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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Forged 6k Weapon and Carbon 6k Weapon Shipping Update

Mark Andersen said:
Here is a question I don't think has been asked and not sure if there is an answer too yet.

If I buy a MG Weapon and later have the internal boards upgraded so that the MG will accommodate an 8K sensor will I pay more than if I buy the CF Weapon now (which of course is 8K ready) or in other words will upgrading the boards on an MG Weapon cost more that $15,000?
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sam windell said:
I 2nd this question. Anyone have an answer to it? Hopefully Brent could fill us in on that.
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The only thing I can recall that's been officially stated that there is a path for Weapon MG 6K Dragon owners to upgrade to Weapon CF 8K Dragon and it will indeed cost more than what was offered at NAB 2015. For many that 8K upgrade on top of the CF upgrade was sort of a no brainer because Jarred was pretty clear that the 8K upgrade when it rears it's head again will likely be "way more" than the $10K deposit at NAB 2015.

There's no official pricing on 8K upgrades outside of what has happened at NAB 2015, but you can for sure count on that it will be more expensive for MG to upgrade than CF Weapons mainly due to the boards in internal data bandwidth that only come with the CF Woven and Forged options.
 
Phil Holland said:
The only thing I can recall that's been officially stated that there is a path for Weapon MG 6K Dragon owners to upgrade to Weapon CF 8K Dragon and it will indeed cost more than what was offered at NAB 2015. For many that 8K upgrade on top of the CF upgrade was sort of a no brainer because Jarred was pretty clear that the 8K upgrade when it rears it's head again will likely be "way more" than the $10K deposit at NAB 2015.

There's no official pricing on 8K upgrades outside of what has happened at NAB 2015, but you can for sure count on that it will be more expensive for MG to upgrade than CF Weapons mainly due to the boards in internal data bandwidth that only come with the CF Woven and Forged options.
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I have this nagging suspicion that there is going to be something coming down the pike that will be a better option than converting an MG Weapon to 8k. It has no basis in fact other than Jim's recent post that we ain't seen nothin' yet, and my observation of RED surprising us with new products (like 8k sensors) and the Weapon body upgrade. I can visualize a complete new camera concept in the coming years that will take modularity to new levels.

As I said, this is me visualizing and speculating, and I'm not changing any plans based on my speculation, other than preparing early for the means to pay for any new tech that makes things easier and less expensive to make movies.

It is entirely possible that I am better at imagining than RED is at innovating, but I hope not. Wi Fi connected sensor and boards create so many possible uses that it causes me to salivate when thinking about it.
 
Phil Holland said:
The only thing I can recall that's been officially stated that there is a path for Weapon MG 6K Dragon owners to upgrade to Weapon CF 8K Dragon and it will indeed cost more than what was offered at NAB 2015. For many that 8K upgrade on top of the CF upgrade was sort of a no brainer because Jarred was pretty clear that the 8K upgrade when it rears it's head again will likely be "way more" than the $10K deposit at NAB 2015.

There's no official pricing on 8K upgrades outside of what has happened at NAB 2015, but you can for sure count on that it will be more expensive for MG to upgrade than CF Weapons mainly due to the boards in internal data bandwidth that only come with the CF Woven and Forged options.
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of course we know that the 8K upgrade will be at least double, but MG owners will have to pay another price to get their MG Weapons up to par with the CF Weapons (adding or upgrading internal hardware) the question I don't think anyone knows is what will that cost? Is it possible it could cost something less than the $15K difference between the MG and the CF? Probably not, or else there would be some CF Weapon owners who would feel foolish thinking they could have gotten to 8K ready for less by starting with a MG body. Of course they never would have gotten the discounted 8K sensor that the early adopters did. However, a price significantly higher than $15K for internal upgrades would seem kinda unreasonable. In my crystal ball I'm guessing (and this is just a wild guess) the price to speed up your MG Weapon will be right at about that $15K mark, except you won't have CF materials surrounding your new electronics.
 
I recently changed an MG upgrade to woven CF. I did this based on the performance enhancements and the ability to go to 8K in the future. Getting a Weapon during the CF fulfillment doesn't hurt either, albeit at the very end of the CF line.
 
Joe Kleber said:
...changed my Woven upgrade to Forged upgrade. ...any thoughts?
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Well, you'll get it sooner. More so if you didn't order in the first minutes or hour or so of the Weapon system going live in the RED store. If being early with new equipment, for rentals or whatever you do with your camera gear, is beneficial to you, then it makes the premium more worthwhile. And if you have any intention of going to 8K and did not buy into the first batch of 8K upgrades sold during NAB, this will give you better priority for that...
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
Well, you'll get it sooner. More so if you didn't order in the first minutes or hour or so of the Weapon system going live in the RED store. If being early with new equipment, for rentals or whatever you do with your camera gear, is beneficial to you, then it makes the premium more worthwhile. And if you have any intention of going to 8K and did not buy into the first batch of 8K upgrades sold during NAB, this will give you better priority for that...
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Jeff

With much due respect, I know all that already. Where am I in the FORGED upgrade line? THAT is my question.


According to Jarred, IF one places an order for a a Forged upgrade today than he or she is a month out. ...but where are you in the line if you placed your order for a FORGED upgrade over two months ago? ...a day out? ...a week out? ...3 weeks out? My bs rep won't tell me. ...AND if RED won't tell me, then why not ask my fellow forum members to take a guess? ;)
 
Mark Andersen said:
of course we know that the 8K upgrade will be at least double, but MG owners will have to pay another price to get their MG Weapons up to par with the CF Weapons (adding or upgrading internal hardware) the question I don't think anyone knows is what will that cost? Is it possible it could cost something less than the $15K difference between the MG and the CF? Probably not, or else there would be some CF Weapon owners who would feel foolish thinking they could have gotten to 8K ready for less by starting with a MG body. Of course they never would have gotten the discounted 8K sensor that the early adopters did. However, a price significantly higher than $15K for internal upgrades would seem kinda unreasonable. In my crystal ball I'm guessing (and this is just a wild guess) the price to speed up your MG Weapon will be right at about that $15K mark, except you won't have CF materials surrounding your new electronics.
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Oh you mean to upgrade the internal guts without the 8K sensor? That hasn't been announced or hinted at yet.

The only thing I really know is this:


Jarred Land said:
Full Frame / Vista Vision 40mm x 20mm ( 40.96mm x 21.6mm )

8192 x 4320 60fps full sensor, 75fps 8K 2.40:1

NAB price for the upgrade is $10k additional to Weapon CF or Weapon CF upgrade during NAB only. Upgrade Price when 8K ships at end of the year will be $20k.
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If it's like you speculate, that would be maybe $35K to get to 8K from MG. Time will tell. We're a ways away from that.
 
Phil Holland said:
The only thing I really know is this:





If it's like you speculate, that would be maybe $35K to get to 8K from MG. Time will tell. We're a ways away from that.
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That would mean it will cost $55k to upgrade from Epic Dragon to 8k?
This whole thread makes me think that "upgrading" to Mg is the worst idea ever.
 
Milan Spasic said:
That would mean it will cost $55k to upgrade from Epic Dragon to 8k?
This whole thread makes me think that "upgrading" to Mg is the worst idea ever.
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It's honestly too soon to tell anything really. Speculation is rampant as of now because we're talking "future talk".

I think what we might see moving forward is those who want/need/desire 6K or even 5K (Super 35mm or what I call Super 35mm+) and those who want/need/desire 8K (VistaVision+) and perhaps whatever is beyond that in the future.

I know for a fact I'll be shooting S35 and VistaVision productions in the future. I'm not selling my S35 glass for that exact reason. There will be productions that need both 4K and 8K finishes and there will be the appropriate way to shoot those jobs.
 
i want 65 after vista, that'd be amazing! even at a 200k upgrade price!
 
Brian Merlen said:
i want 65 after vista, that'd be amazing! even at a 200k upgrade price!
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I'm hoping the 8k V V will become an ersatz 65. I'm going to use the frowned-upon U word here, but upscaling to achieve higher resolutions is no vice when starting from a pristine low compression 8k image.

It just seems logical to me that having an array with a high pixel count before upscaling to achieve higher resolution means there should never be any blockiness like one would expect fewer, larger pixels to exhibit.
 
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I have one question about the trade-in process. I have a feature coming up starting at the end of October. If my Dragon is on the film and I get a notification from my Bomb rep that it is time to send in my camera for upgrade, what happens if I wait until my film wraps? Do I fall to the end of the upgrade line if I don't send my camera in right away?

If I am to lose that spot then I might just have to use Alexas or other rental Dragons so my body is available right when I am asked to send it in. Imagine my paranoia!
 
Peter Lyons Collister said:
I have one question about the trade-in process. I have a feature coming up starting at the end of October. If my Dragon is on the film and I get a notification from my Bomb rep that it is time to send in my camera for upgrade, what happens if I wait until my film wraps? Do I fall to the end of the upgrade line if I don't send my camera in right away?

If I am to lose that spot then I might just have to use Alexas or other rental Dragons so my body is available right when I am asked to send it in. Imagine my paranoia!
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My plan has always been to have a sub-rental ready to step in for my camera if my number gets called.
 
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