Color connecting to wrong R3D files, no fix in sight?

[Dillon Novak]

We shot 4K MX with a 2:1 ratio. We rendered out 1080P prores clips for editing in FCP and everything has been fine in the edit. We put the "_H"s on all of the prores clips. But just recently, when attempting to grade a teaser for our music video, I exported an EDL file from FCP. I imported it to Color with the exact same settings that the FCP timeline had, but it says something like "Color had problems importing some of your clips, there may have been intersecting timecodes".

So once I get past that warning, I see that two clips from the teaser are different in Color's timeline. I can edit the footage in the RED tab, so I know that it's connecting to the R3D files.

I remember on set, we filmed band the first day and story the next day. When filming story, we were swapping out to our second drive and it was not formatted. So it continued on the same reel A004_..... file name as the band shots from the day before, rather than being A006_.... in chronological order of shooting.

I looked into it further and imported an EDL of the full video in Color and found that it is Story clips in A004_....that are being improperly connected to band clips from that same reel that were already on that drive.

Is this my problem? Would there be any way to fix this? I'm totally stuck.

I also know that in RED Cine, for the band shots I accidently rendered the footage out with full on all of the debayer settings I realized this before rendering out the story clips and then changed the debayer to
2k-1/2 good
3k- 1/2 good
4k- 1/4

I don't know if this would cause anything, but just trying to give as much info as possible.

Thank you very much; anything helps.

 

[Emery Wells]

Hey Dillon, just sounds like you have overlapping TC and REEL ID's. I don't use Apple color so I can't comment on the fix for that specifically but see if you can conform via the comments from the FCP EDL. The "From filename" comments contain the whole filename which would include the 2 character alphanumeric that RED adds to the end of the filename for this exact reason. You should be able to uniquely identify every clip in your timeline this way.

 

[Dillon Novak]

Hey Dillon, just sounds like you have overlapping TC and REEL ID's. I don't use Apple color so I can't comment on the fix for that specifically but see if you can conform via the comments from the FCP EDL. The "From filename" comments contain the whole filename which would include the 2 character alphanumeric that RED adds to the end of the filename for this exact reason. You should be able to uniquely identify every clip in your timeline this way.

Thank you for responding. Where exactly would be the "from filename" that I would be able to, as you said "uniquely identify every clip in your timeline this way".

I wish I could just connect the individual "problem" clips directly to their respective, correct, .R3D file.

Thanks again.

 

[Ben Brainerd]

You can try doing a manual reconnect by selecting the problem clips and doing a reconnect media (similar to how you'd do it in FCP).

Also, is there a particular reason you went with EDL instead of just using FCP's built-in "Send to Color" command? It probably won't make a significant difference, but you might want to at least try the "Send to Color"/XML workflow.

 

[Dillon Novak]

You can try doing a manual reconnect by selecting the problem clips and doing a reconnect media (similar to how you'd do it in FCP).

Also, is there a particular reason you went with EDL instead of just using FCP's built-in "Send to Color" command? It probably won't make a significant difference, but you might want to at least try the "Send to Color"/XML workflow.

How exactly can I do the manual reconnect? I'd love to do that.

Additionally how does the Send to Color/XML workflow work? I tried just sending it to color, but it just connects to the prores 1080 clips that were being edited in FCP.

Thanks man.

 

[Ben Brainerd]

Manually reconnecting is as simple as right-clicking on the clip in the Color timeline and selecting "Relink Media"

As far as the XML workflow goes, you'd have to bounce through Clipfinder and reconform to the camera proxies first. Export your edited prores sequence as an XML, load it into Clipfinder, do a "Run conform on FCP XML", load the new XML into FCP, and send *that* sequence to Color.

I would try doing a manual relink first, since you've already got the sequence in Color and more or less connected.

 

[Dillon Novak]

Thank you! The manual reconnect worked perfectly.

But now have a new problem. Now that everything in Color is graded/rendered and looks perfect....

But when I "send to FCP" it gives me this.

Is there any other way to get it to FCP from Color? I tried XML and it did the same thing.

Thank you.

 

[Ben Brainerd]

Yerg. That's a new one. Have you checked the render files out in quicktime to see if they play back there?

 

[Dillon Novak]

Yerg. That's a new one. Have you checked the render files out in quicktime to see if they play back there?

Where would I go to do that? Do I go to the color documents? Thanks Ben.

 

[Dillon Novak]

Found it. The problem is in the render right now...Hmm.

 

[jimhare]

What render settings did you tell Color to use?

 

[Dillon Novak]

Same as FCP's sequence

Frame Rate: 23.98
Resolution: 1920X1080
Quicktime
Apple ProRes 422 (HQ)

 

[Peter Salvia]

Same as FCP's sequence

Frame Rate: 23.98
Resolution: 1920X1080
Quicktime
Apple ProRes 422 (HQ)

Why do you want to render from the .R3D files in Color if your final output is 1080? Is there a detectable quality increase when compared to grading your current prores media in your FCP timeline?

 

[Dillon Novak]

Why do you want to render from the .R3D files in Color if your final output is 1080? Is there a detectable quality increase when compared to grading your current prores media in your FCP timeline?

You have more command over the image with the RAW files. I'm very tempted at this point just to grade them...

 

[Peter Salvia]

You have more command over the image with the RAW files. I'm very tempted at this point just to grade them...

Cool yes I understand. However, rendering in Color from the connected .R3D files may be causing your problem. A solution may be to grade in Color using your existing ProRes media.

Also I have found that grading in Color using ProRes 4444 media transcoded from .R3D files using REDCINE-X has provided an enormous amount of command. If you are finishing at 1080 I recommend transcoding to ProRes 4444 for your grade in Color for simplicity's sake. If you are finishing at 2K then dealing with the .R3D files would be a potential alternative.

 

[Dillon Novak]

Thank you Peter,

I would be willing to try that. How would I transcode my footage in the FCP timeline to prores 4444?

 

[Peter Salvia]

First you could media manage your final timeline. Then identify the media managed clips and transcode the .R3D's to ProRes 4444 using REDCINE-X. Then relink your FCP timeline to the ProRes 4444 media. Then send to Color.

It sounds like you already graded the project so I would also recommend saving every single grade in your current Color project. Then you would simply reapply each grade to your new ProRes 4444 Color project. Tweak as needed then render in Color, then send back to FCP.

 

[Dillon Novak]

Thank you, This is my first time in the RED post workflow, so I've never had to do anything that technical. I don't mean to sound stupid. but could you go into further detail on the media manage aspect and then how it goes to the transcoding of the .R3D's in REDCine-X?

Again, Thank pardon my lack knowledge on the subject.

 

[Peter Salvia]

could you go into further detail on the media manage aspect and then how it goes to the transcoding of the .R3D's in REDCine-X?

Media managing is independent from transcoding. Essentially, I'm suggesting that you to identify the clips being used in your final edit and match them to the original .R3D clips. Then transcode the .R3D clips to ProRes 4444. Next, re-link your FCP sequence to the ProRes 4444 media. Finally, send the sequence linked to ProRes 4444 media and send it to Color.

Happy to take this offline if I can be of service.

 

[Dillon Novak]

I'm sorry, we would love to have you do this... Unfortunately, we are out of funds on this project. Mostly paid out of our pocket... Thank you though...

When identifying the clips in FCP and matching them to the .R3D files, do you use "Media Manager"? Or make the clip offline and "Reconnect Media". I tried the latter, but it would not let me link directly to the .R3D file.