Welcome to our community

Be a part of something great, join today!

Log in
  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Canon 5d Markll goes to EGYPT & BEIRUT

Khalid's piece is a very good example of how digital
acquisition empowers the creative spirit.
It's a perfect example of the future of filmmaking in general,
where color timing and most other aspects of the trade
will be as everyday as, say, photoshop is now.
"Indie" will soon be so prevalent and successful
that its meaning will be pretty much meaningless.
"Studio" might be the new pejorative.
But then again, it will do nothing for the guys who want
to sit and drool over their gear, and make bendy toys and robots out if it.
 
Michael Hastings said:
I think the Steves make some good points (Sanjin you've been called out - here in the states they often say "put up or .... up":smile5:) I've been very impressed with the colors, skintones, etc. I get with my meager $700 EOS500D/Rebel t1i that has 720p video. One of the biggest drawbacks of the RED1 is it is really an effort to shoot with it, and the ability with these DSLRs to take it everywhere and/or just get out and shoot (not to mention immediately use the footage) is a powerful advantage that shouldn't be sneered at.

Seems like I never just grab my R1 and go shoot, yet I can take my Canon just about everywhere. I talk to a lot of R1 owners and I think people would be amazed if they knew the actual median number of hours people have shot with their R1s. (Median is like an over/under - for example if you took the first 6001 R1 owners what would be the number of hours shot where 3000 would be above and 3000 below.) Any speculation? 10? 25? 50? 100?

This is probably the biggest reason I am looking forward to epic.
Click to expand...



Bill Anderson said:
Khalid's piece is a very good example of how digital
acquisition empowers the creative spirit.
It's a perfect example of the future of filmmaking in general,
where color timing and most other aspects of the trade
will be as everyday as, say, photoshop is now.
"Indie" will soon be so prevalent and successful
that its meaning will be pretty much meaningless.
"Studio" might be the new pejorative.
But then again, it will do nothing for the guys who want
to sit and drool over their gear, and make bendy toys and robots out if it.
Click to expand...

A such "weak philosophy" guys and also I'm not going to buy Canon 5DMK2, 7D or Nikon D3S to get "creative" just because to please your "consumer" sort of taste.

I'll do it in a different way as always... :cool:
 
I think people get defensive out of jealousy. 720p and below, the 5D's image is hands down better than the RED one's. And rarely do I (or anyone) see Red one footage over 720p.

BTW, great video. Looks amazing.
 
I agree with Michael. If I were out there with a RED package nothing would have been accomplished with the two man crew I was working with. Its not very practical at all when shooting docs or when put in run and gun situations. The 5D met far beyond our expectations on this shoot, which is the reason why its the hottest camera on the planet.

Sanjin, The H.264 compression has been discussed heavily in many other forums not just this one, and I am aware of that. I was never talking trash about RED. Its a great camera that revolutionized this industry. I've learned not to get my hands too dirty in tech talk, it goes nowhere and limits creativity.

I shot a music video in the beginning of the summer half on red and half with the MK2. The reds latitude on day exteriors was incomparable with the mk2. However, the 5d was a life saver on night exteriors. The red does not touch the 5d at low light and high ISO situations. and I would rather shoot 5d with its H.264 codec and 30p than RED Anynday. After reviewing red footage shot at 800ISO it was barely usable. When 5d footage at 1600 is breathtaking.

Thanks all for the support.
 
Hey I just saw this featured on Vimeo and came here to post it... Wow.. Just Wow.

This makes me look forward to Scarlet even more..
 
Khalid Mohtaseb said:
Sanjin, The H.264 compression has been discussed heavily in many other forums not just this one, and I am aware of that. I was never talking trash about RED. Its a great camera that revolutionized this industry. I've learned not to get my hands too dirty in tech talk, it goes nowhere and limits creativity.

I shot a music video in the beginning of the summer half on red and half with the MK2. The reds latitude on day exteriors was incomparable with the mk2. However, the 5d was a life saver on night exteriors. The red does not touch the 5d at low light and high ISO situations. and I would rather shoot 5d with its H.264 codec and 30p than RED Anynday. After reviewing red footage shot at 800ISO it was barely usable. When 5d footage at 1600 is breathtaking.

Thanks all for the support.
Click to expand...

RED1 is not so bad at night as you would might think.

You would need just a pretty fast lens for it.

Have a look:

Vienna by Night December 2008 - Quick and dirty handheld footage test>>>

Also brand new Kessler Pocket Dolly HD with load capability up to 155 lbs (70,45 kg) is coming up in December.

RED1 M-X upgrade is around the corner.

This winter is not going to be "so cold" for R1MX users.
 
Khalid,

This piece is absolutely beautiful. You have a great eye for light and composition. I can really appreciate the advantage of having such a small camera package in getting these shots. Thank you for posting this.

-Fran
 
Sanjin Jukic said:
Very good!

Pretty oriental, also dolly Pocket dolly worked gorgeous.

We know that Canon 5dMk2 or any other HD video enabled DSLR looks good on the Internet size picture but...
Click to expand...

You just can't help yourself, can you? :violin:
 
You need to shoot us some new night footage samples with build 21 Sanjin. The difference in noise is pretty dramatic.
 
Bryce O said:
I think people get defensive out of jealousy. 720p and below, the 5D's image is hands down better than the RED one's. And rarely do I (or anyone) see Red one footage over 720p.
Click to expand...

I disagree.
5D video looks good only under a very limited range of shooting conditions. Slow or no camera movement, no fast action in the scene, no sharply focused or high contrast fine detail with motion, like sunlight on water with ripples from a light breeze for example.
Khalid's video is a perfect example of how to use a 5D to best advantage, but there was nothing very challenging for the codec to deal with.
 
Sanjin Jukic said:
A such "weak philosophy" ... " just because to please your "consumer" sort of taste.
...:
Click to expand...

Sanjin: I don't want to get confrontational - I was just kidding with the "put up or .... up" comment hence the smily face. But I don't see where our argument comes off as "consumerish" in any way.

While Khalid's footage may not hold up quite as well as R1 footage under full scale large theater projection there is nothing unprofessional about it. It is well composed, focused, nice camera moves, nice use of selective focus/DOF, beautiful subject matter, etc. He obviously knows how to set the camera up: color balance, saturation, exposure, etc. all excellent. All hallmarks of good, professional motion pictures. And I suspect the original would hold up well for most film festival displays, DVDs, broadcast/cable television, etc. where it (and most other "professional" work) is likely to be shown.

RED has a camera coming out (Epic) that combines many of the good points of both the R1 and these vDSLRs:

R1: very high resolution, and excellent picture quality when well lit and properly graded, and a very good compression scheme. PL mount cine lenses (although Pawel has proven that Canon can be modified to do this)

----------
5D/7D: [brackets for things still not available even on epic]

Low cost, with excellent affordably priced off the shelf lenses with no potential warranty hassles. (Be it Canon, my Zeiss C/Y, your beloved Leicas, etc. and the superfast lenses benefit 5D/7D just as much as R1) [Low cost means you aren't paranoid about theft/damage every time you go out with it.]

Extremely compact, [goes anywhere without creating a scene/raising suspicion].

Powers up instantly [with small, inexpensive batteries that last hours]. Beautiful color and skin tone rendition, good dynamic range and superior high iso/low light performance.

{Autofocus, autoiris, program AE} - these get a squiggly bracket because it remains to be seen how long it will take RED to get those things done and how effective their implementation is.

-------
R1 may be the best/most professional tool for some situations but it doesn't negate the fact that it is unwieldy; quirky; power hungry; overheats easily; is impossible to operate unobtrusively; average to poor (for this day and age) sensitivity/low light performance; costs about $1000/yr to insure.

And if your definition of "professional" is that it is a top choice for high end motion picture production then - even though R1 is a little farther up the scale - neither R1 or 5D meet that standard.

I'm not knocking RED - R1 is an excellent, game-changing, relatively affordable, specialized tool. When I go shoot sharks and dolphins in the Bahamas, or a narrative feature, I will take my R1 because I want the highest resolution/quality I can get and am willing to go to the extra effort required. But there are many "professional" situations where the R1 isn't worth the trouble and other cameras would be.

I believe there are good reasons why there is a full value tradein with R1 and am anxiously awaiting for that program to begin so my RED camera becomes both a specialized tool AND an everyday tool. But even then there will be a place for a $1700 7D type camera and I am sure I will upgrade my t1i to a 7D or similar even when I have a RED DSMC.

Again, I am happy with my RED investment and love what they are doing - but I also try to be realistic about all of the tools that are out there.
 
Stephen Williams said:
Hi,

Beautiful images. I think the dynamic range & skin tones are far better than images I have seen from many other digital cameras, even ones with S35 sensors.

Stephen
Click to expand...
post of the thread ehehehehe missing you.
 
Here is a perfect example of what I was talking about. I shot this with the Mark2 in times square with the canon 24mm tilt shift. I lit it with one fluorescent tube with two sheets of opal. Now we all know if this was shot on R1 it wouldn't come close to looking like this. would you not consider this challenging for the codec had to deal with?

Like David had suggested the camera does lack in some ways "no camera movement, no fast action in the scene, no sharply focused or high contrast fine detail with motion, like sunlight on water with ripples from a light breeze for example." but is great in many other situations.
 

Attachments

  • Picture 92.jpg
    Picture 92.jpg
    47.2 KB · Views: 0
Last edited:
Mr. Sanjin, how does a beautiful movie from the 5D (and I'll bet it would still be beautiful projected on a big screen) in any way negate or threaten the amazing quality of the Red One?

Did the original poster offer the video as better than the Red, or make any kind of comment in that direction at all?! This isn't a contest, these are tools in vastly different price ranges and have different uses for those that can afford them both!
 
Beautifully shot , cant wait to see some more of your work with the 5d...!

pocket dolly worked wonders...!!


what lens did you find yourself using the most??

thanks again for that - very nice viewing... Loved the playground stuff amongst the ruined buildings...
 
Matt Gottshalk said:
You just can't help yourself, can you? :violin:
Click to expand...

Ha ha, ha , you don't have to take care about me at all.

Better look at yourself.

Before you can't help yourself I can't help you either. :emote_hippie:

Michael Hastings said:
Sanjin: I don't want to get confrontational - I was just kidding with the "put up or .... up" comment hence the smily face. But I don't see where our argument comes off as "consumerish" in any way.
Click to expand...

Michael,

don't worry, I know what you mean.

Also discussions like this that uddenly turned here in a sort of "fight club" are now getting totally useless.

Some people are taking to much personal that it looks so funny from outside.

I was just talking and even a bit "trolling" about the facts and evidences but... no help as I wrote above about it. :zombie_smiley::troll:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top