Do DITs Have A Future?

[Gunleik Groven]

DIT is all about the KIT - Invest all your pay in your KIT and you will never stop working.

DIT WITH KIT IS GOLDEN - We preach/teach our clients to WORSHIP DIT. For DIT is all powerful and
"one day lost is worth the cost"

$@DIT=KIT

LOL

I get all my jobs because of what I know, never because of what I have...

interesting perspective difference...

But then again, I am not really into rentals...

 

[Tim Whitcomb]

LOL

I get all my jobs because of what I know, never because of what I have...

interesting perspective difference...

But then again, I am not really into rentals...

LOL- I hear ya... our knowledge leads us to killer kit. R3D - Raids. Color Calibrated Display (Digital IMAGE Technician) Video Village Ipad Dailies. Teradeks. etc etc etc

We even sell the back up drives and LTO tapes (and mark up for convenience) to ensure quality. It all adds up.

Without a question our expertise is what keeps our friends coming back... and that knowledge is expressed in KILLER KIT!

 

[Florian Stadler]

I used to be of the thinking that you are shooting RAW, you and your camera department know the camera/exposure implications, etc. All you need is a Data Wrangler/Loader.
I have since set up a signal processing chain with a DIT and Resolve on set and it has improved the quality of my dailies, the vision communicated to post and clients, the excitement level about footage shot on set and through post and ultimately the END RESULT.
DIT's need to return to creative dailies coloring if they want to provide value to a production.

 

[Gunleik Groven]

I used to be of the thinking that you are shooting RAW, you and your camera department know the camera/exposure implications, etc. All you need is a Data Wrangler/Loader.
I have since set up a signal processing chain with a DIT and Resolve on set and it has improved the quality of my dailies, the vision communicated to post and clients, the excitement level about footage shot on set and through post and ultimately the END RESULT.
DIT's need to return to creative dailies coloring if they want to provide value to a production.

AND be able to give the DP qualified advices, communicate with online and VFX and know when stuff needs to be done differently and how...

 

[Mark Toia]

This is all really sad for you guys,

I hope you find a solution soon.

In AUS usually the (X loader / Camera assistant) backs up data for us instead of loading film...

So nothing has really changed over here other than FILM not being part of the equation, replace with SSD drives. Everyone still has a job still...

 

[Alexander Ibrahim]

I agree with Gunleik.

The knowledge of how these camera systems operate should reside with the camera crew ... DP's are still learning though.

Setting looks on set never makes much sense to me. As DP I like to prep the camera. If I am on a Red shoot I will set up my own curves and such and load them to the camera.

I do that during prep ... never on set.

I never use a DIT. That's because I know the cameras, and I don't need that level of help. I usually DP one or two camera shows ... so the workload isn't that high.

On a larger shoot, multiple units, multiple cameras a DIT becomes more important. I need someone to help me make sure technical standards are being upheld and are consistent. Think of the video engineers job at a large event shoot in EFP.

I do need a good "digital loader" someone who can assure data integrity. Sometimes I can settle for a competent PA, with some computer background doing simple copies. (DSLR shoots, I'm looking at you!) Very occasionally I can just record on fresh media all day and transfer back at basecamp. (This happens a lot on outdoor shoots on lo-no budget.)

Where I think there is a strong future is in integrating the role of DIT with post production. They can do a lot of logging and such ... including reattaching some metadata. Some here have mentioned that. I think there is great value to sorting all that stuff out on set. All the people who might have a bit of missing data are present, and they still remember the shot. Also, one thing I like to have is an on-going edit of the shoot. I want to make sure I really have all the pieces. If I've done pre-vis, I like to see pieces dropped in to replace that material.

The industry needed the DIT as a bridge between the past and the future. We still need them, but the day will come when they are superfluous on most productions - or when their role is so transformed it will have a new name.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

DIT is all about the KIT - Invest all your pay in your KIT and you will never stop working.

In my area, this is pretty much the case. It's about what hardware you can bring to the table and at what price. DIT's here are viewed as nothing more than glorified data managers and offload technicians. On-set backup monkeys.

I hate working as a DIT if that is to be my function. In this capacity, the DIT is definitely a position with a bleak future. My EPIC-M kit already has more than enough media to go an entire day of intense shooting with no need to offload. Most narrative jobs, even "fast-paced" ones can't use up half of the media I own in a 12-hour day on just one camera. The only reason most jobs want a DIT on-set is so they can have someone collecting footage and making dailies. Smaller jobs don't even want that. About 2/3rds of the jobs want the footage handed over as ProRes (422 HQ, not even 4444) or DNxHD 1080p at the end of the shoot and they don't give a rat's ass about R3D RAW. Half the crew and the producer continuously make comments about how cool the RED cameras are, but can't figure out why we don't just shoot on the 7D, 5D2 or AF100... RED only exists on-set because they were curious enough to try it or because the director and/or DP insisted it was the best way to go for the production. Most of the [self-proclaimed and so-called] DP's in my town are complete hacks and couldn't light their way out of a cardboard box if they had to. Most are used to shooting low to mid range HD cameras. It's really quite sad. Not all of them, though. There are a few around here that I work with on a regular basis, who know their shit.

DIT WITH KIT IS GOLDEN - We preach/teach our clients to WORSHIP DIT. For DIT is all powerful and
"one day lost is worth the cost"

I lay it out for the clients in much the same way. I have to completely ignore the data management aspect of the job when trying to extoll the virtues of a good DIT. As I mentioned, most productions don't understand that simply offloading data is not really what a DIT is for. I try to explain to them that the DIT is the guy who is in-charge of getting the best image possible from the camera. He's the guy that monitors all the footage, creates looks, dailies, rushes, talks directly to the DP and director about any potential issues, even a bit of extra noise or more clipping than desired in an image.

Unfortunately, most productions still have a hard time wrapping their head around it all. They tend to walk into it with the notion that the DIT is a data monkey, intern-level position. Someone that will bring a Macbook Pro and they can hand them a USB hard drive or two and just have their footage at the end of the day. And sadly, there's a bunch of guys out there with nothing more than a Macbook Pro and handful of FW800 HDD's, trying to call themselves DIT's. And they really have no qualifications other than knowing how to copy files.

I haven't had a "real" DIT job in close to 3 months. Only one since getting my EPIC-M, and at the end of the job I handed over two HDD's with 1080p ProRes transcodes. They didn't want the R3D's, but I put them on the drives anyway. At least the director and I had a good synergy going and we took the time to create looks on set. I at least got paid a decent rate to show up with a real system on a cart and actually do a good job. Too bad it was only a 2-day commercial shoot. Oh well.

 

[Dan Kanes]

So, I think we can conclusively say there is a near future, sort of, for DIT's, but that things are changing rapidly.

For those of us who are members of IATSE Local 600 maybe we can work together to inform our regulatory board of things like Best Standards and Practices, and our need for ensured hiring practices, and defense against those who might downplay our abilities.

There are contractual hiring practices for assistants, the same should apply for us.

I'm having no shortage of work, but that could be completely different next week, and the whole idea of a union is:

LOOK OUT FOR OUR BROTHERS AND SISTERS, and TAKE CARE OF OUR OWN - that means Guild-Wide.

Something several in this thread may not know or care about.

And as for the Golden Kit, I offer this:

[video]http://www.youtube.com/wmdEg3T8IOM[/video]

 

[David Kruta]

Well said, everyone.

I'm currently on a feature that pays much less than commercials, but the creativity and collaboration I get here are really what I love best about DITing. I work with the DP and gaffer (a bit unconventional, it seems, but he's very open and willing to get the most out of me), and we set looks and exposure and create the mood for the film. Dailies go to the director and producers with the looks attached, and everyone is happy.

I've been on too many commercial shoots where all they want is a data monkey, with DPs with big egos and no knowledge of the camera systems, and producers that want you to do a backup to 1 USB drive. I agree that education is the best option here. Productions are doing themselves a disservice by not knowing what a DIT should and can be doing. I was recently handed a paycheck with an incorrect rate, and was told with complete honesty that there were no mistakes - you get the 2nd's rate, right? This just shows me that there is not enough information out there.

That being said, I do see this as a position that is going to disappear, or evolve into something different. With this generation of upcoming DPs that know the technology, and the ability to start setting looks in-camera, the DIT position will have to adapt. There will be loaders, and there will be something between an assistant editor and DIT. My goal is to use my DIT experience as a stepping stone to DP.

 

[Tom.Wong]

in my opinion, a DIT that does his/her job as they are supposed to, and do it right will get the work, if not, than you just need to work harder and get better. the Kit helps a lot, but are all just a means for you to do your job even better. If your skill is lacking than the gear isn't gonna do shit for you. As for productions feeling like they don't need one, than good on them, there are equal amount of productions that feel like they do. With the huge amount of productions out there, it's gonna be saturated with plenty of projects that will skimp. Nothing you can really do about that, and if they just want a data monkey, they get a data monkey. That's not what we do, it's now just a part of it, because who better to handle the backups than the person looking at all the aspects of the footage. But evaluating critical exposure, doing on set color, providing dailies or rushes, and in general being a workflow bridge to post is a huge deal. The pace of certain productions alone, most of them stay in a baked in codec workflow, and it's literally faster and most cost effect to have a DIT provide a digital lab on set. I've saved productions days in post by providing what the needed already right off of set, and I work very hard on discussing workflow and what needs to come off set to make their lives easier when it all hits the back end.

If productions don't care or need that, or want it and just want to dump it all on the editors the next day and have a big post headache, so be it. The only way to have job security in my opinion is just to work your ass off, and work even harder than that. If you're that guy that's absolutely clutch because of you, and what you bring to the table, than you'll be hired.

 

[Zakaree Sandberg]

everything remains good and steady in the commercial world..

Ive heard about the Studios Nixing DIT's from any tv shows... (heard about the pilot only deals too)


Bottom Line...

Know the gear.. If you can basically fix anything or figure out a solution to everything in the camera truck.. your good
its not all about backing up data..

the one thing going for DIT's is the rapidly changing environment.. new cameras popping up left and right.. new ways of doing things.. so on...

keep on the ball.. know the new equipment before anyone else does..

this is what we do. we are the geek squad of the movie biz...

I get people coming up to me at work all day long asking about random non camera or film equipment tech questions... its hilarious... whats sad is that I usually know the answers

 

[M Most]

I agree with Gunleik.

As do I.

Setting looks on set never makes much sense to me. As DP I like to prep the camera. If I am on a Red shoot I will set up my own curves and such and load them to the camera.

I also agree with that - with the added comment that I really don't see the need for "in camera looks" in the first place. The camera is a capture device, and captures what you point it at using the "normal" tools of photography - namely, framing, exposure, and filtration. And while I realize there are times when the art department doesn't get you what you asked for, and times when lighting time is short, shooting time is not the time you should be thinking about what you're going to create if it's not in front of the camera in the first place. That is a post function, where the tools, the environment, and the expertise are uniquely set up to do just that.

On a larger shoot, multiple units, multiple cameras a DIT becomes more important. I need someone to help me make sure technical standards are being upheld and are consistent. Think of the video engineers job at a large event shoot in EFP.

Now we get to the heart of the matter. The DIT position was developed out of the video controller's position in live video. When video cameras first started appearing on single camera shows, they were just that - video cameras. Things like the F900, the LDK series, and even the Viper were video cameras that required a video engineer to set them up correctly and maintain them. The control systems and expertise involved were engineering functions, not DP or AC functions. Because of their limitations, it was also necessary to capture an image that was reasonably close to the final look that was desired, because they didn't have a lot of flexibility in post (more than most camera people assumed, but not quite enough in some circumstances). Cut to 2011. That is no longer the case. The tools of modern single camera digital cinematography are no longer video cameras that require live shading. They don't require an engineer to tweak a matrix, and they don't require a technician to replace a broken head in a VTR. I would make the case that unless you really want to see something other than what you're actually shooting, they don't require "in camera looks" either. The camera itself, with a proper output path for monitoring set up in prep, already gives you a "look." It's up to you as a cinematographer to create what it's photographing.

I do need a good "digital loader" someone who can assure data integrity. Sometimes I can settle for a competent PA, with some computer background doing simple copies. (DSLR shoots, I'm looking at you!) Very occasionally I can just record on fresh media all day and transfer back at basecamp. (This happens a lot on outdoor shoots on lo-no budget.)

Agree again.

Where I think there is a strong future is in integrating the role of DIT with post production. They can do a lot of logging and such ... including reattaching some metadata. Some here have mentioned that. I think there is great value to sorting all that stuff out on set. All the people who might have a bit of missing data are present, and they still remember the shot.

I would go further than that. I would say that the data wrangler should almost be part of the editorial department, or at least consult with a representative of editorial prior to and during production. In the best circumstances, this is already the case, but in many cases it's not. There are many reasons for that, but one of the ones that I'm beginning to sense is a combination of territorialism and job protection. Going forward, there is going to be less tolerance for both of those things. Departmentalism works well on a set because there's a lot of physical work to be done and not enough time to do it. It doesn't work so well between a data wrangler and editorial because the ultimate need in that dynamic is that of editorial, not production. And it's not really that complicated - editorial just wants to know what was shot, plain and simple. It's their job to sort it out and organize it for the editor, not to have to find things that aren't advertised or things that are misidentified. But that's no different than it's been with film for almost 100 years now. That's why camera reports and proper labeling on film cans were part of the job. They still are.

The industry needed the DIT as a bridge between the past and the future. We still need them, but the day will come when they are superfluous on most productions - or when their role is so transformed it will have a new name.

I would suspect the new name might be something like "camera prep technician," employed by the camera supplier. And/or "data prep technician," employed by the production as a bridge to editorial. My feeling is that it won't be "on set colorist", because I think that's possibly a short lived phenomenon. Just like 'Technicolor color consultant."

Alexander, I don't think I've ever agreed with more points on a Reduser post. We've got to stop meeting like this.... :cheers2:

 

[Michael Panfeld]

... and that knowledge is expressed in KILLER KIT!

which just begs for a t-shirt that says: "Got Kit?"

 

[Dan Kanes]

^disagree with 75% of this^

This is a typical post-centric mentality.

One reason that production budgets have deflated and post-production budgets have ballooned. "we can fix that later" is not part of my mantra.

In fact it shows a disregard for cinematography in contemporary times, and assumes too much about conditions in a working environment.

 

[Michael Panfeld]

You guys are not looking at the big picture.

I really can't say what will happen to DITs, but I can say that the most likely job to be cut in the signal chain is the editor. Well, not cut per se, but offshored: India, actually. And this is not me opining. Film/tv editors are on a list of jobs likley to be offshored that was produced by the US government a few years ago.

It makes a lot of sense too, given what the DP and DIT can do on-set now with LUTs and the ability to carry metadata in the file, Combine that with NLEs and fast internet file transfers and the editor can be located anywhere ih the world. India's Bollywood is a huge industry, it is English-speaking, and has low wages. Additionally, given the time differences, editors/colorists in India can work while their American counterparts are sleeping (12 on, 12 off, of course) which could shorten the post process while also lowering the costs.

The India/Hollywood connection has already been bridged by Reliance with its acquisition of DTS Digital Images, its 1.5 billion dollar JV with Spielberg's Dreamworks, and its attempt to buy MGM outright.

I would argue that if that does happen, if basic editing and coloring go offshore, the functions that the DIT performs become even more important. Whether the DIT's functions are absorbed by the DP, loader, A/C etc or wheter the DIT position remains intact is a secondary issue.

 

[Dustin Cross]

I mostly do features. Producers I work with realize I actually save them money. DIT is expensive, but a good DIT can save production a ton of money over their cost. What is getting cut is the lab. On features I do a lot of the lab work and the assistant editor does the rest.

Plus every year more technical digital cameras come out. DPs (and producers) don't have time to keep up with all the technology changes. That is what a DIT should be doing. If the DP is an owner operator, maybe he doesn't need a DIT, but that is not your typical professional DP. When the F65 comes out, you will want a DIT. When you have your first Alexa/Codex job, you will want a DIT. DITs have to keep moving forward with the technology. Those that do will have a job.

As a DIT I work very close with post. I make sure what we are doing in camera works with what post needs. I start calling post in preproduction if they are hired, but I am not part of post. A big part of that is my bias. Local 600 has the best contracts. Local 700 seems pretty weak to me. I don't want DITs to be treated like VFX artists. You also have all those old video engineer DITs that think we should be part of Video Assist. Again I like being part of 600. There is a DIT position in the Video Assist union, but it is stupid. All those guys are doing is getting experience and then leaving for Local 600 because the contracts are better.

DIT has a future as long as you keep up with the technology.



Dustin Cross
Local 600 DIT

 

[Bing Bailey]

I do see DIT morphing or going away as the new breed of dp is tech savy

 

[David Battistella]

THE PERFECT DIT

A film professional who understands modern digital workflows and cameras.
You have to know Camera department and Editorial
A DIT is the bridge between these departments

Problems:
The unionis were slow on the uptake for this position, nobody knew how to define it. Some called it a digital loader, some called it something else. All wrong. Producers do not want to pay for another position on set so you better be providing a lot of services and support to the production.

At the very top level a DIT can:

Provide Camera support
Set camera looks with the DOP
Manage all of the data generated by the camera
Make three copies of the data with an audit trail
Provide digital dallies
Do a visual verification of the data and takes
Get certified by a local film bonding agency to prove that your methods are sound and protect the production and the data integrity
Provide next day LTO (if required)

This means a DIT should be equipped with at least two computers with Redrocket cards.
Computer A back ups and visual verification
Computer B render digital dailles (if required)

Producers should understand that a person who is doing this job is responsible and using the correct tools. When I hear about production hiring a guy in a baseball hat with a laptop and three FW drives I get nervous. Toronto is a great example of where there are some really great companies who provide an excellent high quality service. Bling Digital is one, PS is another.

When explained properly a DIT can easily save production money.

As long as you are professional, provide excellent service and show producers how your service protect them and the production, the rest is easy.

I never understand producers who spend a lot of money to get the images and then want to hand all of that digital negative information over to a 100$ position. They just don't respect the images they are generating.

David

 

[Michael Panfeld]

I never understand producers who spend a lot of money to get the images and then want to hand all of that digital negative information over to a 100$ position.

David, those are the same producers who spend most of their budget on lenses/camera and then put an ad on CL for a sound guy at $100/day and who "must have his own equipment".

 

[M Most]

^disagree with 75% of this^

This is a typical post-centric mentality.

One reason that production budgets have deflated and post-production budgets have ballooned. "we can fix that later" is not part of my mantra.

In fact it shows a disregard for cinematography in contemporary times, and assumes too much about conditions in a working environment.

Well, the fact is that an hour of post is a hell of a lot cheaper than an hour of production, allowing you many hours to do whatever you need to do for a lot less than you're going to spend if you hold up production to do it. I don't feel I'm expressing a "post centric" view. In fact, I've always been all about doing as much in camera as you possibly can. What I'm saying is that tweaking of the camera is no longer necessary. And that "looks" done in production - besides taking time - are not always reliable anyway because the physical conditions of production work against that being the case. I'm not showing any disregard for cinematography at all. In fact, I'm saying that it is more important than most people give it credit for. I've been a member of Local 600 since the late 90's (I'm also a member of Local 700) and was a visual effects supervisor - primarily on set - for over 8 years. So I have a great appreciation for and a pretty good degree of understanding regarding production and the talents of the cinematographer. However, the same fast pace of technological changes that brought you things like Red is also responsible for the diminishing need for things like video engineers and camera shaders in anything other than live broadcast situations. Modern digital cinematography cameras give you great images when you don't fuck with them - which is what a lot of "on set look creation" stuff is all about doing. That's very different than it's been in the past, but it has nothing at all to do with the talents of the cinematographer, and the use of framing, lighting, and filtration to create the art.