DSMC2 Skin Tone-Highlight OLPF - HELP

[Brent G Miller Jr]

Quick question for someone that knows quite a bit about the new OLPFs. With the older DSMC Skin Tone-Highlight OLPF I've heard not so many great things; however, I don;t know if the new DSMC2 version is actually a different filter, or just repackaged?

Does anyone use the new version for interviews and such? Do you find it beneficial vs the standard DSMC2 filter?

Thank you all very much!!

 

[Daniel Kelly Brown]

Personally I love the look of the STH olpf. I use it in any bright light shooting situation. It's handy to have the base ISO of 320-500 if you dig shooting wide open when it's bright. Also it's the only Olpf that if have found to eliminate the red orb effect at high aperatures from bright light sources.

I don't use the standard Olpf, if it's a bright shooting condition I got sth and if it's a low light I go with the low light Olpf.

 

[Tom Gleeson]

Brent,

Red to my knowledge have not changed the formulation of the STH OLPF in the DSMC2 variant. To be honest the difference between STH and the STD OLPF is subtle. It's very hard to look at a project and say which OLPF was used. I agree that STH offers some image advantages at the expense of exposure over the LLO but any improvement over the newer STD are minor.

 

[Dan Kanes]

What sensor are you on? I find if I need to do a lot of Off-speed (i.e. medium to high speed 60fps or higher) then the STD OLPF is my friend. STH is pretty good and the basis for the kippertie OLPFS which I absolutely adore.

 

[Tommaso Alvisi]

Brent, I still find the STH the best in my experience but your mileage could vary of course!

For interview settings with controlled lighting and skin tones to be reproduced accurately I'd say it's a no brainer!

 

[Graeme Nattress]

Formulation is the same - packaging changed to fit newer cameras and provide the auto-detect feature.

Graeme

 

[Brent G Miller Jr]

Thank you all for the input!!

 

[Brendan H. Banks]

I'm now making STH the default in camera for any commercial/beauty stuff that doesn't have as much of an intense look. Did some food shooting with it and boy does it really retain true colors and helps with falloff. I do make sure to feed it lots of light though.

Shooting Epic-W (Helium).

 

[AndreasOberg]

Just a quick commend.
Highlight filter is the only filter that fixes the red orbs/dots when looking into the sun at a small aperture. If you need this shot it will be ruined by both standard and low light OLPF.
The highlight filter will also have better colors in bright areas. The difference in saturation is really strong for many colors if it is bright.
However with the highlight filter there will clearly be more noise in the dark areas, you will also see noise creep in the the "medium dark" areas.
Good to know is that when you switch the OLPF filters the image will look the "same" just have more ISO. This is because there is a "hidden" LUT that is being applied to the image that makes sure the image is more similar between the different OLPF, that is at least how I had it explained by a Red technician.

I'm just heading to Falkland where we will film penguins. Our plan is to use Low light for sunset/dusk, and for sunsets probably switch to highlight OLPF so we can shot backlight with the sun straight behind.
Andreas

 

[Trenton Massey]

I am not a fan of the LLO or STH DSMC2 OLPFs. I use STD with most situations unless asked otherwise and find that I personally get better results with it. You'll get the least amount of noise using the STD OLPF. Everyone has their own opinions, research further IMO.

 

[Phil Holland]

Very short description of RED's current OLPF offerings.

- LLO = Low Light Optimized OLPF - "thinnest filter" and the absolute cleanest in Low Light Conditions. Also most prone to Deep Aperture Reflected Sensor Orbs artifacts.
- STD = Standard OLPF - 3% less light transmission than the LLO, but better color (closer to the STH than LLO) and slightly improved protection against optical artifacts.
- STH = Skin Tone - Highlight OLPF - this filter has the most aggressive protection against artifacts and a very good color response, this however comes at the cost of light transmission.

My general way of working with the various OLPFs. If you rate the camera at ISO 800 with the STD OLPF, I tend to recommend the Skin Tone - Highlight OLPF around ISO 320-400 and perhaps the LLO at up to ISO 1000-1280 in some circumstance for a similar noise/grain/image texture feel. I personally generally rate the LLO and STD the same way and really it's the STH you want to be cautious with. However, if you like filming at higher ISO likes 1600 with the STD and LLO, you may actually be very fine with the STH at ISO 800 for instance.

A good test is to punch into Magnify on your ideally exposed image and check out those darker tones to see if you're getting expected results. Even better, shoot tests and pull them into REDCINE-X Pro to inspect your tones and noise levels.

I'll end with the Standard has earned it's name for a reason. Generally speaking it should service you well in most situations. I personally have really been rolling on the STH and STD for a long, long time. Barely whip out the LLO ever. I prefer the general color of the STD and STH.

 

[Mike P.]

Not sure why this old thread was bumped, but I'll throw my 2cents in.

To the OP; the OLPFs are the same between DSMC1 and 2, but DSMC2 is 1/2 a stop cleaner in the low-end and less susceptible to CMOS Smear (due to updated image processing of DSMC2.)

As for the red-dots/iris reflection, it's hard to make them happen with STH, but with the LLO/STND they start showing up at ~f5.6 when pointed at/near a hard light source... Anything >=5.6 and they get *really* noticeable. While super annoying (arguable a design flaw as REDs are far more susceptible than the competition), in the real world it's not too difficult to avoid and personally I think the additional ISO cleanliness the STND has over the STH to be worth it.

 

[Patrick Tresch]

Not sure why this old thread was bumped, but I'll throw my 2cents in.

To the OP; the OLPFs are the same between DSMC1 and 2, but DSMC2 is 1/2 a stop cleaner in the low-end and less susceptible to CMOS Smear (due to updated image processing of DSMC2.)

As for the red-dots/iris reflection, it's hard to make them happen with STH, but with the LLO/STND they start showing up at ~f5.6 when pointed at/near a hard light source... Anything >=5.6 and they get *really* noticeable. While super annoying (arguable a design flaw as REDs are far more susceptible than the competition), in the real world it's not too difficult to avoid and personally I think the additional ISO cleanliness the STND has over the STH to be worth it.

It's exactly what I see with the Monstro, but I didn't see it so early (T5.6) with the Dragon & LLO. I do shoot LLO on my Monstro but now I think I'll take the STO for those direct sunlight situations.

 

[Mike P.]

It's exactly what I see with the Monstro, but I didn't see it so early (T5.6) with the Dragon & LLO. I do shoot LLO on my Monstro but now I think I'll take the STO for those direct sunlight situations.

Pretty sure it depends on the lens when it starts to really show up and anecdotally I've noticed wider lenses seem to be more susceptible. Also in the stop or two prior to when it really shows up, it can actually look like acceptable flares (e.g. a lens that shows harsh red grid at f11, will have softer and bigger circular red "flares" in far a less distinct pattern at f5.6~8.)

The beauty about Monstro is that it retains a clean low-end at ISO1600~2000 with ISOCal2, which is equivalent to ISO3200~4000 on Dragon. Needless to say, using STH on Dragon at ISO3200 (ISOCal1) generally looks like trash (noise so bad that it actually affects colour consistency/accuracy). So, yeah, with Monstro I'd be comfortable even using STH simply because I could ramp it up to ~ISO1600 without worrying about the image breaking down... Plus it's 8k VV. Lol!