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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Ergonomics etc.

Peter McCully

Peter McCully

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I haven't been anything except totally stoked about what's been announced and shown as at Dec 3rd.
I am wondering whats planned or being planned with the external rigs and handles that will attach to the "brains" and how the modules will "dock".
With the R1 it's a big enough beast that it can only be picked up safely using some kind of secure top handle and that it needs to be placed on a bench or something before fitting things or taking things off it. The future "brains" are just about in the size and weight range where I can foresee them being picked up one-handed by confident crew members and - dare I say - dropped? The thought of little tumbling cubes is too much to contemplate. I am looking forward to seeing what could be fitted to the brain as a top handle. Most likely the brain/riser/plate, rods, top handle, IO, power unit would be the semi-permanent rig to which all the other accessories would be fitted to so my question is probably moot.
 
If folks remember my ergonomics thread, I'm working on a large accessory that will satisfy just about everything that I was asking for.

RED gets a lot of extra points for what they did to Epic. Interestingly enough, they either listened to every single point that I made or they at least made the camera small enough that I can build my own accessory to satisfy my needs.

It'll be pretty cool... :)
 
Love the modular approach but don't want a front heavy cam

Love the modular approach but don't want a front heavy cam

It is my hope that the mating of the modules - brackets, connection pins/tabs, etc happens near the top of each block. The reason for this is that i would like to be able to fit a "spacer" block between the brain/lens combo in front and everything else (batteries/connections/recording media/etc) that is not as tall as the working modules.

I am basically looking to insert a shoulder "cut out". It needs to pass signal and "clip on" but if it were maybe 5 inches in the linear dimension (lengthways from lens to tail) but only 2 to 3 inches tall, (width to match other blocks) with an integrated pad you could really lower the COG and by cantilevering the rear weight, help balance out the lens weight in front.

Yes, it would make the rig longer and add some weight, but if it made the camera less front heavy and lowered the center of gravity it would suit me as along as I wasn't shooting inside a small space like a car seat.

Brook - if you are following my description feel free to post a diagram, I would do it myself but I am on the run.
 
Blair S. Paulsen said:
It is my hope that the mating of the modules - brackets, connection pins/tabs, etc happens near the top of each block. The reason for this is that i would like to be able to fit a "spacer" block between the brain/lens combo in front and everything else (batteries/connections/recording media/etc) that is not as tall as the working modules.

I am basically looking to insert a shoulder "cut out". It needs to pass signal and "clip on" but if it were maybe 5 inches in the linear dimension (lengthways from lens to tail) but only 2 to 3 inches tall, (width to match other blocks) with an integrated pad you could really lower the COG and by cantilevering the rear weight, help balance out the lens weight in front.

Yes, it would make the rig longer and add some weight, but if it made the camera less front heavy and lowered the center of gravity it would suit me as along as I wasn't shooting inside a small space like a car seat.

Brook - if you are following my description feel free to post a diagram, I would do it myself but I am on the run.
Click to expand...

The "spacer" could be a breakout box and audio mixer with the shoulder scoop built in.
 
Brook Willard said:
RED gets a lot of extra points for what they did to Epic. Interestingly enough, they either listened to every single point that I made or they at least made the camera small enough that I can build my own accessory to satisfy my needs.

It'll be pretty cool... :)
Click to expand...

Yeah, they made it look a lot like a Phantom HD.:biggrin:
 
Blair S. Paulsen said:
Brook - if you are following my description feel free to post a diagram, I would do it myself but I am on the run.
Click to expand...

Your idea is awesome, it's exactly what most people are going to use. RED's own shoulder pad is badass and everything, but a nice tight shoulder pad that fits under the modules will be perfect.

My design is more specialized... think of it as more of a standalone camera body with lots of cool features. I'll post something as soon as I've managed to put together a rendering.
 
Brook Willard said:
If folks remember my ergonomics thread, I'm working on a large accessory that will satisfy just about everything that I was asking for.

RED gets a lot of extra points for what they did to Epic. Interestingly enough, they either listened to every single point that I made or they at least made the camera small enough that I can build my own accessory to satisfy my needs.

It'll be pretty cool... :)
Click to expand...

Thats great Brook. I'm looking forward to seeing what you're up to.
 
I think you guys are losing sight of scale here... if you put the pad under the modules, the lens will be in your ear.

Jim
 
Well, that happened to me when I first saw the R1 in person. I had seen the renders and all and I thought it was no bigger than a mini dv recorder. To my suprise the camera was way larger than I originally thought. I have no clue of the size of this new cameras/renders. I think it would be great to have a render done with some reference element that could give you a better idea of the scale you are referring to. Just a thought.
 
Jim,

Can you shed some light on the interconnect plan for the modules? I think we're all wondering how that will work. I would imagine you'd have some kind of consistent pinout on each so data and signals are conveyed cleanly between them without a bunch of cables... and a locking mechanism to keep them securely attached.

I'd hate to have to start relying on a bunch of 3rd party stuff....

M
 
estebanred said:
Well, that happened to me when I first saw the R1 in person. I had seen the renders and all and I thought it was no bigger than a mini dv recorder. To my suprise the camera was way larger than I originally thought. I have no clue of the size of this new cameras/renders. I think it would be great to have a render done with some reference element that could give you a better idea of the scale you are referring to. Just a thought.
Click to expand...

The PL lens in front is a cue... as is the mattebox, red handles, batts, etc.

But dimensions would be nice. Or a shot of a NC milled plastic model of the modules with a lens mounted... sitting on Brook's shoulder ;)

M
 
In balance

In balance

I have no doubt that the Red Team has spent far more time addressing the balance and COG issues than I have, not to mention making mock ups and running around the room with them. Let me be very clear that I love the modular approach, and from the renders, it looks like some of the design traps of the original RedOne have been elegantly resolved.

What I am concerned about is that the "Starship Enterprise" renders with the shoulder pad in the way back and only one (2.75 lb.) battery to counter-weight the lens end "looks" very front heavy. Of course its not how it looks that counts, and I have faith that after all the lessons learned with the RedOne that the Red Team would not create a fresh design that was super front heavy.

In my mind's eye the lens and at least one module lives in front of my shoulder and the rest lives behind my shoulder. Since the lens is attached to the brain in front of my shoulder I don't envision it next to my ear, but without actual testing I could be completely wrong.

FWIW when I first switched to Anton bricks on the rear of my Sony D-30 it made the camera 5 pounds heavier (28 vs 23) but it actually was easier to handle because of the improved balance.

IMHO small and lightweight WITH neutral balance and a low COG is the holy grail. I would also love a smaller and lighter EVF if the physics can be worked out, the current one rocks but it is kinda large - no disrespect intended.
 
Mark Pedersen said:
Jim,

Can you shed some light on the interconnect plan for the modules? I think we're all wondering how that will work. I would imagine you'd have some kind of consistent pinout on each so data and signals are conveyed cleanly between them without a bunch of cables... and a locking mechanism to keep them securely attached.

I'd hate to have to start relying on a bunch of 3rd party stuff....

M
Click to expand...

We are purposefully withholding certain info... and one bombshell. We anticipate that the competition will be working on something, so we have to be ready for a checkmate move when that happens. Don't ask. We won't tell.

Jim
 
Mark Pedersen said:
The PL lens in front is a cue... as is the mattebox, red handles, batts, etc.

But dimensions would be nice. Or a shot of a NC milled plastic model of the modules with a lens mounted... sitting on Brook's shoulder ;)

M
Click to expand...

I had seen the R1 aswell, but still it got me confused.:wacko:
I have seen the batts and the lens mount too, I think I have an idea of the size, but I think the design is tricky.
 
Jannard said:
We are purposefully withholding certain info... and one bombshell. We anticipate that the competition will be working on something, so we have to be ready for a checkmate move when that happens. Don't ask. We won't tell.

Jim
Click to expand...

I like bombshells, is this fun or what ?
Aloha
-A
 
Jannard said:
We are purposefully withholding certain info... and one bombshell. We anticipate that the competition will be working on something, so we have to be ready for a checkmate move when that happens. Don't ask. We won't tell.

Jim
Click to expand...

I love your work!
 
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