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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

End of Mac Pro???

Tehben Dean said:
What if the MacPro where to turn into a modular computer along the lines of EPIC. Processor modules, graphics modes, I/O modules, etc. you just stack as many of them up as you want... Infinitely expandable. Now that would be amazing!
Click to expand...

Call me and lets make it happen ;-) Infiniband sort of was made for that purpose, linking CPU's, but they havent really taken off yet, not sure if they ever do. I would love the scaleable idea of a blade server, where the OS is running on top of how many blade servers you insert. Such a thing could crush anything within reason.
 
I can't say as I am surprised, its been tossed around for a while in general conversation. Apple are making so much on consumer gear...
 
Martin Weiss said:
As Matthew Yohe noted on macrumors article, the source of this rumor is the same one that made this graphic:
Click to expand...

This "source" has a history... They're batting 0 for about 11 right now on the Mac hardware rumors. I really can't believe the rumor sites waste time noting it. Oh, wait, they gotta have something juicy to drive traffic to the site... And as long as it's a "rumor" reported by someone else, there's no call for journalistic integrity. Not that such a thing exists anymore, anyway....

And that stupid chart they show on the Macrumors site (I didn't bother to look at AppleInsider) is just that, stupid. Mac Pro sales met a record high in unit sales in 2010 with the Westmere update. It's in Apple's annual report. Sorry. I don't buy this for one minute. I do however believe that a newly-designed Mac Pro is coming with the next revision. I expect it to be smaller, sleeker and somewhere between the current tower and the discontinued XServe. Something more in-line with what the current state of the market would dictate.
 
I'll take your word for it Jeff. Not that it affects me one iota. But its interesting nonetheless.

I'm surprised they didn't staple onto the end of the article, that was why Automatic Duck was now free :D
 
Jeff. True enough...

BUT there's obviously a strugge within the Apple Campus as to where to go.
There was probably a FCP 8 that made Mark happy and saying that we should bet on it.
FCP-X is obviously not that program.

The server and XSAN story MAY be like dropping floppies in a visionary move. But it may also not be so.

Just thinking about how much the iGadgets outsell their computers, is a reality check as to what may very well seem like a logical boardroom decission.

Apple have a very distinct history of leaving users in the cold when they feel like it is the right thing to do.

And their absolute no-communication wit pro base and large lisencee holders, is kinda frustrating, while a mail to the resolve team may end up with a fixed beta within 24 hours...

Arrogance is good in many ways, as Apple and RED have showed a number of times.

But it is laso not the best way to tend to a depending customerbase.
 
Tehben Dean said:
What if the MacPro where to turn into a modular computer along the lines of EPIC. Processor modules, graphics modes, I/O modules, etc. you just stack as many of them up as you want... Infinitely expandable. Now that would be amazing!
Click to expand...

I can't seriously see apple doing that. No track record of modularity that, as far as I know.
On another note, I do know that I would not want to be stuck with buying a new iMac every couple of years. I would rather have a machine where I can upgrade the GPU and ram etc at will!
 
I may have the blinkers on but I cannot (or do not want to believe) that Apple would desert the very pro crowd who have helped make it what it is today. I don't accept all the doomsayers about FCPX - two years from now (with all features added) FCPX will rock. There are principles at the moment within it that really work. Admittedly there are some major problems - not unlike RED 5 years ago. For Apple to desert it's loyal customer base would be the beginning of the end - bit like Polaroid in the 80's. The moment they loose the creative media supporting them they loose the prestige. The moment you stop being pro active to the pro's and reactive to the consumer you loose your cutting edge. It may not be as financially rewarding as an iPad but may be necessary to keep as a loss leader. You loose my integrated work flow and I wont be buying iPad 3 and neither will my media publishing clients. Apple - don't be stupid.
 
I don't think Apple is interested in loss leaders. They're firmly a consumer electronics company now--and they're doing a fantastic job of it. The writing's been on the wall since the dumping of Shake and in every incremental move the company has made since. Apple's core ethos is to simplify and to eliminate the extraneous. I think high-end content creation likely falls into this category; it's no longer their focus.
 
You're right, Gunleik... And this could come true as others are saying...

Another thing we have to consider is that now with Jobs being gone, it's no longer his vision shaping the future of Apple. Steve was very adamant about doing things his way, but he would at least acknowledge the Pro userbase much of the time. In one of his recent comments on where he sees the Mac in the market, he said that he wants the Mac to be an integral part of all media, from creation to consumption. He even referenced the Mac Pro in that line of commentary. Of course, that was close to two years ago at this point now and a lot can change. What I'm worried about is that with Steve no longer at the helm, Apple my lose sight of the Pro users once and for all. I never thought it could happen myself, but then they delivered FCPX. Ultimately, FCPX will be a good product and will serve a pro user base... It is not there yet.

The Mac line-up is pretty nice as it is, but they definitely need a top end workstation. There's a lot of us who buy Macs because we like the OS and having dual Xeon CPUs under the hood. If they kill the Mac Pro, the prospects of myself continuing to buy Apple systems begins to really look weak. I'm an old-school Unix/Irix guy... SGI, Sun, etc.. The Mac, especially the Mac Pro, is still a solid successor to that vein of computer ideology. Linux is too, and I run some Linux systems, but it's not the same thing. Not the best tool for certain tasks. Lacks mainstream codec support, among other things. I'll keep a Macbook Pro and an iMac around to satisfy the need for certain things and to continue iOS development, that sort of stuff... But for my primary workstation where I'm often waiting on CPU intensive tasks, even with 24 threads on 12 cores across 2 CPUs grinding away, there's just no way an iMac is going to cut it. Much like their castration of the 15" Macbook Pro, by removing the ExpressCard slot, I don't think Apple may fully understand the ramifications of what may happen until after they kill a certain product. They at least addressed the ExpressCard issue and agreed they made the wrong decision... But they also never put it back -- presumably because it would've taken more design effort and would have required deviation from their already established path. That and even at the time they killed it on the 15" MBP, they already had Thunderbolt (or Lightpeak, as it was) on their roadmap.

We'll see what happens... But if Apple decides to kill the Mac Pro, it won't be because it's a loss or a dead platform. It's thriving and has enjoyed growing sales over the last three consecutive revisions. If they kill it, it's because it no longer fits within their own ecosystem of iProducts.
 
Apple Needs To Stay Cool

Apple Needs To Stay Cool

Apple needs to keep the high end customers because that is where the cool factor comes from. It's the same reason car companies sponsor race cars. There is about 0% commonality between NASCAR cars and consumer cars these days just like very few Apple users are ever going to need a MacPro. But a lot of people buy Macs because they are cool. That is where the interesting stuff is happening. PCs are boring. If it wasn't for high end gaming there would be nothing interesting at all on the PC side. But if Apple discontinues the MacPro then the really serious users are all going to go somewhere else. And that is where the interesting stuff is going to start happening. And sooner or later that is where everyone else will follow.

Looking at where this could go from here: The next big upgrade of the MacBook Air could go to ARM processors instead of Intel. Basically they would become iPads with keyboards. For the vast majority of users that would be just the sort of machine they need. Battery life would be awesome and they already are doing video editing on the iPad. Not so great for the high end user. But who cares? They are such a small part of the user base. Soon they won't use Intel processors at all. Solves the malware problem when you can only get apps from the App Store. Then the 1984 ad really will be true with Apple as Big Brother.

+1 for Mark Phelan above. We need Red to come out with a line of computers. (Red Tower?) RedOS? (Some sort of Linux? Apple can't last forever and we need an alternative to Windows.)
 
I agree with you Jim, the pro users help define "excellence" ... what is "best" and sometimes "coolness" as well. Apple benefits beyond just a direct P/L vantage point in the market.

However, I will say this was more true when Apple was the underdog and not the biggest company in the world. Competition is far more fierce on the consumer lines, and so much more is at stake. Now that Apple is leading the pack, it's hard to say how much of a benefit they really get from being used by certain elite pros.

For me, it's hard to imagine ever using a PC but I'm someone who bought into the vision and Steve's distortion field 1,000%.

And as an aside, I thought I do remember a post from Mark L. Pederson (who seems to have many inside connections) saying about how the next series of Mac Pros are going to be pretty darn amazing and would help make up for the FCP drama.

I hope he's right -- I don't ever want to be forced to use a PC ..... please don't make me Tim, Jony and the Apple family! :)
 
I'm not a big fan of the hackintosh... especially if Apple does kill the Mac Pro. They will be snubbing their noses at both users and software developers alike. Honestly, who whats to run Maya, Smoke, Modo, Lightwave, Nuke, even After Effects for 2K and larger workflows, and several other high-end, yet mainstream, software packages on an iMac???

If Apple kills the Mac Pro, the vast majority of Mac Pro users will not build a hackintosh. They will go elsewhere. The software I listed above will lose appeal on the Mac platform... Even Adobe Premiere, while it lets us cut 4K and even 5K rather easily on a decent Macbook Pro and an iMac, those are still a far cry from working on a solid Mac Pro installation.

I'm afraid that if Apple makes the pro software users go elsewhere for their hardware, the software developers will go away too. I honestly can't believe this rumor. The last time Apple hosed developers, it forced Adobe to take a decade-long hiatus from the platform. If Apple does it again, developers may not be as forgiving the next time around.
 
I am not buying it. Apple is surely going to move to ARM across all products at some point in the future. Form factors, batter life, fashion and marketing are become much more important to the average consumer than performance as each generation rolls by. The telling fact is that the iPad division makes a lot more money than the Mac division. iOS devices - just three products really - make up for 70+% of Apple's revenues. It is also much cheaper - Apple didn't buy Intrinsity for nothing. A future performance ARM SoC would probably cost Apple $50 to make, while today buying the cheapest Core i5 ULV and its chipset in the basic Macbook Air 11 costs Apple $250+. That would let Apple move to an even slimmer and fashionable chassis, maybe shove in a touchscreen IPS display, much like the "hybrid Ultrabooks" coming with Ivy Bridge and Windows 8. And that is really a lot more appealing to the average consumer than performance they don't need. Mac Mini is essentially a laptop and iMacs are close to being laptops too. Apple is moving slowly but surely to being a consumption company - that's where the money is. But where do you make apps and content for consumption, then? I won't be surprised if there was an ARM-based Mac Pro, then. HP is already rolling ARM servers, and we could see a many-core many-socket ARM Mac Pro in the future. Eventually Mac OS X and iOS are going to merge and Microsoft getting there in 2012 with Windows 8 is another added pressure.

And once everything goes ARM, there will be no Hackintosh on x86 CPUs. However, there could be Hackintosh on chips like NVIDIA's Project Denver (i.e. ARM for the desktops). I just don't think it will be any time soon.

Jim Collins said:
PCs are boring. If it wasn't for high end gaming there would be nothing interesting at all on the PC side.
Click to expand...

If this is not cool, I don't know what is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6cNdhOKwi0&feature=player_embedded. Every tech in that video is already in development and that is most certainly the future of Windows. The UI looks like familar - an evolution of today's Metro UI. If you have been following Windows 8 previews, you will know that's where it is all headed.

But yes, I have been waiting for a Windows alternative forever! I have done my time in recent years on OS X, Ubuntu, Linux Mint, Arch Linux, etc. In reality, most of these OS are quite similar and offer very similar functionality and stability - except for some fine points and that has meant every time I just had to go back to Windows as I was missing something - and that goes far beyond gaming. Something as simple as playing back movies is just a much better experience on Windows thanks to DXVA, madVR and MPC-HC. I wish there would be a proper alternative but there really isn't, not for me. Especially for anything visual, Windows simply has a much stronger ecosystem. In any case, I am 100% platform agnostic. Quite surprised many are refusing to move to PCs (I am not sure what that means, but I assume, Windows), just because. Windows ME was crap, Windows XP lived far too long, but things are different now.
 
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