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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Epic-W

i hate putting out theories, but i think Epic-W = Weapon 8K Helium at 40k for body
The 60K special edition was with a few aks. The special edition/color adds 10k or so.
Probably discontinue the Weapon Mag and it's replaced with Epic-w.
all the good old outdated dragon sensors goto scarlet and raven.
line up will possibly look like

8K Weapon- VV Forged CF
8K Epic-W S35 Magnesium
5k Scarlet-W S35
4.5k Raven A35
 
Kazu Okuda said:
i hate putting out theories, but i think Epic-W = Weapon 8K Helium at 40k for body
The 60K special edition was with a few aks. The special edition/color adds 10k or so.
Probably discontinue the Weapon Mag and it's replaced with Epic-w.
all the good old outdated dragon sensors goto scarlet and raven.
line up will possibly look like

8K Weapon- VV Forged CF
8K Epic-W S35 Magnesium
5k Scarlet-W S35
4.5k Raven A35
Click to expand...


Bingo. What I've been sayin too. Just seems to make the most sense. The "Special edition" has carbon brains hence the price jump.


sam karr said:
Jarred talked about Epic-W and Weapon Helium. I guess the Weapon Helium is 8K with a 29mm large sensor, the one they already sold, and the Epic-W will be pure S35 which will be a little less than 7k with an Helium 3.65 micron pixel. I also think that they will keep the MG because not everybody likes the extra sharpness or the huge data associated with 8k.
Click to expand...


Doesn't make sense to take Epic-W and make it only a little more than 6K. That already pretty much already exists with MG.
 
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Brody_B said:
Doesn't make sense to take Epic-W and make it only a little more than 6K. That already pretty much already exists with MG.
Click to expand...

Helium is a completely new sensor, doesn't matter what resolutions can be shot on other sensors... same as Dragon has overlapping resolutions to MX...
 
Mike Nagel said:
Helium is a completely new sensor, doesn't matter what resolutions can be shot on other sensors... same as Dragon has overlapping resolutions to MX...
Click to expand...

Your right, but I guess thats kinda my point, MX, to dragon, and then to Helium and no real increase in resolution still. I think Red is going to be a bit more progressive with that growth by now. Ultimately I hope your wrong ;) But, time will certainly tell.
 
Epic-W should have a new body and the new chip I think. Weapon body is nice but the xenmorph body is great.
 
sounds good (I am sitting on scarlet MX until the Oct announcement cause you never know) but painful reality is that value of Scarlet is not high and so you will probably be paying close to full cost of any new camera. Maybe a discount like NAB just for MX owners, but RED is still a for profit business.
I would give the Scarlet away if I could get Helium sensor in my raven allowing 8K stills and whatever is same crop as Raven 4.5K on the Helium sensor. Really ;)
 
Aaron michaels said:
Epic-W should have a new body and the new chip I think. Weapon body is nice but the xenmorph body is great.
Click to expand...

Epic-W has same body as Weapon, it's called DSMC2. RED is keeping this DSMC2 body style until at least 2020. Xenmorph and Bayhem and Panavision versions are basically custom modular cases/enclosures.
 
Epic-W will be a slightly less powerful Weapon Helium, but more powerful than the Weapon MG. The cost to upgrade from Weapon MG to Epic-W will be around $9500. So, if people are going to imagine what the cost for Epic MX or Dragon will be, add the numbers on top of that. Weapon MG is around 30K, plus 9500 = $39500, but that's the value of an upgrade that keeps the camera body. To go from Epic MX or Dragon to Epic-W would require additional costs for the camera body. I would say that if Weapon Helium is around 60 000, the Epic-W might land around $45 000 - $50 000 for a new body. On top of that add accessories needed for Weapon architecture.
 
Christoffer Glans said:
Epic-W will be a slightly less powerful Weapon Helium, but more powerful than the Weapon MG. The cost to upgrade from Weapon MG to Epic-W will be around $9500. So, if people are going to imagine what the cost for Epic MX or Dragon will be, add the numbers on top of that. Weapon MG is around 30K, plus 9500 = $39500, but that's the value of an upgrade that keeps the camera body. To go from Epic MX or Dragon to Epic-W would require additional costs for the camera body. I would say that if Weapon Helium is around 60 000, the Epic-W might land around $45 000 - $50 000 for a new body. On top of that add accessories needed for Weapon architecture.
Click to expand...

I believe you are wrong.

Jarred Land himself said in "The Update Thread" post #1540: Epic-W will be $30k new.


 
Well, guess you can't blame people for not gettting every post in a 168 pages thread;-)
 
I speculate Epic-W is a modified Weapon-MG w/ a Helium sensor, aka, the same white stormtroopers sold before, but in weapon-of-mass-production black
 
Sounds like Epic-W is targeted at those of us Epic Dragon owners who thought Weapon MG Dragon wasn't a big enough jump and that Weapon CF Dragon was too expensive.
 
No one said Epic-W is "more powerful" than Weapon-MG. Epic-W just simply has a Helium sensor. Everything else is just speculation. What I would like to figure out is which future upgrades make sense. Mg -> Epic-W or wait for Mg -> VV dragon or wait for Mg -> 8Ks35 helium and skip Epic-W. My head is going to explode.
 
Daniel Reed said:
I speculate Epic-W is a modified Weapon-MG w/ a Helium sensor, aka, the same white stormtroopers sold before, but in weapon-of-mass-production black
Click to expand...


I think the storm troopers were weapon heliums, aka carbon weapon with 8k helium sensor. My guess is that the epic-w is gonna have same brain as mg/maybe slightly more powerful with only a 7k cut of helium sensor. And probably limitations with frame rate when at 7k. Like maybe 30fps max.

All just speculation tho at this point tho.
 
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Samir Patel said:
No one said Epic-W is "more powerful" than Weapon-MG. Epic-W just simply has a Helium sensor. Everything else is just speculation. What I would like to figure out is which future upgrades make sense. Mg -> Epic-W or wait for Mg -> VV dragon or wait for Mg -> 8Ks35 helium and skip Epic-W. My head is going to explode.
Click to expand...


The wait to vv sounds like it will be forever. The wait to weapon helium I'm guessing should be as fast or even faster than epic-w delivery cause less people will order it. Key word here being "guessing".
 
Norbert Niederacher said:
I believe you are wrong.

Jarred Land himself said in "The Update Thread" post #1540: Epic-W will be $30k new.
Click to expand...

Then I'm mistaken, missed that one. Although it feels rather strange that the "upgrade" for MG owners will be a $9500 cost if the upgrade is using the MG house and the sensor gets traded in for another sensor (making it possible for the Dragon sensor to be used for others). If that price is the case I think the upgrade price for MG owners is a bit too much really.
 
Christoffer Glans said:
Then I'm mistaken, missed that one. Although it feels rather strange that the "upgrade" for MG owners will be a $9500 cost if the upgrade is using the MG house and the sensor gets traded in for another sensor (making it possible for the Dragon sensor to be used for others). If that price is the case I think the upgrade price for MG owners is a bit too much really.
Click to expand...


You've had your weapon for months no? If you rent it at its true value (whether that's to shooters or just to your clients) you would have only had to do it ~10x to cover the difference if you choose to upgrade. While it might be frustrating, it does seem that sometimes early adopters pay a premium as technology progresses, and their only recourse is the opportunity to make money off it while others are still waiting.

As for red changing out your sensor for less, that seems like a bad business move, as it seems every sensor from MX to now has cost about 9-10k. I don't see red re-using your sensor unless of course it's "battle tested", but then they would have to sell it at a discount. I know I wouldn't pay full price for a weapon with your sensor in it :/
 
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