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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Guessing game...

While this is, of course, all just speculation... you have to think how it will all relate to pricing

I imagine that:

2/3" to s35 sensor = price increase
3K to 4K - maybe small/no price increase
fixed to non fixed = huge price increase for fixed scarlet lovers.... Either an investment in Canon glass and $2K for Canon mount... or investment in PL lenses.

side note - interesting that a move to Scarlet S35 might actually have Canon rubbing their hands together with the thought of all that Canon glass that will be needed... regardless of what Canon launches themselves.
 
Scarlet sounded fantastic to begin with. The things that would make me even more excited:

- 4K instead of 3K (on the 2/3 or slightly bigger sensor, I'm not interested in it being S35 size), assuming dynamic range isn't affected too much. I'd be fine with data rates being limited to as low as 48 fps (24 fps with HDRx) at 4K, as long as we still get 120 fps at 3K (windowed) and even higher at 2K (windowed). I'm most interested in 4K because it means larger stills.
- Was scarlet going to be 12 or 14 bit? I'd love to see it 16 bit just like Epic.

I was OK with the lens being fixed. If it is detached, that's cool, as long as the price doesn't skyrocket.

I truly am a scarlet junkie... Last night, I was dreaming of being at the Scarlet announcement. Scary!
 
Jay Birch said:
While this is, of course, all just speculation... you have to think how it will all relate to pricing

I imagine that:

2/3" to s35 sensor = price increase
3K to 4K - maybe small/no price increase
fixed to non fixed = huge price increase for fixed scarlet lovers.... Either an investment in Canon glass and $2K for Canon mount... or investment in PL lenses.

side note - interesting that a move to Scarlet S35 might actually have Canon rubbing their hands together with the thought of all that Canon glass that will be needed... regardless of what Canon launches themselves.
Click to expand...

I'm pulling for the fixed to get started. It really covers the full range of what I need. Less to carry around as I'm constantly moving around and have to be ready for shots. I'll buy whatever it ends up being. Just saying :)
 
My guess on the specs are: (as Red always claims that things change for the better)
- Either as stated before, but at a price no one expected so far (cheaper and thus in for an even larger public).
- Or (I'd put my money on this option) the specs have been upped.
I'd love Red to go for 4K on a 2/3'', 1'' or even 4/3'' sensor but I would be disappointed if it were to become a full frame sized sensor. I love the low light capabilities of a large size sensor, but hate the DOF it comes with. For what I'm planning to do with the camera I do hope they keep in line with the small sensor concept.

Then again I'm just one potential customer and if Red goes another route I'd be unhappy, but trust that that is the better route for Red.


All I know for a fact is that the original specs where (leaving the other Red products out) already the best for the near future, especially at this price. And any improvement on that will be much appreciated. :thumbsup:
 
There are so many ways this could all go, between the fixed 2/3, interchangeable 2/3, Scarlet s35, Epic S...?

The Epic S did drop off the road map so maybe the 2/3 interchangeable has given way to the "scarlet s35" or something like that.

Either way its gonna be a big day.
 
First off I can almost guarantee that Scarlet's sensor won't be S35. Even the "Scarlet S35" had to be upgraded to an "Epic-S" because Scarlet's body was too small.

In my opinion, if you want S35, get an Epic. Scarlet will be 2/3". MAYBE 16mm, but probably not. I agree with Kyle that it makes a lot of sense for it to be one interchangeable Scarlet in which the package comes with an electronic lens.
 
Jerrod Cordell said:
First off I can almost guarantee that Scarlet's sensor won't be S35. Even the "Scarlet S35" had to be upgraded to an "Epic-S" because Scarlet's body was too small.

In my opinion, if you want S35, get an Epic. Scarlet will be 2/3". MAYBE 16mm, but probably not. I agree with Kyle that it makes a lot of sense for it to be one interchangeable Scarlet in which the package comes with an electronic lens.
Click to expand...
But what about Jim's comment when asked about his new Epic-S-less roadmap? He replied, "The camera you want is later this year." The only other cameras listed were of larger-than-S35 formats. I suppose there could be another camera that was not mentioned on the roadmap, maybe one of the surprises.
 
Jerrod Cordell said:
First off I can almost guarantee that Scarlet's sensor won't be S35. Even the "Scarlet S35" had to be upgraded to an "Epic-S" because Scarlet's body was too small.
In my opinion, if you want S35, get an Epic. Scarlet will be 2/3". MAYBE 16mm, but probably not....
Click to expand...

I agree with everything you say..but when you read the "change post" by Jannard it sure sounds like something really did change big time...
but let's face it none of us have any idea what either Canon or Red have for Nov.3..those NDA's actually work...it's all secret for now.

Jannard said:
.....Because we think out loud, you are hearing from us early in the process. Because it is early, it can take some time before products are ready. In that time, the competitive landscape can change. Then we have to change.

Sometimes we are on a path, which we have announced (of course), and we find a better way. That = change.
Many times we announce a product, then realize that what seemed like a good idea... wasn't as good as we thought. Particularly when it doesn't measure up to "our new and better idea". That = change.

If you are a speedboat that never changes its course, you may as well be the ocean liner. Being fast, fluid and flexible means you have the ability to change. And we do.
Everything in life changes. We are just the only ones in this industry that seems to embrace the concept and be proud of it.

Don't let this approach frustrate you. Embrace it. In every instance I can think of, the change was better than the idea or product it replaced.......
Click to expand...
 
Lawrence Bansbach said:
But what about Jim's comment when asked about his new Epic-S-less roadmap? He replied, "The camera you want is later this year." The only other cameras listed were of larger-than-S35 formats. I suppose there could be another camera that was not mentioned on the roadmap, maybe one of the surprises.
Click to expand...

This is the strongest reason I think it'll be upgraded to S35. He wouldn't tell a potential customer that the S35 camera he/she was looking forward to so dearly is not on the roadmap because a 2/3 inch Scarlet is sufficient for them. Unless they'll be announcing the return of the S35 scarlet I don't see why they would be so cryptic about the Epic-S.
 
I am hoping it as been bumped up to 4K. I mainly want the increase in resolution for stills, as far as sensor size goes if it has gotten bigger GREAT. Although I would much rather have the price they announced before. if that means 2/3rds then give me 2/3rds and the SCARLET for less than 8K
 
Darius Lyles said:
I am hoping it as been bumped up to 4K. I mainly want the increase in resolution for stills, as far as sensor size goes if it has gotten bigger GREAT. Although I would much rather have the price they announced before. if that means 2/3rds then give me 2/3rds and the SCARLET for less than 8K
Click to expand...

Me too. Love to see a 4k Super16mm version for the interchangeable model. But 3k 2/3" would be quite satisfactory too.
 
Lawrence Bansbach said:
But what about Jim's comment when asked about his new Epic-S-less roadmap? He replied, "The camera you want is later this year." The only other cameras listed were of larger-than-S35 formats. I suppose there could be another camera that was not mentioned on the roadmap, maybe one of the surprises.
Click to expand...

The only reason I still doubt this is because for a working Scarlet to do well with the masses it'd have to be under $10,000. Epic-S was going to be at least $12,000-$14,000. Especially if it's upgraded to 4K, what's the difference between a Scarlet and a Red One, besides the fact that Scarlet would do way more and cost way less.

Now don't get me wrong. If on November 3rd Red did announce that they were releasing a 3K S35 Scarlet I would be ECSTATIC and throw every piece of plastic at Red until I got one. But it just doesn't seem realistic.

Besides Jim might have meant "You'll want Scarlet whether it's 2/3" or not because of so and so new features."
 
I guess a lot of it also depends on if 2/3" as a sensor size was ever a compromise or a calculated decision. A lot of the (vocal) market pine for S35, but Red will be well aware that the 2/3" market isn't small by any means. A lot of people feel that 2/3" will do if they can't afford S35, but other people love 2/3" or 16mm. I think it all comes down to Red's opinion, and original ideas about 2/3" as a sensor size.
 
Jerrod Cordell said:
The only reason I still doubt this is because for a working Scarlet to do well with the masses it'd have to be under $10,000. Epic-S was going to be at least $12,000-$14,000. Especially if it's upgraded to 4K, what's the difference between a Scarlet and a Red One, besides the fact that Scarlet would do way more and cost way less.
Click to expand...
I don't think they'd backtrack on resolution for an S35 sensor. From development done on the old Scarlet S35 and the Epic-S, I would think they would've amortized sensor and circuit board design costs. To redo all that for 4K would probably add to development costs and time. I suspect that the only way they'd do 4K is for a different sensor size -- S16 or micro-4/3.

Now don't get me wrong. If on November 3rd Red did announce that they were releasing a 3K S35 Scarlet I would be ECSTATIC and throw every piece of plastic at Red until I got one. But it just doesn't seem realistic.
Click to expand...
Given Jim's comments about 4K, I don't think that Red would ever do another maximally 3K sensor again.

Besides Jim might have meant "You'll want Scarlet whether it's 2/3" or not because of so and so new features."
Click to expand...
I don't think he'd do that. Some people want S35 and at least 4K, and Red had all but promised a lower-end S35 model. No matter how good a 2/3-inch Scarlet might be, it would not be interchangeable with an S35 camera.
 
Jerrod Cordell said:
First off I can almost guarantee that Scarlet's sensor won't be S35. Even the "Scarlet S35" had to be upgraded to an "Epic-S" because Scarlet's body was too small.

In my opinion, if you want S35, get an Epic. Scarlet will be 2/3". MAYBE 16mm, but probably not. I agree with Kyle that it makes a lot of sense for it to be one interchangeable Scarlet in which the package comes with an electronic lens.
Click to expand...

Jarred said the new Scarlet(s) among other thing will use the same mounts.
 
He said it can use the same mounts. With the interchangeable Scarlet it was originally like that. You can put a Canon mount on a Scarlet. The crop factor would be ridiculous but you can do it.

Jarred's post: "Scarlet is part of the DSMC program.. almost everything that works with EPIC will work with Scarlet. Batteries, media, mounts, etc. Even the base plates and QR platforms have been made to accept both cameras."
 
I hope the case they ship the scarlet with has enough room so I can carry the minimum configuration in one box, that is definitely something I would like to see (along with cut foam to fit it so you just pull out the scarlet turn it on and shoot). Not a big price item but I like only having to do one trip.
 
This game is fun... Maybe they combined the fixed and interchangeable to be one 2/3 system with a removable zoom lens and faster mini primes as an option. I would bet to say that there will be another model with a bigger sensor, the revival of the s35 scarlet. They must see that the market calls for larger sensors and if they go after the f3 / new canon camera market they will kill. It makes sense to me for them to have three different models, 2/3rds( 6-8K) , s35 scarlet(10-14K), Epic X(30K)... but hey lets wait and see. Its all gonna be great which ever way it goes.
 
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