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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

If you use a DSMC...

JimmyC said:
Isn't that encouraging piracy? Inventing a fancy name for taking a camera to the theater?

Seriously though, it is a worry that someone could sneak such a small camera, like scarlet, with so much resolution into the cinema ...

"Excuse me sir? Is that a Monstro in your pocket?"

:D

Jim
Click to expand...

Realistically, in future they will have to resort to scanners to detect equipment and put them in a locker until you reclaim it, and optical/timing tricks to degrade pirated footage. I posted some techniques for this over at dvinfo to talk about it, but as usual that crowd is pretty inept to this level.

I worry more that I might forget I am carrying a pocket camera, and the theatre wants to compensate it. As it is, I forget to turn my mobile off until I am in there, and they watch to see if you are doing something.
 
Jannard said:
... does that make you a "cinemaphotographer"?

Jim

(courtesy of Jarred)
Click to expand...

Depends on how the DSMC is setup and how you use it. If you use it like a video camera then not really, maybe a videophotographer, but with the lens and controls to home the best out of it, then yes. That level of control makes it like a DLSR flavour. Interchangeable lens increases this, as does frame and attachments.

But ergonomic design of the control mechanism is very important, and tricky. Another area is designing the camera so that less attachments and interfacing is needed. For instance, which filters are not needed for a camera with enough latitude, bit depth and accuracy. I know only one, or maybe two, companies that have announced such sensor technology. I have considered many of these things previously. It looks like the new camera is approaching this, could the scarlets be made a bit more stylish with simpler lines?

Red has the opportunity to change the way filming is done, I don't think SI is considering the depth of these things. It is possible for you to get small cameras that directly competes with a cinema camera.
 
Jannard said:
... does that make you a "cinemaphotographer"?

Jim

(courtesy of Jarred)
Click to expand...

Who cares? Me not. Good footage makes you a "cinemaphotographer". So let say that other people tells you that you are cinematographer :)
First wooden cameras were capable of both taking stills and movin picture too. :)

And some cinematographers used no camera but they only scratched emulsion on every frame to create footage - and it was nice :w00t:
And now they use computers for creating whole feature.
 
Jannard said:
Let me re-type that...

Cinemaphotographer® :-)

Jim
Click to expand...

Jim,

sure, when you point your photo camera towards a cinema it makes you always a cinemaphotographer, isn't it?

I guess its giving the photographer the chance to shoot their models in action and select the best frame, and not - as usual - the best photo from a 6fps or the like burst shooting.

If that makes them better photographers - I don't think so. Maybe it gets easier to catch the best moment, but - luckily - the knowledge to style the image using lighting, setting, a good hand, keeps the same - and the real challenge.

Axel
 
Jannard said:
... does that make you a "cinemaphotographer"?

Jim

(courtesy of Jarred)
Click to expand...

Short Answer, No.

Long answer, Still No.

You can capture an amazing moment on a cheap camcorder that will last as an iconic video for decades. You can do the same on a R1, Scarlet, Epic or DSMC. The picture quality does not matter, just the quality of the 'moment' captured. If the moon landing had been shot in colour, would the original B&W be any less emotive and iconic?

To capture an amazing moment twice, is luck.

To get it right every time would take a true professional, a cinemaphotographer. Someone who has the knowledge, skill and ability to get their desired shot time after time.

Owning a DSMC does not make you a professional photograper either. Just a lucky bugger with more money than me ;-)
 
KETCH ROSSI said:
I think will make me a better story teller as I'll be able to tell my stories with a better tool, but will not surely make any one a Cinematographer...unless it is already one!!

ciao
Click to expand...

Only a pencil will make you a better storyteller if anything.
Books make you a better storyteller, for sure. Mostly books about dramatic or epical writing.
Only a driving licenses will make you a better driver, not your car will.
 
I think JimmyC had is closest, but not quite... A Cinemaphotographer is that used-car salesman that hangs around outside movie theaters, by the rear entrance with his Nikon camera around his neck, waiting for the door to open so he can catch a quick shot of the inside of the movie theater. Some people snap young girls... other's snap crowded movie theaters... Not that there is anything wrong with that.

I suppose you could also give the on-set photographer the title of "cinemaphotographer", but that's not nearly as entertaining to imagine.

On the other hand, the Photocinematographer, man, whatever happened to those guys. Remember the days of film-strips in church and school. Feed the roll of film into the projector, load the cassette tape into the player, and wait for 'beep' to advance to the next frame... A real, lost art, the Photocinematographer!

Or perhaps the Photocinematographer is the guy shooting the BTS video of the Cinemaphotographer on set. Ironically, the DSMC would be used by both of them.
 
snuftr said:
Only a pencil will make you a better storyteller if anything.
Books make you a better storyteller, for sure. Mostly books about dramatic or epical writing.
Only a driving licenses will make you a better driver, not your car will.
Click to expand...

:) :)

A pencil will make you as good as a Storyteller as you already are, you can have as many pencils as you wish, but if you don't have as tory to write and know how to write one, well then the pencil has no much use at all.


Reading is no doubt a good thing, for any!!


There are too many people with driver licenses that definitely fail short from been a good driver, so I guess having a driver license will not make you a better driver either.



For me, a good tool will always help be a better craftsman, no matter the craft!!

For me RED is doing just that, producing better tools for the craft, which in turn in the hands of those that already have a good grip and knowledge of the craft, will be helped by such a tools to make a better product, as we are talking about image quality I think RED has already proven that they can offer that, and as far as been a better tool, they also prove that, in both workflows in production and post production, now as far as what I can do with... well you'll have to just look at what I do and be your own judge of that.


ciao
 
KETCH ROSSI said:
:) :)

A pencil will make you as good as a Storyteller as you already are, you can have as many pencils as you wish, but if you don't have as tory to write and know how to write one, well then the pencil has no much use at all.


There are too many people with driver licenses that definitely fail short from been a good driver, so I guess having a driver license will not make you a better driver either.
Click to expand...

I agree that there are a lot of people not driving good but I think it's better for them having a licence than not having one. That was what I wanted to say.

I think you didn't understand what I wanted to say. A camera is not a tool for storytelling. I agree that it supports you telling a story in a movie-way. But you can also (if you e.g. don't have the financial possibilities) write a book to tell a story.
I don't know wich cinematographer / director / filmmaker invented the term "storytelling" but I know Robert Mckee does use this term. So I assume him beeing the inventor.
Many people in these forums refer to this term as being the only sence of a camera to tell stories.
A camera is a tool to capture a moment visually (and the sound of this moment in some cases). A camera won't tell you: "It would be better If you choose another first plot point" or "Your character does not develop during this film" or "The ending is not clear". A tool that would tell you that (will never exist hopefully , but...) would be some kind of writing-roboter or program.
 
I'm a Storyteller,

I tell my stories via the moving images of Cinematography and the Still images of Photography, but before all I do write and therefor I tell my stories via the use of words, written in a way I can.

A synopsis, a Treatment, a Script, a book, all of this fall in to terms of what I do, but the Camera, any camera it is by nature a tool for storytelling, but then again this might just be my way of seen things.

ciao
 
mail4joeg said:
"A camera is not a tool for storytelling."

What?

What is it you do?
Click to expand...

I try to write my films first and then try to film them - yes with a camera - but I know the story before I direct my film. A camera is not telling a story (except Jim concealed that it has a talking unit) and even not a tool for doing so. Story telling is something you need a brain for. Jim announced the new cameras to have a "brain" but this is not what I mean ;).
A camera captures a moment. Nothing else.

A tool for storytelling is for me the knowledge about dramatic (film-) writing or epical writing and the knowledge a writer gathers through his life including his/her belief, sexuality, persons he met, books he read, stories he has been told and a lot more.
Storytelling is also not limited to film. There are books, theater plays, stories told in pictures, stories that are spoken and a lot more.

A camera is in fact a tool that supports you telling a story (when this story is told by film of course) by simply capturing a moment but not a "tool for storytelling". What I'm sometimes hearing in these forums sounds like "Oh my god, I need to get this awesome camera, otherwise I can not tell a story." This simply sounds to me like a cheap excuse for "I would like so much to play with the buttons on Scarlet."
Scarlet will surely not revolutionize storytelling, it will make film-storytelling cheaper. That means that there will be more stories. This means that we will have a lot to do to seperate the good stories from the bad stories.

You won't get a great filmer by simly using a camera. (Except you are a cinema(photo)grapher.)

Simplified: Learn how to tell a story (for your requirements), then try to get the tools that are supporting you / that are needed to tell this story. Not inreverse.

Does this sound a little bit more logical to you?
 
Yep.

Yep.

And a time traveler.
 
I'm a Lightpainter with a story...
 
Photographers have always been cinematographers, just at a very low fps....

Graeme
 
I'm looking forwards to seeing what photographers can do as we remove the fps barrier from them...

Graeme
 
Graeme Nattress said:
I'm looking forwards to seeing what photographers can do as we remove the fps barrier from them...

Graeme
Click to expand...

Me too. Scarlet FF35. Epic 645. Gimme gimme gimme!

As for the title, I'd say just this, "I'm the guy who shot that". Let the pictures speak and let the gear remove some more of the barriers to shooting what I want.
 
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