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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

From a buyer's perspective. A bit of math.

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Adam J. Craig

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WTB: Scarlet kit.

That being said, I've seen lots of scarlet posts on here that end up with frustrated and offended sellers. Please keep in mind what the buyer has in mind.

From what I've read, to properly transfer the ownership to a new person, you have to pay RED $750 plus a $100-$500 evaluation fee. After you pay the fee, you send your new(used) body into red and they then check it out. If they like what they see, you get a 90 day warranty.

Used electronics are always tricky, because one doesn't know if the previous owner kept it on a shelf in a 70 degree room or had it out running and gunning on the beach. There's no way to tell if it got proper treatment, or if it was ridden hard and put away wet. On top of that, you still have to pay MSRP for the accessories, as everyone is trying to keep them for the epic.

Now, let's look at the math for a typical sale.

New base system with:
Body
1 Year warranty
Known history
You get body in a month.
7,950

Used base system =
6500 (for our purposes)
750 Red Transfer fee
100 Red evaluation fee
90 day warranty
Unknown history
You get body back from seller, and then back from red certification in a month.
7,350

Net savings - $600

Not many people would go through all that risk for a savings of $600 on such a huge investment and that's assuming that red doesn't find anything wrong with the unit. If they do, you're F'ed. You could suddenly have a $1500 repair bill on that " bearly used 150 hr camera".

A few things to keep in mind sellers.
 
I think that is actually a pretty good analysis. Despite the fact that the Scarlet pricing did pretty well in all this, it is never going to be about the resale. My suggestion is to plan on keeping and shooting with your Scarlet for just as long as what it shoots is viable. I think that will be a respectable amount of time, even after Dragon comes out. If you shoot a lot, you should get way more than $7K worth of value out of it, even if you discount that sum to present value terms.

To me, the best path to Epic is to make money with Scarlet and then add Epic to my arsenal, or maybe RED will offer an upgrade or trade-in which saves a bit of the overhead discussed above and extracts more value from the Scarlet. That said, as much as I'd like the extra power of Epic, I am not sure I need to own one myself. I can shoot most of what I want on my Scarlet and could rent Epic if I must have 5K or high frame rates. I am sure I'll change my mind over time but right now I am still thrilled with my Scarlet, learning a lot about the R3D workflow, and shooting very happily. It's good to be a RED owner.
 
Since you are adept at basic math, you undoubtedly know what Scarlet owners stand to lose when making your $6500. Deal.

You also know that Scarlet is a damn fine camera for the full retail price.

As a Scarlet owner myself, I am happy to see that the market is not so soft that you can name a price as low as $6500. No offense, but I wish you continued difficulty in finding that deal.

BTW, the price you pay Red for accessories has no bearing on the value of a used Scarlet in a private sale.

None of this is actually of much importance to me as I'm not selling, but it still feels better to know that folks are holding on to their cameras. It says a lot about the value Red is offering, and I do think that Scarlet is their best value currently.

Edit: Since you analysis is correct and it is not a very good deal for anyone, I suggest that you just buy a new Scarlet. It's a bargain at any price. :-)
 
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As a Scarlet owner myself, I am happy to see that the market is not so soft that you can name a price as low as $6500. No offense, but I wish you continued difficulty in finding that deal.

Not sure how I've offended you, but it was a general response to, among others, the top thread on the board promoting this ebay ad - a $6500 body that didn't sell. I'll I'm trying to do is give a little perspective. Depreciation on anything with a microchip is tough, especially with a $850 manufacture tax.
 
I'm not offended. :-) it's all good.

As I stated "no offense." was intended to you.

P.S. I wouldn't call the $850 a manufacture tax as it is not related to manufacture but rather to the secondary market. The title transfer is questionable, but I'd chalk the whole amount up to after market warranty. If you don't think the 90 days is worth it, don't pay it.

As a side note I think the transfer amounts should be opposite: title transfer $100 and eval and warranty=$750. It makes no sense to me the other way around.
 
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This just in:

Two quick points...

1, it is more than "changing the name", it also gives you the opportunity to get the RED Re-Certified Warranty on that camera.

2, we listen. Effective tomorrow, for all brains the transfer of ownership / RED Re-Certified Warranty fee is $500. There is still the $100 eval fee. Hope that helps...

BC

 
Transfer of ownership is not necessary or required. I've sold hundreds of cameras (Sony, Arri, JVC, Canon to name a few) and never transferred ownership via the manufacture on them. So factoring this cost should be considered an option.
 
Right, I forgot to mention a fix....

So, in conclusion, if I were a seller and wanted to move my unit (lol), I'd include more accessories and or offer to pay for the transfer. Otherwise, the "frugal' buyers (Red One aside) will likely buy from RED, and then get your accessories from the boards/ebay/Craigslist.
 
Just a question since I recently sold an EPIC on here. Can the new buyer get a RED account where he will be able to download firmware updates "without" doing the transfer of ownership?
 
I hope Red can clarify some on this. I'm hoping this is just old info.

Per Brent@RED via google -> In order to get new firmware updates, you have to register.
 
If you click in the blue box to the right of the name you will be directed to the original post.
 
Transfer of ownership is not necessary or required. I've sold hundreds of cameras (Sony, Arri, JVC, Canon to name a few) and never transferred ownership via the manufacture on them. So factoring this cost should be considered an option.

It should be optional and technically speaking it is, but the guys are right, I think failure to transfer denies you the privilege of registration and consequently, firmware updates. I think that is why the fees are the way they are, and that too is why I think they are odd. I would expect an administrative task like transfer to cost $100 and an inspection and warranty to cost $850 or now $500.
 
I hope Red can clarify some on this. I'm hoping this is just old info.

Per Brent@RED via google -> In order to get new firmware updates, you have to register.

In order to get official support, repairs, etc.. You must have the camera registered in your name via RED. You need at least one RED camera registered in order to have an account at RED to download firmware updates. In fact, I think you must have an EPIC/ Scarlet in your name to be eligible to download EPIC/ Scarlet firmware updates, even if you already have a RED One.

IMO, the $750 ownership transfer fee does seem a bit high, especially on Scarlet and RED Ones where prices are in the realm of prosumer cameras. On the couple cameras I've sold and for what I've seen a lot of other people do, is to split the fee between buyer and seller.

As for the evaluation fee, it's optional. You don't have to send the camera to RED for evaluation on transfer. But I do recommend, the evaluation fee is reasonable as they do a full check-out and diagnostic of the camera and then tell both parties if anything needs to be repaired and what it will cost. It's up to the buyer and seller to work out those details though.
 
After further analysis, it appears that Red may have set the bar for resale with the battle tested deal.. They priced the used body at $4900 (7100-1500(ssd mt)-700(al canon mt)).

So theoretically, the competitive rate per red for a scarlet is 4900-600 (new transfer fee) = $4300. OUCH! Worse, that's not accounting for the hrs on the unit.

At that price, I bet most owners would rather hold on to their body. If not, pm me, lol.

Here's the break down:

[TABLE="width: 408"]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]
[TD]New[/TD]
[TD]Used[/TD]
[TD]BT Deal[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]body[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]7950[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]6000[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]4900[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]ssd mount[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1500[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1500[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1500[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]mount[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]700[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]700[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]700[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]lcd[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1600[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1600[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1600[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]grip[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]950[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]950[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]950[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]battery[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]195[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]195[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]195[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]charger[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]125[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]125[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]125[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]ssd media[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]725[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]725[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]725[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]ssd reader[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]195[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]195[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]195[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]handle[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]350[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]350[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]350[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Transfer[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]0[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]600[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]0[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Shipping[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]100[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]0[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]100[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Total[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]14390[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]12940[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]11340[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 2"]Net savings[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]-1450[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]-3050[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Whoa, I feel like Nate Silver.
 
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Yes I've noticed RED doing this a few times... selling their products so cheap that it even undercuts the used market by far. Like when I bought my brand new RED rocket... a few weeks later they started to sell BT Rockets for $3000. Wow! Priced so low that if you wanted to unload yours, you would have to beat the RED deal and wipe out a lot of value in the process. They could have easily offered the cards for $4000 BT. RED is weird. You can count on their prices to be rock bottom.

What I'm scared of is this scenario. RED introduces Dragon for 19k with body. Then they start selling BT EPIC-X's for $3000. Hey it's happened before. :-)
 
Could mods move this OUT of the RED Stuff for sale section. No offense, but it's kind of a questionable thread when there are some of us trying to sell our Scarlets and come to a fair value for both parties involved. This sitting right at the top is a pretty big turn off for any potentially interested parties.

This thread is also not something for sale.
 
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Sorry, wasn't trying to be a ***, just crunching the numbers.

It's for something to buy. A scarlet kit.
 
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