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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

DSLR-killer...

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Wow, we're skipping generations before the products even hit the market, whoa! Should I go for the DSLR-killer, or just wait and go with the DSLR-killer Killer?
 
I can't wait to see what RED will create. I just saw the new Lica S2 37Mp DSLR camera... and I heard the price is around 20,000EU! Who can afford these?
 
canon 5D MKII : no Jelly !!!

canon 5D MKII : no Jelly !!!

the venerable Michael Reichmann has given his verdict on Canon 5d MKii's video capability:

"I was on the lookout for Jellocam, an artifact that is seen on any motion camera that uses a CMOS sensor. ......As for the Canon 5D MKII – I see no jello-ish artifacts. I'm not saying that they may not be there, but in the day of shooting that I did, taking quite a few shots to specially look for it, I didn't see any."

more; http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/5dmkiipre.shtml
 
You scooped me ...

You scooped me ...

oxred said:
the venerable Michael Reichmann has given his verdict on Canon 5d MKii's video capability [/url]
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Sorry :sad: -- I didn't see your post and put the same info in the DSMC thread (and I searched for "luminous landscape" but not "Michael Reichmann" before I did so!) Anyway ... your scoop!
 
I have a good body but forgot about the eyes.

I have a good body but forgot about the eyes.

Jim said its a lot harder doing the sensor technology than the lenses really? You can name those making high end lenses on one hand almost and those doing the raw glass definately on one hand. Whilst there are not hundreds of sensor designers there is definately more than lens designers. The learned view is lenses now need to catch up to sensor designs because they are becoming the limiting factor and designing lenses especially a set from the ground up is hugely expensive and time consuming.
Any camera is purely a receptical for the image created in the lens and you need both to be optimised to get the best results so before the "fan boys" get carried away what ever new camera system Red or anyone else develops the lenses are an integral part of that and if Jim is truely the photographer everyone says he is he should know this.
Its exciting that Red maybe turning photography on its head whats sad is the rubbish so many dish out without dealing with facts.
 
The DSLRs I used today do a very fine job of creating the images I need to achieve mine and my clients goals.

I just don't see how someone could design a replacement for both a still camera and movie camera, and work as well as the two drastically different designs work today. Maybe a compromise for the amateur market it could work, like today's Canon and Nikons are headed. For working pro's I'm just not sure.

I think to "turn photography on it's head" would be designing a high resolution image capturing device that no longer used optics at all. Some kind of three dimensional scan of a space that you could compose and focus in post.

Now that would be something.
 
oxred said:
the venerable Michael Reichmann has given his verdict on Canon 5d MKii's video capability:

"I was on the lookout for Jellocam, an artifact that is seen on any motion camera that uses a CMOS sensor. ......As for the Canon 5D MKII – I see no jello-ish artifacts. I'm not saying that they may not be there, but in the day of shooting that I did, taking quite a few shots to specially look for it, I didn't see any."

more; http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/5dmkiipre.shtml
Click to expand...

So does this mean people are going to go out and start shooting movies with these cameras? Maybe home movies but not much else. Now if they could start capturing raw frames at 24fps for at least five or ten minutes per CF card - that would be a start. Right now I don't think the absolute best DSLRs can even record and save one or two frames per second in real time.
 
fde101 said:
Why can't they target a better camera than the 1Ds mark III and release it for less than $3k?

Just look at what they are doing with the Scarlet...

I don't know if this is what they have in mind, but I wouldn't put it past them...
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The new standard for professional still cameras is 20-25MP. For very demanding work it's even higher with the new Leica at 37 and Hasse at 50MP.

All these cameras capture and save the data in lossless compressed raw formats. For high end still work that is essential.

How can a digital movie camera record data at anywhere near these rates with our current level of technology? Someday I'm sure we will, but today - ?
 
How will AF-S lenses work on this? Will the censors be full frame? I ask this because I just purchased a Nikon DX lens and am curious if that was an unwise decision, seeing as I will be buying this DSMC when it comes out!
 
Look here: http://www.red.com/cameras/technology

That comparison of sensor sizes helped my decision making process allot. As a student, I don't want to pay allot of money for good lenses, which can just shoot good fotos...of course we won't get any answer on specifics about the new product pallette, that should be clear after all the 45k pages in this thread and all the other threads about the new wonders.

Sooo as I see it, RED uses sensors the size of a regular APS-C still camera...like the D90. Good news, since I don't expect them going to full format, especially not for a DSLR-Killer, which will be a small fish in their tank of big sharks. I am going to buy the D90 despite what Jim said and what i saw with my own eyes, since I'm not a professional. Until RED comes out with the new era of picture capturing, i will buy some decent lenses for my lame D90 and make my little movies with that setup. If you can use DX lenses on the RED one (which you can I think), you won't have to fear incompatibility for the DSMC either...however, not knowing what exactly is going to happen at the end of the year makes my life allot more exciting!
 
Well it's all speculation at this stage huh.. but if RED are not planning to put a full frame sensor in their "DSLR killer" it'll be interesting to hear their arguments for that decision.. :)
 
Their current high end 1:1 backs have chips rated at 39MP the P45+ and the newest model, the P65+ at 60.5MP. The P45+ will shoot an equivalent resolution, dynamic range and quality of 5x4 film, eclipsing medium format. The new P65+ will shoot a file that will rival a 8x10 negative!
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IMHO not true,I currently use the P45+and also shoot 5x4 and 10x8 film.
The P45+ is a fantastic back,I'm not sure I would say it's better than 2 1/4 film,it's a completely different beast, although the quality comes close to 5x4 film. The P65+ is an unknown quantity as it isn't currently shipping. The only way to rival the resolution and dynamic range of 10x8 film with digital capture is to use one of the high end Betterlight (www.betterlight.com) scanning backs.
In a commercial situation,the P45+ is more than is required for high end press reproduction.
However all this is to completely miss the point,the main reason to use 10x8 is the point of view that such cameras give you,and that can't be rivalled by any other format no matter how good the resolution. A 10x8 camera gives you a very unique view of the world around you,so if you want to have that option film is currently the only way.
If you take a look at what is being researched with Giga pixel capture for astronomy,
it would probably be possible to build a 10x8 digital capture back,although the lenses wouldn't hold up,even the beautiful Cooke 10x8's.
Lenses are the critical factor and probably the weakest link in digital photography,moving or still.
Tom.
 
fwdinc said:
You've forgotten one. Hassy's competitor at 60mp.
http://www.phaseone.com/

Perhaps this is what Jim has targeted.

cd
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I didn't forget about it, just think it's in the same league with the Hasse. I don't think a mainstream DSLR needs to be that big. 20MP is more than enough for the bulk of the work going on. I just don't see how any camera in the near future can record 20MP frames at 24fps - raw and uncompressed to a CF card. I think in order to have usable still frames from motion capture you would need to do this. So I am very curious what Jim has in mind.
 
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