Future of Helium in DSMC3 world

[Luka Sanader]

After existing Rrptor news and when dust started to set down i am wondering of the Heliums future or lack of one.
Komodo is not proper replacement for Helium at this present model. V Raptor and XL Raptor are move in VV direction. 6K S35 that Raptor offers at @160fps is impressive as well as 2 more F stops of sensitivity and one stop of DR. This should be enough; but... still not 8k. For many of us S35 8k is really impotent, From wild life to shooting classic anamorphic Helium was a really good option. Its a question now if Red will offer same path in DSMC3 line up? Will we see a S35 Raptor with smaller 8k sensor. Looking back at DSMC2 line up it seams that Monstor and Gemini ware most popular and most prized Reds and on the other side of the scale were Dragon X and Raven as affordable ones. Helium was probably less successful commercially and not as popular model so expecting to se its comeback in DSMC3 is less likely to happen.

what do you guys think? should they offer Helium V2 wit improved speed and DR, 8k S35, 120fps, new raptor? Or we should just accept V Raptors 6k on S35 and call it a day?

 

[Jon Dishler]

I might be an odd ball but agree with your love of Helium. I have two and really like that it is bigger than S35 (1.20 the width) so has plenty of fall off for out of focus backgrounds, at 7k HD is exactly the size of S35 (almost), and that can be compressed a lot at 7/8k for very nice 4k delivery, which is the most I have ever done. And as an aside the 2k 4444 ProRes is really quite nice for many applications (downsizing 8k to 2k is a beautiful thing). I like large sensors, especially for still photography, but not so sure that S35 is going anywhere soon. Yes you can get 6k with the Raptor, but with the different R3D image compression it is still much bigger file sizes. I am going to wait for the Raptor XL (no interest in the RF mount) and perhaps see what else comes down the line, but for now still very satisfied with my Helium(s). As to sensitivity, has not been an issue and more often than not. I am needing to use Kippertie Revolva ND's to cut down on the light. If someone offered me an even swap for a Monstro, not sure I would go there.

 

[Luka Sanader]

Helium is incredible.

BUT - IT IS NOT SUITED TO 2x ANAMORPHIC.

So, make the sensor a hair taller, then forget about the Gemini Faboys.

Helium is where its at.

Sharp lil pixels.

I dont understand this Gemini Anamorphic myth at all.

Helium sensor is 8k 29.90 mm × 15.77 mm (Diagonal: 33.80 mm) and most of vintage anamorphics are designed for 21.29 × 17.78 mm. so we are talking about 1mm on top and 1mm on the bottom. trading off that real-estate you gain 8k acquisition at Full Height 8K 3:2 6480 x 4320 or 8k Full Height 6:5 5184x 4320

Gemini on the other hand is 30.72 mm × 18 mm Anamorphic format @ 5K Full Height 6:5 3600 × 3000


CONCLUSION: Gemini 5K Full Height 6:5 3600 × 3000 VS 8k Full Height 6:5 5184x 4320 for a 2mm vertical gain in high is no brainier for me. Gemini, Monstro and Helium as all other reds will crop the sensor as soon as you start over-cranking to usable high speed so you have to deal with crop anyhow. This small difference 2.23mm between two sensors cant justify 22MP VS 10.8MP. Finally if resolution is not the problem and if we are not talking about High Resolution cinematography then shooting Anamorphic on Alexa Mini is the only way to go.


just my 2c

 

[Björn Benckert]

Shooting 2x on Helium (16x9 sensor?) Its not easy..

You Don´t use the full sensor. And most wide anas are not built to cover more much more than a 6:5 slice helium. As most anas are not built for S35 but Academy35. So
yes relatively easy. Helium brings most pixels to the projection area that normal anas create. Sure then you got long anas with more coverage and large format ones but those are quite rare. The regular bunch fits perfect on helium in 6:5 crop.

 

[Luka Sanader]

Shooting 2x on Helium (16x9 sensor?) Its not easy..

why wouldn't be easy? all classic anamorphics are designed for Anamorphic gauge on 35mm negative so canter slice of a helium is identical to the initial format that this lenses are designed for. Still on a Gemini you would have the same horizontal slice except that you would have 1.12mm more room on top of and bottom. on the othere side Helium will give you double the resolution

 

[Kresimir Knezovic]

i use the gemini and i use the full sensor. and its great. in post i crop left and right till i get 2.66:1 or 2.4:1

 

[Kyle Dones]

I have a helium I’ll trade for monstro DM me

 

[AndreasOberg]

I understand what you are saying. Raptor has a few disadvantages for us:
1. 50-1000 is less suited since its is a S35 lens and this is our main lens. That means we would get about 5.5k vs 7.5k. In some aras Raptor would still be better like if you use the 1.5 extender since they it will cover 8k.
2. The file sizs is a bit of a problem. I brought 8 SSDs on our last trip, but now I would have to tripple the amount. Also our 200TB NAS would need to be replaced with 3 similar to cover the same amount of film so 600TB NAS, ugh, the weight and cost and size.
3. The screen is less bright, I like the ultra bright screen and even wished it was brigther, but the new one is less bright.
4. Not so happy about the form factor, this looks hard to fit on a gimbal than DSMC2 for example.

For me I think we will keep the Heliums and add the Raptor later as a bit special case camera for macro, underwater and wide angle shots where we do not use the 50-1000.
What I do like with Raptor is the increased frame rate and the reduced noise, and well also the price so plenty to like.

Best,
Andreas