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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Grading RED footage...

Remember the RED ONE has its own built in spot meter as well... which in reality can be much more practical and arguably more accurate, I know a few guys that swear by it.
 
The compression approach has/is changing.

I'd certainly encourage you to shoot at ISO 400 or 500 for a high contrast scene. ISO 100 will be less noisy, but at the expense of range.

I set exposure while viewing REDspace in Build 16.

Jim
 
Jannard said:
ISO 100 will be less noisy, but at the expense of range.
Click to expand...

Now this is what I'm so terribly curious about. I think we might be misinterpreting each other or something, I actually intend to post process in Red Cine at ISO 100. As for exposing, I'll be running some tests to figure that part out.

Am I off track here?

The thing that got me so "hot for 100" was the NASA clip. I didn't like the clipped smoke, but went back into Red Cine and dialed in ISO 100 (it was exposed for 320 as far as I know) and bam! The image could have had an additional stop or so worth of exposure based on what the histogram showed. All kinds of cloud detail came back, etc... Thats what started it all... LOL.

Feels like Christmas Eve man... I've been waiting a long time to play with... test... a Red One. :sorcerer:
 
Well Spot and Incident regardless of calibration would return wildly different results if you had a black surface in sunlight and a white surface in shadow. Which I believe was the source of Chris' question. :D
 
Jarred Land said:
Remember the RED ONE has its own built in spot meter as well... which in reality can be much more practical and arguably more accurate, I know a few guys that swear by it.
Click to expand...

I didn't know that. TTL metering is technically the best method since you see what the cam sees threw the actual glass and filters... How does it read out?
 
Someone missed the exposure and ISO 100 saved it... sounds like to me.

ISO 100 will have less latitude than ISO 500. And less noise. No question about it (even Graeme says so!). The question is where is the "sweet spot". For my money, it is 320 for low contrast scenes and 500 for high contrast scenes. But everyone gets to test and make their own decisions.

Jim
 
im.thatoneguy said:
Well Spot and Incident regardless of calibration would return wildly different results if you had a black surface in sunlight and a white surface in shadow. Which I believe was the source of Chris' question. :D
Click to expand...

Spot meter an 18% grey card instead of a shiny black car... or incident in even lighting. But I don't do that much anymore. Now I use a histogram and false color.

Jim
 
Your blowing my brain with this whole 'Higher contrast stock for a higher contrast scene' thing. It makes to much sense.

If I haven't already seen it with my own tests then I wouldn't believe it.
 
Ok... You know what. I'm gonna wait till like 30 hours from now... and figure this out with cam in hand and try to wrap my head around this.

:)

BTW, I will have some HMI's on hand, so I'll be sure to feed the sensor lighting it likes.

..... Wait!

..... ah never mind, its 4:21 AM, screw it.
 
ISO 100 will put your 18% grey very high in the RAW with very little headroom above 90% white. At ISO 100, you're trading your highlight range for shadow range.

If you're exposing to the right on the histogram with a low contrast scene, then you'd be doing the same thing except you'd know that your highlights were safe.
 
Deanan said:
ISO 100 will put your 18% grey very high in the RAW with very little headroom above 90% white. At ISO 100, you're trading your highlight range for shadow range.
Click to expand...

Thank you Deanan. This helps me understand it better... I think. I also think this is the big "misunderstanding" I've been sensing. I don't metering with 18% gray in mind at all, I strictly meter with highlight clipping in mind, via spot metering.

Last one for tonight... I SWEAR.

Thanks Guys.

PS: If I have enough time after technical tests, I'll shot some 4K footage that explains why my screen name is "Cardmaverick". Trust me, you don't wanna play cards with me :)
 
This will get alot easier with build 16 on both the camera and on the post side.
 
Jannard said:
The compression approach has/is changing.

I'd certainly encourage you to shoot at ISO 400 or 500 for a high contrast scene. ISO 100 will be less noisy, but at the expense of range.

I set exposure while viewing REDspace in Build 16.

Jim
Click to expand...

Having shot hundreds of time-lapse sequences of sunrises and sunsets (typically 18+ stops range) with DSLRs I can only agree with you, Jim. If you have a high contrast scene no camera can get both highlights and shadows, but in 99 out of 100 situations you are better off to protect the highlights. The challenge is to find the sweetest exposure point and, in a very high contrast situation, this is tricky to say the least :blink:
Another alternative is to do various HDR techniques with multiple exposures/cameras, but this adds to cost and time enormously.
 
Sorry to be a little off-topic but I did notice that the file name and folder name have a different syntax now - the last two alphanumeric digits are new (and I assume designed that way in response to the potential filename conflicts possible sometimes under Build 15).

Are they checksum based or are they sequential (giving 26^2 minimum possible filenames before a potential conflict arises)?

:)

Paul
 
Changing ISO is really changing where you place, in the range of 0-4095 code values, where mid grey goes. ISO100 will put the mid grey high up that range, and hence, there are few code values left for highlights. You are essentially trading less highlight lattitude for more shadow lattitude (ie, a noise free image). However, if there are shadows in that scene, you'll be able to dig further into them.

If you go to a higher ISO, you start adding highlight lattitude for noise / shadow lattitude. Say you now go up two stops to ISO400. Now you've gained two stops more highlight lattitude, but you've lost two stops on how deep you can dig into the shadows.

Graeme
 
Graeme,

yeah, but if the noise is reduced, all other things being equal, then it is easier to achieve than before ? no ?
 
Graeme Nattress said:
Changing ISO is really changing where you place, in the range of 0-4095 code values, where mid grey goes. ISO100 will put the mid grey high up that range, and hence, there are few code values left for highlights. You are essentially trading less highlight lattitude for more shadow lattitude (ie, a noise free image). However, if there are shadows in that scene, you'll be able to dig further into them.

If you go to a higher ISO, you start adding highlight lattitude for noise / shadow lattitude. Say you now go up two stops to ISO400. Now you've gained two stops more highlight lattitude, but you've lost two stops on how deep you can dig into the shadows.

Graeme
Click to expand...


What I understand its more like the zone sytem. Where you want you greys to be and where you want no details. Is my understandiing right ?
 
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