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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Do YOU want 6k??

Do YOU want 6k??

  • Total voters
    325
Right now I don't NEED 6K. But I have nothing against having the option to shoot 6K if I want to. I still use the 4KHD mode a lot for HD deliverables, but I'm happy to be able to use the 5K mode in some situations. ;)
 
Of course I want 6K. With 6k I have a camera that's a true dsmc in terms of photo and cinema quality after debayer. Not that the current sensor is not capable of great stills-it is, and the Vogue shoot is a big proof of it- but this would cement it. With the Epic form factor this would open the door for many other possibilities for us owners. Also, I never saw where going 6k would mean a compromise in DR, Low light, frame rates? These will surely improve, Red has revolutionized the market and I'm sure that they will do it again with the Dragon. If I could I would preorder and put my money where my mouth is right now on it even without a single frame grab or definite spec list out. The Epic is simply brilliant, and I do not expect anything else from the Dragon and the Red team!
 
IF resolution was the only deciding factor between 2 equally capable cameras (in terms, say, of usability and dynamic range) and there was a strong push towards higher res (i.e. for instance minimal difference in post-production costs), then I'd say that it'd be hard to find someone who wouldn't want more resolution. If you ask "do you actually NEED 6k, 8k", at this point in time, I think the majority of people (not all, mind you) would say no.
 
I think for me the question which matters is, "What kind of timeframe do we have to decide whether to upgrade to 6K?"

I have no immediate need for 6K - but if 4K truly becomes a viable delivery system for me within the next 2-3 years, I would love my cameras to still be eligible for the upgrade. It is more of a timing question than anything else.

Meanwhile, the ROCKET remains the bottleneck. I'd rather have a faster, more portable ROCKET which I can afford for all my systems RIGHT NOW than just about anything else that RED could re-invent. That and delivery systems for all these Ks.
 
Like many, I don't have a need for it now, but I like the fact that they are pushing the bar higher. IMAX looks awesome, and the closer we get, then better off we are.

But also like others here, I would complain about the post work flow solution, and this is where I think red is dropping the ball. Most people complaining about Red target the workflow. RED Rocket is the achilles heal because they have closed down the post work flow. IT's controlling the debayering the hurts us most going into a 6k world. If RED was to open up their technology to licence it for a reasonable amounts to someone say Black Magic, AJA, and Matorx, then they can create a variety of options for post work flows so RED works properly within an edit suite, and editing programs. This grading, render to a process or DNX flavour is very backwards, then have the pain in the ass relinks to get everything to work properly, I can see why people go to a Alexia proress work flow.

I don't want to be required to use a specific editing package. I have a lot of money invested in an avid/resolve system, and I don't want to switch to premiere.

Am I keen on a 6k sensor, yes. Will I upgrade... No, not now. It's too painful to think about the workflow.

What would I kill for? A 4k Black Magic card for Red, that work native on avid in 4k realtime. If playback in Camera can flip r3d files in full resolution then why the heck can't avid.
 
Vino Harris said:
I have to see the stats on the scarlet going to 6K because the cost of moving up only 1K is crazy. They said the Scarlet 4K is just likr the epic 4K but I can't see it. It looks like consumer video to me vs the beauty of the Epic. I know..you get what you pay for. I wish we had the option of ordering the camera without the photo option because I don't need to shoot stills and for the future I don't think they should follow the dslr format.

Last thing...I haven't seen a movie on the big screen shot with a Scarlet from hollywood but they have shot a movie using 8mm film...hmmmmm
Click to expand...

The scarlet and epic have an identical picture, set the epic to 4k and 6:1 compression, you can't tell the difference.
 
I asked why not use a scarlet for a hollwood film for a reason. We know what the Epic can do but what can a scarlet do? All the footage that I have seen has been garbage with no cine look at all! i want to feel good about what the camera can do by seeing not by rumors. i guess i have to do it myself due to the videos from the Novice world.
 
The scarlet X has not shocked the world like the RED One did without the MX due to the resolution of the footage. It seems that everything has been so watered down that people have compared the scarlet footage to the Sony FS 100 and it's damn close!!! Maybe this is why they need to move to a 6K chip because it hurt their rep. Unless someone proves me wrong or I here some shocking news about what this camera can do I will always feel like we purchased a red one MX & Epic knock off. ooooh look I own a Red camera so i can do a documentary, home video or weddings...well I say the hell with that I do feature films and I need them to look like feature films instead of another straight to DVD video smothered with film effects so it can look like a film down graded video movie.
 
Vino Harris said:
All the footage that I have seen has been garbage with no cine look at all! i want to feel good about what the camera can do by seeing not by rumors. i guess i have to do it myself due to the videos from the Novice world.
Click to expand...

Yes why don't you show all of us novices how it's done since you both own a Scarlet, and as you put it, are a director and a cine man.

We will be waiting for your exquisitely shot cine look.

All the Best!

Dave
 
I understand the question - and the short answer is "Yes". But.. I rather see the energy to be used to finish the camera and make it a proper full function camera - Ot make a pro version and a consumer version - that is the way that i see it - Red Rocket is needed - Red Rocket in a small mobile station is needed - And i mean small - We don't need autofocus in a Pro version - Rather want durability - and chip´s where you don't have a "heat". Problem.. Starting solving the issues before we step any where else - There is a lot of situation´s where i simply love shooting on the RED Epic - but then again the Alexa is a beautiful machine as well - So to be short i choose the camera that fit´s the job i am shooting the most - and in many way´s i will contunie doing that - being H.264 (hahahahah) versus

Peter

____________________

www.peterriis.com
riis@me.com
 
David W. Jones said:
Yes why don't you show all of us novices how it's done since you both own a Scarlet, and as you put it, are a director and a cine man.

We will be waiting for your exquisitely shot cine look.

All the Best!

Dave
Click to expand...

Here is some behind the scenes for something he shot/directed.

gallery-img1.jpg


gallery-img8.jpg


http://www.c22b.com/index-4.html

Vino, is this video online? I'm sure many here would love to take a look at your work.
 
Before this gets nuts with the whole "Novice" comment...

I think EPIC has proven itself with all the features out and it certainly has a cine look to it. Prometheus certainly blew me away when I saw the trailer at the IMAX so I look forward to seeing the film itself hopefully in the IMAX...

I think 5K I feel is more than enough for RIGHT NOW, the next leap would be either FF/Medium Format sensor leaping over the 6K now I guess into the 8K/9K region and then jumping again to 12K then 28K region for the IMAX level camera but every so often I wouldn't mind RED taking a step back and refining what is at that time, more than likely, the highest rez sensor around
so right now I wouldn't mind seeing 5K dynamic range pushed to, as people seem to request, C300 level - I think once pushing it to this level then moving up to the next resolution level one could see the improvement gains go further on the next sensor, it would be only a small improvement on dynamic range maybe compared to the previous fix but it would mean that the focus is on resolution...

Unless I'm missing something and the only way to push the ISO/dynamic range would be to increase the K...then I'm all for it. TBH I love resolution so I'm good either way but maybe a neat way to please everyone

Hopefully it isnt a total ramble and someone can see what I mean but as far as it goes, I'm happy with everything RED has done so far and depending on the final specs I may do like some and pass until the next leap


EDIT:
I mention the EPIC made films because I think we should've got the message by now that they are essentially the same camera minus frame rates, dynamic range is the same...unless I again missed a memo that says otherwise
 
Says the guy showcasing fifteen minutes of behind-the-scenes footage of four Estonian guys standing around the tundra looking at a hole in the ice.
 
Ben Smith said:
Says the guy showcasing fifteen minutes of behind-the-scenes footage of four Estonian guys standing around the tundra looking at a hole in the ice.
Click to expand...

Yes, the same one in talks with 2 companies about securing the exclusive online distribution rights to a behind the scenes series based the footage you mention. A deal that could potentially pay for the entire film. Two companies that approached me. Yes, that guy.

I always said these little behind the scenes videos are a work in progress. They aren't perfect, but I prefer spending my time doing something productive and positive rather than just sitting on a forum talking shit all day like so many newcomers here like you.
 
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