temporary way to go.
Tom.
 
Thanks Jarret. Looking forward , i appreciate Red is watching and listening...

vincent*
 
Thanks Thomas. I own one of this contax to cannon adapter... What is the dumb cannon mount you was refering? Will not have focus problem if i go that way?

I guess one reason also why we can't have this IMS concern solved is that Red is maybe because Red is developping is own set of prime lens?
 
Thomas Dobbie said:
one possible solution for you,would be to get a dumb Cannon mount
Click to expand...

Good in theory, but Andy (the only one planning on delivering a dumb Canon mount) is not yet delivering (nor is his mount yet o.k.d by RED, though it looks promising). And Birger is only offering the electronic mount for about 1200 bucks - and is delivering in low numbers. No one knows when you will get a mount if you order one today.

Right now the only solution is to get a Nikon mount and some Nikon lenses, and just touch those lovely Contax primes once in a while, while chanting "soon, my dear ones, soon I will get to shoot 4k with you".
 
Hi Vincent,
No there are no focus problems.
this thread should give you some useful information.
http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=17454
The mount hasn't got the Red blessing yet,but it looks hopeful.
The only other way is the Birger mount,which I believe is now shipping,but as I understand it,only has a qualified blessing from Red.
Other than that you could always use your Hasselblad CFE's with an adapter and the Red Nikon mount,which is completely safe,warranty wise.
BTW, I've found that some of the CFE's have heavy breathing and they're slow.I have a large collection of them and thought they would be great on the Red,but interestingly they don't seem to perform very well as cine lenses. You don't always get what you expect. My CFE's look fantastic when I shoot with the Phase One P45+,which is currently the highest res digital back shipping,and yet they're not very impressive on the Red. Some still lenses are superb and perfectly useable,others,that you would expect to perform don't,you have to experiment a lot. I need something that's a bit more predictable,which is why I'm going the Pl Cine route.I'm just about to finalise a deal on a complete set of Leica lenses,converted by Van Deimen.
Take a look at the various lens test's posted by Sanjin,he is a real enthusiast (and I mean that in the kindest way)and is extremely
knowledgeable about what still lenses work well with the Red.
This is only my subjective opinion,many will disagree,you have to make your own decision depending on your circumstances.
Hope this helps.
Tom.
 
Martin,
I'm not in any way questioning the quality of the Contax lenses,but has anyone tried them on the Red,I only ask because of my experience with the Zeiss/Hasselblad CF's. I'm aware that they used Hasselblad lenses for the Imax sequences on the Dark Knight,
and I know of one commercials director here in London,who used to use them with 35mm film,but the Red doesn't always behave the way you might predict,it's quite a different beast.
Interested to know if anyone else has has similar experience,perhaps Sanjin,you can give your opinion.
Tom.
 
Thomas, do you think the poor performance of the Hasselblad CFE lens could be a mount issue not something to do with the Red?

Thanks anyway for your answer, you are lucky if you could get this set of Leica lens.. Mum... The noctilux will be great for the evening night shoot i have to do.

I'm not attracted by zoom, but mainly set up most of my cinematography around 5 or 6 lens basicelly but anyone has tried to compare the Red zoom with with Canon L lens or Nikkon equivalent? Using the IMS or BIGGER mount...

Once again thanks!

v*
 
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