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Handheld Smoothing in Post - Epic

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AndyRydzewski

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I'm hoping some of you out there can offer thoughts, experience, etc.

I am in prep for a feature in Barcelona. We have a great deal of shots following (and leading) actors through narrow streets in the heart of Barcelona. We are not able to have a steadicam as often as I might like, so the idea crossed my mind to shoot handheld (which much of the movie is) and then smooth it out in post. I thought with the huge image and resolution of the Epic, I might be able to get away with it. I've been warned, however, that this could create a decent amount of motion blur in the image.

Am I daft to even be considering such a plan? (If I'm a genius, feel free to tell me, as well.) Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

We are shooting 2.40:1 aspect ratio at 5K and finishing in 4K. Shooting on Master Primes.

- Andy

(as a side note, i'd just like to say that i'm very happy that i'm shooting through the month of october, so it will keep me busy while i wait for the big RED day, november 3rd)

P.S.- I went to Reducation this spring where I met an Epic owner (Tony Augustinack) and both he and another member of the Red family (Joseph Hutson) are coming out to Barcelona to be my camera crew. Red families travel the world!
 
Hi Andy,
Not sure I'd say you are a genius for thinking about using post motion stabilazation to smooth out handheld work. Its fairly common practice though, so that makes it a good idea. It does have some limitations though that you need to be aware of.
You need to shoot wider than your final frame so there is sufficient room in the frame for the stabilztion software to zoom into the frame. How much of that really depends on how sloppy/smooth your handheld work is and how good your Camera Ops are at holding frame. If your subject's head moves to the very edge of frame, for example, stabilizing the image becomes a real challenge.

Jerky left-right up-down moves will create distortion of the image that will look really weird when stabilized.

What you are wanting to do can be done well, but you really should take the camera out and do some tests until your camera ops have refined their technique to deliver images that have proper framing and the type of motion you want.
 
Thank you very much for the reply.

Unfortunately I'm having to do a lot of theorizing, as the camera won't be available to me for another week. As soon as it arrives, I will immediately get out there and start testing.

Assuming I can keep a relatively consistent (& wider) frame, would there be any ghosting/motion blurring in the image itself, as far as you (or anyone else) know?
Is there image jitter in the Epic that might be highlighted by smoothing in post?
 
AndyRydzewski said:
Unfortunately I'm having to do a lot of theorizing, as the camera won't be available to me for another week. As soon as it arrives, I will immediately get out there and start testing.

Assuming I can keep a relatively consistent (& wider) frame, would there be any ghosting/motion blurring in the image itself, as far as you (or anyone else) know?
Is there image jitter in the Epic that might be highlighted by smoothing in post?
Click to expand...

All the motion stablization software does is zoom into the image and pan it around keeping refrence points (tracking) it hooks onto somewhat stable in the frame. From an image manipulatoin perspective, the act of stabilizing usually only changes (reduces) the field of view by a sufficient amount to allow it to move the frame around holding tracking points steady. So its just punching in 10-20%. Red footage is very high resolution and can easily take that level of resizing without any problems at all. Motion blur is not changed.

Rolling shutter artifacting, which is reasonably minor in Epic, looks terrible on stabilized footage. So that is where your camera operators need to make sure to not move the camera in ways that create rolling sutter artifacting. If that happens, the post work gets much harder to hide the stabiliztion. On stabilized footage with rolling sutter artifacts, vertical lines suddenly distort in surreal ways. Psychadelic, but probaby not desired.
 
depends on what handle system you are using ie ET mantis, red clutch ect. i find the new red clutch to be superb especially with the light weight of the epic. you might not even need to stabilizing in post. but if you do the best things to do is not crop the image so much because naturally post is going to do that when you put the affect on your footage. the best program to use is the new FINAL CUT PRO X no importing exporting to AE. and you have to stay away from filters like promist softgrad softfocus. you want the image to be as clear as possible and if you want your footage to be softer add that effect in post
 
We will be using a handheld rig. Something akin to (though not exactly) "The Clutch." -- http://www.red.com/store/rail-components/product/clutch-shoulder-rig

Thanks for your answers so far. I need to hear other people's thoughts as I prepare to shoot this way. When it's a method I haven't used and I can't immediately test it, I -much like Ms. DuBoise- depend on the kindness of strangers.
 
Fast Shutter + Warp Stabilizer + Reel Smart Motion Blur = Pretty decent results... but that's a lot of work and processing and potential for glitching. It'll cost you more than a Steadicam for the day if you shoot more than a few seconds of footage.
 
Orrrrrr, a trade-off that might be worthwhile for this particular footage may be to get an Epic Canon mount and shoot Canon lenses. In the Joseph Hudson thread he mentioned he shot some footage using IS with the Canon setup and it was as smooth as a tripod shot. Just going by what others have posted so you might contact them for more information.
 
oh yea what Gavin said fast shutter speed and say away from filters that soften or blur your image
 
... the major traps are the bumps, resulting from uneasy moving being connected to the physical body and micro movement / shake from the steps ...
... resulting in massive directional blur / smear on single frames ...

... as well as the camera roll from the walk. (could be tracked and rendered away, but would potentially eat deep into the footage)


it may be a worthy idea to experiment with a much higher frame rate for those, clean the bumps and down convert to the end frame rate.

me thinks ... it depends a lot on the operators feel to balance the gear, the walk, the ability to keep a certain stabilizing tension in the body as well as the ability to quickly frame and reframe in such condition or .... (even flying blind, see below) ...

i love shooting handheld for it allowing me to create many angles and keep things fresh on a tight "window of opportunity" ..... and i love "fixed" motion control shots ... for their elegance and beauty .... i explored some techniques and came to satisfying results (... for short shots, that is).

I would not trust to get long walking follow shots that way - not without proper testing, training and bidding on repetition until it "sits". It is definitely tiresome.


here is how i approach it, ... i dont like the camera on the shoulder, but prefer to keep it in the hands in front of the body and control roll, tilt, shift a bit better ....
I often point and shot without a viewfinders visual feedback ... but working with the space and connect the cameras position to the estimated field of view .... keeping the eyes on the connection between object and lens .... "control glancing" the composition on the lcd ....


The EPIC with MPs (and stuff) is a little bit to heavy for the extrem version of this (tested) ... lol .... with the lighter Canon lenses it should work (not tested).

anyhow, just chiming in to the discussion .... :-)
 
gyro

gyro

You might try attaching a Kenyon gyro to the rig. I've found them to be pretty useful a few times.
 
i'm going to agree with gavin and detlev's wisdom on this. there will be some shots you can shoot totally smoothly with a shouldermount, and it would not be a huge deal to smooth them out a little bit (but once you start talking about a lot of shots, the processing gets to be less worth it). but if you're running around and going to be all bumpy... just find a steadicam, or a golf cart, or an atv... something. it would probably cost less to pay for a steadicam than to process the footage. and it would definitely give you better footage and less headache.

if you are shooting footage you know is going to be smoothed, including steadicam, shoot higher shutter speeds to reduce motion blur and at a little wider focal length or framing than what you want to finish. after smoothing (warp stabilizer or otherwise), use something to bring motion blur back to a normal level, if desired (reelsmart or otherwise), which can also help smooth the action out.
 
I use PRODAD's Mercalli
Unlike other software solutions, its processing is blazing fast, and the results look much more natural than the Adobe solution.
Still, you will have to minimize motion-blur in camera , as too much motion blur will make your stabilized footage look very weird and unnatural, and practically useless with any software stabilizer.
If you don't have much motion blur in your footage (from camera moves) than PRODAD's solution is a very effective one.

Cheers,
 
I've done a TON of post stabilization since production could not afford what we needed. I recommend the following so that in post you get better results:
1. faster shutter than normal
2. overcrank slightly...so for 30fps footage, I'll shoot a 48 or even 60...at 180 minimum shutter but usually faster....then, in post you have more to work with and wont get as much blur if and when the camera jumps up or down.....more info that you give the stabilization software to work with, then less blur & crop.

forgot....then slow the footage down after all this is done to match your timeline speed.
 
Good thread! I'll be giving some of these techniques a whirl once i get my Epic-X (shipped today!) on an upcoming horror short I'll be shooting. Essentially zero budget so steadicam won't be an option.

Cheers from Tokyo,

Paul :)
 
If you don't have the budget for a Steadicam op..

Try hiring an Easy rig.. Basically a vest you wear with an arm that goes over your shoulder with a piece of string on an shock absorber, Very effective and the look is amazing. You can further more reduce the wobble in post using Resolve for a fantastic result.
 
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