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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

HDRx footage...

Here's a question:

In stills mode will it shoot a 3 frame burst so that the (presumably optical flow blur in MNMB) has enough data to work with?

Does that mean HDRx Stills Mode (if you plan on such a mode) will be 4x data? 3x underexposures + 1x normal. That would sound like a very acceptable trade-off.
 
Thanks guys, keep the tests coming. It will be interesting to see how this evolves. I love how the first test you threw up here is a pan with a moving vehicle. If something's going to trip it up, that sure would. I think what I'm seeing are mostly typical motion blur characteristics. Looking forward to seeing a static shot that has moving objects in it. Could you give us some more details on the shot if you get a chance.

What lens (17-50?) - answered
Shutter Speed (180?)
Data Rate used to capture it?
Read/Reset time on this firmware version
 
Gavin Greenwalt said:
Here's a question:

In stills mode will it shoot a 3 frame burst so that the (presumably optical flow blur in MNMB) has enough data to work with?

Does that mean HDRx™ Stills Mode (if you plan on such a mode) will be 4x data? 3x underexposures + 1x normal.
Click to expand...

That's not how we will do it... full explanation when we are finished and before we ship.

I can say that a sensor with a lot of inherent DR (like MX) does not need 4 exposures for HDR.

Jim
 
Steve Sherrick said:
Thanks guys, keep the tests coming. It will be interesting to see how this evolves. I love how the first test you threw up here is a pan with a moving vehicle. If something's going to trip it up, that sure would. I think what I'm seeing are mostly typical motion blur characteristics. Looking forward to seeing a static shot that has moving objects in it. Could you give us some more details on the shot if you get a chance.

What lens (17-50?) - answered
Shutter Speed (180?)
Data Rate used to capture it?
Read/Reset time on this firmware version
Click to expand...

1/48th (180 degree) shutter
REDCODE 50 (just over 5:1 compression)
5ms read-reset.

Jim
 
Cane guy might not have know, but spider shirt guy had a momentary glance of 'I think that's cool but I don't wanna stare'.

What would be really nice is to see a split screen with & without HDR mode on. A point of reference would help.
 
Jannard said:
That's not how we will do it... full explanation when we are finished and before we ship.

I can say that a sensor with a lot of inherent DR (like MX) does not need 4 exposures for HDR.

Jim
Click to expand...

Sorry, I didn't mean 4 for bracketed exposures. In this case it would only be two luminance samples for HDR. The two extras would be temporal for determining velocity.
 
Ethan Cooper said:
Cane guy might not have know, but spider shirt guy had a momentary glance of 'I think that's cool but I don't wanna stare'.

What would be really nice is to see a split screen with & without HDR mode on. A point of reference would help.
Click to expand...


I agree!
 
Jannard said:
1/48th (180 degree) shutter
REDCODE 50 (about 5:1 compression)
5ms read-reset.

Jim
Click to expand...

Thought the read/reset looked a little different. Cool!

My guess is that Redcode 50 and Redcode 100 are going to be pretty popular choices. Good balance of quality and data efficiency.
 
Beautiful.

Is there a non-hdr shot for comparison?


Looks like I'm slow on the trigger and that question was asked already.
 
Firstly I have to say this looks awesome, the range of useable lighting values is amazing and from what I can see there is no unpleasant artifacting introduced by the process... But that's not to say there are no tell tale artifacts, and certainly there are ones that give us some clue as to what is going on the attached grab of frame 248 shows.

It does seem that there is some temporal averaging going on somewhere, to create the 'grey letters' shown up
here.

My prior guess was that they would use a second set of exposure values to modify the RAW data, averaged out to nearby pixels with major discrepancies discarded, and then debayer off the new 'constructed' raw image.

I don't know enough to say with any confidence something like that is going on here, but I'm more confident it's something like that now that I've seen this footage and frame 248...

Important to note also, I imagine HDR will have a pretty interesting effect on half caught flash frames/strobes based on what's happening in here... Again I imagine it would probably quite a good effect and definitely not a nasty artifact.

EDIT - Anyone looking at the screen grab, ignore all the JPEG/macro blocking artifacting etc, that's all been introduced by me/h.264 I'm sure, it's got nothing to do with the footage and nothing to do with my point
 

Attachments

  • Red HDR Frame.jpg
    Red HDR Frame.jpg
    89.5 KB · Views: 0
Steve Sherrick said:
Thought the read/reset looked a little different. Cool!

My guess is that Redcode 50 and Redcode 100 are going to be pretty popular choices. Good balance of quality and data efficiency.
Click to expand...

We will recommend REDCODE 55 as the best of all worlds. True 5:1 and reasonable data rate. I guess there will be some that opt for higher... that's why we enabled it.

Jim
 
It looks great. How many stops was EPIC set to for this shot?

And it seems exposure might have been set to the right, to make sure you got good exposure in the shadows. Is that why you left so much room on the left?

I can't wait to see something in mid-day sun!
 
This is the "Magic Mode". It has a characteristic we really like. It leaves a telltale sharper/blur combination in fast moving objects or a very fast pan. You actually see more of what's going on but still get the "feel" of motion blur. My bet is that many will prefer this mode to the "normalized" mode. We are really excited about it. For those that want to match a traditional look... we do that too. Keep in mind that in slow moving objects or pans... there isn't much difference to traditional motion blur (since there isn't much).

Jim
 
Jannard said:
We will recommend REDCODE 55 as the best of all worlds. True 5:1 and reasonable data rate. I guess there will be some that opt for higher... that's why we enabled it.

Jim
Click to expand...
Sure, some FX situations will clearly benefit from the extra data. Seems like for a lot of other things, there will be that sweetspot, ala REDCODE 55. From a data management perspective, that is pretty good news given the new SSD modules, the RED Station products, etc. Nice work!
 
Looks Brilliant. A little colour grading and that's got everything else i have seen beat as far as feel goes in my opinion.
 
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