Epic-M Heatsink and Body Upgrade

[Zeb B]

Hello TEAM RED,

What is the date for the free heat sink and body upgrade for the M series? Come to find out, I cannot attach top plates to the M body since it, for some reason, uses very small / weak M4 screws instead of the RED standard 1/4-20 (hole pattern is different from the X as well). The Epic-M and top plate specs don't mention this issue. I remember in a thread Jared mentioning this upgrade coming very soon and how it would take out 1/2 pound of weight from the camera body. Being one of those guys who just spent the full 58 large for an Epic-M I would like to have the current shipping "X" physical build (which I believe has these features) asap.

Thank you in advance,

-Josh

 

[Willy Faes]

+1

Willy Faes

 

[Zeb B]

Anyone from RED care to comment?

 

[Peter Cote]

Their silence is speaking volumes to the priority level of this. I've been wondering the same thing.

 

[Dan Kanes]

Viewfactor Epic M Top plate.problem solved.

 

[Zeb B]

Viewfactor Epic M Top plate.problem solved.

not even close - attaching top plate to body: 1/4-20 bolts (X) vs M4 micro screws (M) to hold a shit ton of camera and accessories

 

[Matt Uhry]

Relax Josh,

Red will take care of M buyers like they have promised. It's the kind of company they are.

Not sure what top plate you are using, but the VF / Brook Willard one is plenty strong with 2x 1/4-20 in front and 4x m4 in back. Even though the screws seem small the tensile strength of a single m4 is about 90kilo's and of a 1/4-20 about 800kilo's each... combined it should be enough for your on-board monitor and the car you drove to set in.

Matt Uhry
www.mattuhry.com

 

[Zeb B]

@Matt: Thank you for the reassurance. I know there are many Stage 1-3 customers who proactively support RED and do not understand my concerns.

I would like a date from RED for this upgrade since it was not disclosed at time of purchase that the "M" body was not compatible with their own RED DMSC accessories. I have tried then returned the Wooden Camera top plate since it's not just a screw issue - the "X" body is just slightly different in form than the "M". I guess View Factor has a plate that will physically fit but there is no way I'm trusting an expensive and very heavy camera to M4 screws. Your tensile strength number above is for the steel screw on a bench test - not the pull out force from the aluminum "M" body where you're catching maybe 8 very fine threads.

 

[Dan Kanes]

Let me know when you hear of an epic M separating from a Viewfactor Top Plate through shearing or other force.

Would love to see the disaster footage.

As for the weight of the camera - do you think you would know if Red hadn't told you? Sometimes the forthrightness of RDC can be detrimental to its own health and the mental health of its customers.

I've had a viewfactor plate on my epic M since I bought it, and have had zero problems, zero complaints. I think the fact that the body is machined instead of stamped may help - I've had like zero concern about the solidness, reliability or durability of the camera.

Don't get me wrong - I love free upgrades - but this is like the last of my concerns right now personally.

 

[Greg M]

not even close - attaching top plate to body: 1/4-20 bolts (X) vs M4 micro screws (M) to hold a shit ton of camera and accessories

I have VF top plates on both of our M bodies, they work great- been on the cameras for almost a year now. I'd chill out, this is an optional update that Red is not obligated to install. Its a GIFT, so don't look a gift horse in the mouth as they say.

 

[Zeb B]

Let me know when you hear of an epic M separating from a Viewfactor Top Plate through shearing or other force.

Would love to see the disaster footage.

As for the weight of the camera - do you think you would know if Red hadn't told you? Sometimes the forthrightness of RDC can be detrimental to its own health and the mental health of its customers.

I've had a viewfactor plate on my epic M since I bought it, and have had zero problems, zero complaints. I think the fact that the body is machined instead of stamped may help - I've had like zero concern about the solidness, reliability or durability of the camera.

Don't get me wrong - I love free upgrades - but this is like the last of my concerns right now personally.

Here comes the sarcastic fanboys.

Dan, if I go down the View Factor "M" plate route then I will be stuck with only their FMJ products and be without the option to use RED's own products until my "M" becomes an "X". That is not what I had in mind when purchasing the Epic. I understand you are a very bold with your equipment, extremely supportive of RED and could care less about this issue so let's leave it at that since you have no ability to remedy the situation. As to seller disclosure causing mental health problems in customers . . . I would love to see the footage from that science

 

[Greg M]

Exactly what Red products will you not be able to use with the VF top plate installed? I have every one of Reds products and have never been limited in options.

 

[Zeb B]

I have VF top plates on both of our M bodies, they work great- been on the cameras for almost a year now. I'd chill out, this is an optional update that Red is not obligated to install. Its a GIFT, so don't look a gift horse in the mouth as they say.

"Gift"? I'm not understanding that concept as it relates to this. I have $80K in recent RED purchases and am certainly not looking for a handout - just a date as to when camera will be current with what is shipping and generally support. Basic question that should not upset anyone. I ask questions like this of Phase and other high-end manufacturers without backlash or drama.

 

[Greg M]

"Gift"? I'm not understanding that concept as it relates to this. I have $80K in recent RED purchases and am certainly not looking for a handout - just a date as to when camera will be current with what is shipping and generally support. Basic question that should not upset anyone. I ask questions like this of Phase and other high-end manufacturers without backlash or drama.

Maybe your definition of gift is different than mine. Red has offered to give us a FREE upgrade to the camera, for me I consider this a gift. Other manufactures would have spun this very differently and sold us an upgrade.
Where do you get that Red is required to give you this upgrade? If you didn't know what you were buying before your handed over $58k, shame on you. It has been well documented.

You'll get the upgrade when its ready...whining about it isn't going to make Red ship it any sooner. But back to my question, what does the VF plate limit you from doing? I have M's and X's and no one would ever know that the cameras were different unless they looked at the M on the front. All the accessories are interchangeable.

 

[Zeb B]

Exactly what Red products will you not be able to use with the VF top plate installed? I have every one of Reds products and have never been limited in options.

I didn't know the "M" body was different from the "X" until I tried to fit a WC top plate on it (since RED's was long-term back ordered). I don't see the logic of arguing the idea of using 3rd party parts on a "M" body that will be updated to become the standard bolt size / hole pattern, DMSC compatible "X" body in time. The OP was addressed to RED and simply asked about a date for that update. I appreciate that you are very comfortable with RED, their timelines and have a great working relationship with them seeing that you were a very early adopter.

 

[Zeb B]

Maybe your definition of gift is different than mine. Red has offered to give us a FREE upgrade to the camera, for me I consider this a gift. Other manufactures would have spun this very differently and sold us an upgrade.
Where do you get that Red is required to give you this upgrade? If you didn't know what you were buying before your handed over $58k, shame on you. It has been well documented.

You'll get the upgrade when its ready...whining about it isn't going to make Red ship it any sooner.

Absolutely predictable

 

[Matt Uhry]

Josh - the VF - FMJ - Brook Willard plate uses 2 1/4 20's in the front and the m4's in the rear. And yeah I did kind of overstate the safe working strength of the setup....but it's still quite robust, I don't think there has been a single case of failure. Contact Viewfactor and see if they will send you one to try out.

Matt Uhry
www.mattuhry.com

 

[Meryem Ersoz]

I don't think we were ever promised a date for the program: http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?61457-Half-a-Pound&highlight=half+a+pound

just a note on "after EPIC-X begins"

It never hurts to ask or to make these enquiries, but please let's not pile on with a bunch of "silence is deafening" and other negative interpretations of the original request. RED will follow through as soon as they can. I imagine sometime this summer. It's easy to imagine that they have no way to respond to the question, because they simply don't know the specifics yet, of what the window of opportunity will be, just yet, in the production schedule, until some of the recent production line expansion dust settles.

making an honest inquiry is one thing, RED is certainly used to that. but setting an expectation on this issue, right now, is probably not a great idea, it will just cause frustration....you're better off finding a workable solution in the meanwhile.

 

[Justin Marx]

Been using the FMJ and I couldn't imagine anything being much stronger..

Also, remember that your swat rail that connects to the handle of the EPIC is held by only two.

 

[Jay Silver]

I've had the original FMJ top plate from day one back in June. Haven't had one problem with it either. View factor even sent me a brand new top plate for use once the camera gets updated to the new top/heat sink.
I've got the wooden camera swat rail with safety stops which I believe are very important especially considering what you're carrying with that top handle. I wouldn't want to find out someone loosened the top handle by it sliding off of the RED swat rail which doesn't have any safety stops.

On a side note, the long and short dovetails that RED sells have no safety stops as well which could be very dangerous. I installed a couple of ground down allen screws onto the ends of my long dove tail plate which stops it from sliding off if the quick release plate wasn't tightened down. Every dovetail in the industry has a safety stop in the front and some type of push button safety stop in the back. Not sure why RED didn't think it was necessary.

I also contacted my bomb squad rep about the heat sink swap and she wasn't able to tell me anything. I'm guessing RED has their hands full with more important things.

The Epic M is kicking ass. Don't miss the RED One for a second.