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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Coming out of Beta...

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Deanan said:
$350k not including SR deck, codex, S2, etc.
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Sony said it was 250K just for the camera itself but everyone else keeps saying it's 350K. I'm glad you guys have stuck with 17.5K. My abacus can't take all this number crunching. :w00t:
 
$250K it is... I stand corrected. Not including lens, SR deck, codex, S2, etc.

Jim
 
chuckt said:
Jim,
The best policy would be to put as many cameras in the hands of people as you possibly can make, as soon as possible.
You can fix the bugs later and upgrade the early adopter's cameras later.
Let the world see the first version of RED in the hands of professionals.
do not wait until all the bugs are fixed.
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That would be suicide for RED. It's already an unknown. They're already making big claims and promising a whole lot. Delivering a half-assed first attempt would be the image they would be stuck with for the rest of existance.

New is always more scrutinized than "known" because it has to prove its worth.

When RED says "our camera is ready" it has to be ready or else their credibility would be forever tarnished. Especially since REDOne looks to be the primary platform that they'll be marketing for at least the next 18 months. They have no playstation sales to fall back on... it's an all or nothing proposition with only one chance to get right.

While many indies are excited about RED and its value you look at a lot of big productions and they can't afford to take a risk. RED has to present it self as a safe bet. They have to be known as something you can trust and rely on. You won't be fired for renting a $250,000 camera. You might be fired if your camera stops rolling and can't be resurrected.

RED is making sure they get it right. Rushing something isn't going to win them any friends in the long run.
 
I had asked a Sony Asia Marketing Director how much the F35 costs and she replied over 7 figures. $250-$350 is more like the price of the F23 which I have seen listed. But like all these prices make any real difference to all of us anyway.
 
FIRST:

I am glad the Red is out of beta!!!! I was to buy 198...but waited until this camera was ready...can't wait for build 15 to try one.

2nd: The Red is about on average 25 to 28k with acc. not only 17.5k. The F23 is about 105k without a deck. But it has a viewfinder..etc
The F35 has a price of about 225 to 250k now. ( without lens, batt, media recorder) It will be lower after it goes to market. Panasonic should show their large chip ( Varicam...most likely!) at NAB 2008. This will certainly bring Sony's price lower. I wouldn't be surprized to see sony and pana with a large chip...( 8meg to 12 meg) camera for around 90k.

Better pictures for all.................Soon!!!

FYI the Sony ex-1 looks great with a 35 adapter( great pictures) until you get your red..( and not expensive )

(ps) will probably buy a Red sometime in late spring...I will have to way and see 15!
 
Jannard said:
$250K it is... I stand corrected. Not including lens, SR deck, codex, S2, etc.
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My guess is that this is precisely why so many would like to have Red One as soon as possible. There is simply no temporary subsititue available at the moment.

In my case, for example, I'm starting to film a new three year wildlife document project, which will go to international distribution. The current guess is that will get the camera in May or June. So, in the mean time some other camera would be wellcome. But then, looking of the cameras which are available, nothing becomes technically even close in the same price range. All the cameras with 4:2:0 color space are out of question. The best alternative would be the SI-2K, but it costs already the same as Red One, if not even more, especially if the camera is bought from Europe. In addition, they don't have an electric adapter for the long Canon EF lenses, which are a must in wildlife films.

So, all what one can do is just wait and hope RED and Birger manages to get everything sorted out as quickly as possible. Maybe RED has already got many of the parts produced and will be able to speed up the production once the beta stage is over?

Of course, thinking the other way around, highly appreciate that RED has been so open in this development process. It would not have been a pleasure to invest in some expensive camera system and then find out that a much better one came to the markets immediately afterwards. And yes, it's just the right thing to say we should not do any plans until the camera is in our hands. It's just so difficult to follow the advice! But, better to stay calm and wait and see. Just my two cents while waiting ...
 
Audio still in Beta?

Audio still in Beta?

Just wondering if audio has been all sorted out or are we still going to wait for that update when we get our cameras?

Sorry if this has been addressed I have been working out of touch for a while.
 
Russ Fill said:
Just wondering if audio has been all sorted out or are we still going to wait for that update when we get our cameras?

Sorry if this has been addressed I have been working out of touch for a while.
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Apparently resolved with build 13 (present build).
 
Going back a bit, even if the Mysterium WAS made in Israel..
well, Ive recently come back from visiting the Intel facilities around Haifa and I can tell you that theres more than enough top end expertise and facilities flowing through the country to match anyone else when it comes to semiconductor design and manufacture
 
earthling said:
Apparently resolved with build 13 (present build).
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It seems premature to declare that audio issues have been resolved.

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=8146

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=8143

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=7513

I'm hoping that RED is working on improving audio and that all of these concerns will be addressed by build 15...there have been hints and assurances that dual monitoring will be enabled and that the production ramp in EVFs is underway, but the issue that really concerns me is getting good audio into the camera.

The audio has not been enabled for very long, and the range of issues which need to be settled is only beginning to come to light. I hope RED can give the same care and attention to sound improvements that they've already given to image. Some of that magic fairy dust might help.
 
All of these people with these fanciful visions of cheaper-than-RED cameras, are you even industry professionals or are you morons reviewing the latest Mandy Moore film for your blog? I mean seriously, I am not an industry veteran even and I'm not so stupid as some of these people and their comments.

You won't find a better deal than the RED for a LONG, LONG time, Panasonic's HPX3000 is $47,000 according to the guy at Birns & Sawyer I just talked to yesterday, in the store, and it only shoots 1080p native. It's a far inferior camera and it's three times as much as the RED basically, that's ridiculous. The big guys haven't proven whatsoever that they can compete with RED so far. I love competition, I'd love to see everyone offering $5,000 4K cameras, but let's get real here, it's not going to happen for a very long time, and no matter what a camera costs lenses will NEVER be cheap, they never have been, never will be. But some people just like to think there's this graph where everything keeps getting better infinitely and getting cheaper at the same time. I don't understand that mentality -- cars aren't getting any cheaper, they just get more expensive as they advance in technology. The assumptions some people make here are really a joke. Even someone who knows a basic amount about the professional camera world wouldn't offer up some of the utterly stupid views expressed here.

If there's another 4K camera on the market like RED that's cheaper, now or already announced, SHOW ME! It doesn't exist. I'm not a RED fanboy, I'm a fanboy for great quality and affordable prices, but I'm just being realistic here. These major camera companies are rip-off artists, and some of you guys are looking to them to compete in price with the RED? Good luck with that.
 
Jonathan, have you used a Red yet? It's a 4K camera that, although possible to shoot one man band style can also be very tricky in terms of critical focus. ENG style cameras can be more adaptable to the run and gun style, easier to focus during complex shots, etc. Not to mention, you get instant 1080P in the case of the HPX3000. In some situations that can be vital to what a client may want. They may not have time to wait for conversions. So yes, you are right that the price is up there for some of these cameras, but they fill the needs of many shooters.

Red will have many options as time goes on to make shooting ENG style easier, but for now some people may just feel more comfortable with a camera designed specifically for those kind of shoots.

I will say this. Red is by far the best image you can get for the money. So if it comes down to image quality alone, then yes you have a very good argument here. But also keep in mind that a Red package will run you more than $25,000 to have a nice rig. Still cheap, but the more elaborate rigs will start to approach the numbers of the HPX3000. Bottom line - For the money, does Red do everything you need it to do for you?

Steve
 
JonathanLB said:
All of these people with these fanciful visions of cheaper-than-RED cameras, are you even industry professionals or are you morons reviewing the latest Mandy Moore film for your blog? I mean seriously, I am not an industry veteran even and I'm not so stupid as some of these people and their comments.
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Jonathan,

I'm not sure what's up tonight, but you've made two posts to the forums and they have been very harsh and negative in tone. No need for labeling people morons here. In fact, some of your comments don't even flow with the general discussion in this thread. Just sayin' you should lighten up a bit.
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
Jonathan,

I'm not sure what's up tonight, but you've made two posts to the forums and they have been very harsh and negative in tone. No need for labeling people morons here. In fact, some of your comments don't even flow with the general discussion in this thread. Just sayin' you should lighten up a bit.
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We all need a little Jonathan humor every once and a while. He's a mini celebrity on these forums. :biggrin:
 
Jonathan where you been ? to lighten up would take the fun out of Jonathan. I say insult away.
-A
 
Hey Johnny boy

How is the inside of your colon looking tonight?
 
Finner said:
Hey Johnny boy

How is the inside of your colon looking tonight?
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finner you are too funny ! nothing like a colon joke to get things going.
Aloha
-A
so a guy goes into a bar...
 
Well Alex you gotta know that a kid like Johnny boy with his head up his ass that far has got to have a pretty damn good view of his colon.
 
With Redcode being 4k highly compressed; what is the color space of Red? I know the word is "Raw" meaning 4k at approx 8x to 14x compression in redcode. Red is 24MB/s for 4k. 4:4:4 @ 1080 is about 55MB/s or 110MB/s in duel stream mode.....uncompressed..... with at least 10x compression ....what is Red? 4:2:2? 4:1:1? Compression isn't bad. Even 4:2:0 @ 1080 on a 40 foot screen looks amazing.

When Red comes out of the beta stage i would like to do some format tests F35 @ 1080, Red, 900r, ex-1, new Varicam (?) It would be great to see if anyone can tell which is which? and what most people would prefer. A blind screening, like a blind tasting in wine. I will do just that in April or May after NAB. A "Blind" screening....with Wine !!
 
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