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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

HP 820 Tower - RED EDITION

Marc Fisher said:
That's a purely emotional decision... but not uncommon...
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I wouldn't call it purely emotional. Many of us made the switch to Mac because we where unhappy with the "computer experience" not just hardware. I will admit that Win7 is by far the best version of Windows to date, but I still find it cumbersom and clunky to work with. I just flat out prefer working in an OSX environment.
 
Jarred Land said:
I am starting to realize that Apple has a new place.. a very good place, handeling the majority of our non-professional daily tasks like email etc. That is the market they have switched over to go after, and there is no problem with that. I still use apple stuff for the light stuff.. it is much, much better at that than windows. But the heavy stuff.. you can't even compare the 2 anymore.

And remember we have ADOBE that works on both platforms seamlessly. .. a company that is not sitting still watching the grass grow. They have been killing it lately. All of their products are now better than Apple's professional software products. Hell.. don't listen to me.. just look around. The mighty mighty Final Cut Pro User group CHANGED ITS NAME @#!@#!# !! to the Creative Pro User Group.. and is now sponsored by ADOBE. Enough said.

http://www.studiodaily.com/2012/01/fcpug-changes-name-to-creative-pro-users-group/
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I wasn't aware of that. Hilarious!!!

Right after Apple's infamous NAB FCPX announcement, I purchased Adobe on Win7, and haven't shed a tear for the death of FCP since.

My old Mac Pro runs Logic Pro just fine, and that will end up as it's only use.

I was a developer for Apple starting with the Macintosh - so something had to really change to turn me against Apple.

If you know how to accessorize it, is so much easier to use than OSX, and it's great being able to use any video card you want today, instead of years in the future when it finally gets 'released' for Apple.

RIP Apple - which is really an IOS company now.

BTW - great looking screamer box you've come up with - congrats!!!
 
Some here are saying you can't edit 4K R3D on a Mac. Not true. I can edit 4K and 5K R3D's in Premiere Pro CS6 on my 2011 17" Macbook Pro, without a Rocket. Add a Rocket and it would be even better. Transcode to ProRes or DNxHD and it will also be better.

And I have the new Retina MBP on the way and it will have even better performance. And the newest Mac Pros are better performance than that even. So saying Macs can't handle what we throw at them isn't true.

Will the new breed of Windows towers outperform the newest Mac Pros? Sure they will, but by how much? And how much do you need to spend to get that performance? $10,000 is a lot of money, and I'm sure that's not with everything everyone would want in them, so you're likely spending quite a bit more than $10,000. I think, looking at that kind of expense, it's worth waiting to see what Apple does next year.

Clearly the rants and complaints from pros aren't falling on deaf ears over at Apple. They've done a lot in the past year to add pro-oriented features requested by pros to FCPX with more announced for later this year. They may not be telling us what they're going to do (I don't expect them to as it's a strategic business matter that is better left secret from competition), but it doesn't mean they're not listening or that they're not going to do something. If Apple was going to kill off the Mac Pro they would have done it already. This can only mean that they've got something very substantial in the works, and that's worth the wait in my opinion.

The desire to stick with OS X isn't just a stability or performance matter. It's also a user experience and usability matter. It's much easier to work with OS X than any version of Windows. Not even thinking about possible crashes or a computer/OS that begins to crawl after it's been used for a year, I just don't like using Windows.
 
RED trying to move me to a PC is like the tail wagging this dog. No thanks. Movie cameras don't determine my work habits or lifestyle choices. I hope it never comes to a choice of who to support: RED or Apple?
 
Josh Beadle said:
RED trying to move me to a PC is like the tail wagging this dog. No thanks. Movie cameras don't determine my work habits or lifestyle choices. I hope it never comes to a choice of who to support: RED or Apple?
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++1
 
Jarek Zabczynski said:
I wouldn't call it purely emotional. Many of us made the switch to Mac because we where unhappy with the "computer experience" not just hardware. I will admit that Win7 is by far the best version of Windows to date, but I still find it cumbersom and clunky to work with. I just flat out prefer working in an OSX environment.
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That is a completely subjective and largely emotional reason as well. Rationally speaking, Windows, OS X and the various Linux distros are extremely similar in terms of general interface, stability and functions. I slightly prefer Windows 7 because of its attention to detail - even after 3 years of usage I continue to find minor details that makes my work that much more efficient.

What is very different, though, is the Metro UI in Windows 8, which is quite incredible. Frankly, it makes both Windows 7 and OS X Lion look extremely cheesy and cumbersome. Metro won't be relevant for post-production till Windows 9 though (although Windows 8 in classic interface definitely will). But this is a discussion for another thread.

Coming back to the OS differences, we have established that they are very similar overall, and in areas where they are not third party software can fill those gaps. Yes, it is possible to make Windows look exactly like OS X. What is OS X's biggest disadvantage is its whole visual ecosystem - right from its archaic GDI to immature graphics drivers. I am not blaming Apple, NVIDIA and AMD are just as responsible, but it is how it is. It is a really slow solution and not particularly stable either.

On Windows, Windows Update takes care of everything - it automatically updates all drivers to latest WHQL certified specs. It just works. Yes, you have the choice to tinker with beta drivers and the like, but you don't have to. On OS X, I have been caught out countless times with things like an OS update breaking graphics (including the very last 10.7.4 update) or graphics driver crashing in usage. It's endlessly frustrating to the extent that I have vowed never to use a discrete graphics card with OS X ever again. Finally, in addition to being much more stable, NVIDIA graphics drivers are at least 2 years ahead on Windows, which also means much superior performance - in intensive benchmarks like gaming at upto 2 or 3 times. Not to mention you have the option to buy a graphics card 5 times faster than the fastest OS X GPU, and then chain several of them for scalability. The key word here is "choice" and it goes far, far beyond just graphics cards.

OS X is of course great for a variety of usage scenarios. A visual driven medium relying more extensively on graphics card by the day? Not so sure. At the end of the day, however, the user must be comfortable, so the only rationale I see is it being an emotional choice.
 
OK, Jeff.
Looking forward for your new benchmarks. This HP Z820 seems a really good workstation, except for that "design flaw" which leaves no room for another dual-slot GPU.
By the way, If I had to choose between the Quadro 6000 and GTX 690, I'd go for the Quadro simply because its driver enables 10-bit output.
 
Maybe we look at reducing demand instead of increasing supply: Design better compression algorithms that have less demand on computer resources. Kinda like developing cars that get 100mpg rather than "drill baby drill". We should not need PC's with their 14 card slots and gigaporn specs. The answer to everything is to think of a more efficient, sustainable way to proceed - not a more powerful one. Computing power produces size and heat - Epic et all does not need more raw power. It's needs ever improving math to reduce it's resource footprint in my workflow.
 
Josh Beadle said:
RED trying to move me to a PC is like the tail wagging this dog. No thanks. Movie cameras don't determine my work habits or lifestyle choices. I hope it never comes to a choice of who to support: RED or Apple?
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I don't think they are trying to push in either direction, nor will they stop supporting OSX. Just a cool thing to brag about. I'm sure if RED had an opportunity to do something like this with Apple they would be all over it.
 
Jarek Zabczynski said:
I don't think they are trying to push in either direction, nor will they stop supporting OSX. Just a cool thing to brag about. I'm sure if RED had an opportunity to do something like this with Apple they would be all over it.
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For those that need all the power they can get now they can't go wrong with this HP "RED" version. But I really hope by WWDC next year with the new Mac Pro launch, Red works on an absolute KILLER Macpro "Red". That would be my dream come true... Now, I hope the Redcine X team and ADOBE are hard at work with Retina display compatibility. My new Macbook Pro is due in the next 2 weeks, and would love to have Red taking a Rabbit out of the hat and take advantage of this beast! And thunderbolt!
 
Rotten Apples Are Not So Sweet

Rotten Apples Are Not So Sweet

Every so often, I go look at Macs and what's in them, then look at the price and walk away disgusted at how they package old gen slow components with their superior OS and pretend with blatantly false advertising that they contain the very best, latest generation, fastest components. If you want the job done sooner, rather than later, you have no choice but Windows, where you can get a box like this one that no Mac comes remotely close to in terms of speed and throughput in video and photo processing applications. Apple left the field a long time ago in favor of screwing the ignorant with slick marketing and packaging, instead of competing on capability, like oh, I don't know, say RED!:nonod:
 
George Petersen said:
Every so often, I go look at Macs and what's in them, then look at the price and walk away disgusted at how they package old gen slow components with their superior OS and pretend with blatantly false advertising that they contain the very best, latest generation, fastest components. If you want the job done sooner, rather than later, you have no choice but Windows, where you can get a box like this one that no Mac comes remotely close to in terms of speed and throughput in video and photo processing applications. Apple left the field a long time ago in favor of screwing the ignorant with slick marketing and packaging, instead of competing on capability, like oh, I don't know, say RED!:nonod:
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You're implying that Apple is using false advertising. Show me an ad where Apple says they're using "the very best, latest generation, fastest components" where it's not true. Show me a Windows computer that is the same price, build quality, features, and performance of the current Apple computers... note that it must be all 4 of those. Build quality is part of what you pay for. Performance isn't everything. What is old gen about the new Macbook Pros, regular and Rentina? There's features in those that you will not find in ANY other notebook computer. People always say Apple computers are overpriced, when in actuality they aren't. If they were, so many people wouldn't be buying them and switching to Apple and Mac OS X all the time.

And you're implying that anyone who has bought a Mac is ignorant. I take offense to that.

EDIT: There is no doubt that the RED/HP computer is a mean machine and one of the fastest desktop computers money can buy right now. I don't think anyone is denying that. And people will pay a pretty penny for it, a lot more than a Mac Pro, and kudos to all of you who buy it.
 
Mike Halper said:
EDIT: There is no doubt that the RED/HP computer is a mean machine and one of the fastest desktop computers money can buy right now. I don't think anyone is denying that. And people will pay a pretty penny for it, a lot more than a Mac Pro, and kudos to all of you who buy it.
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don't forget the HP price includes the RED ROCKET card and the RED STATIONS when you start comparing prices. The last Mac Pro Tower with quadro 4000 I purchased was well over $8000 without the Rocket.
 
Jarred Land said:
don't forget the HP price includes the RED ROCKET card and the RED STATIONS when you start comparing prices. The last Mac Pro Tower with quadro 4000 I purchased was well over $8000 without the Rocket.
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Yes, but that's not what it would cost now. No doubt, the price is a sweet deal with the Red Rocket in there. Like many others, if it was a Mac or ran a stable version of OS X that could be updated normally I'd buy it for sure. I'm definitely in envy that a Mac with these kinds of specs is not yet available, but there is hope. In a year if there's no new pro Mac then I may very well have to be a Windows user again, but I hope not.
 
Jarred Land said:
don't forget the HP price includes the RED ROCKET card and the RED STATIONS when you start comparing prices. The last Mac Pro Tower with quadro 4000 I purchased was well over $8000 without the Rocket.
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Yes you are right, but what about us who already have a RedRocket card??????
 
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