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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Bomb EVF Shipping

Mike Gibson said:
My take is that they are using our wire transfers to keep the company afloat hoping we won't get upset and jerk our funds out. regards, Mike Gibson
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Mike, I seriously doubt that....RED does not need our cash to keep afloat...Jim started RED with his own cash (I believe), and I still think he has enough to keep it afloat....They simply have a problem with supply and demand, their supply is much MUCH lower than their demand....
 
Lets get back on track guys...
 
Jarred Land said:
Lets get back on track guys...
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Hey Jarred ... do you guys sometimes get incorrect info/estimates from suppliers?

If so, this is something that might help people understand the delays. I know Red is a team of "tough guys" who don't make excuses or blame others, but I get the feeling that sometimes a delay is because a supplier gave you some incorrect information ... either about delivery time, available materials, etc.

I guess I'm saying this because I KNOW how honest Red is, and how much they bend over backward to please customers. In fact, just the other day I needed a commercial invoice to get our camera cleared through customs in Canada. Not only did I get a rep on the phone quickly, he got me two commercial invoices for the camera in less than a minute after hanging up the phone. Not a huge deal, but I expected it to be at least 30-60 minutes and was truly blown away by the speed and concern.

I know these are little things, but I've seen this over and over again with Red. It's an extremely customer-focused company and thus if something does't go as planned I truly feel like it must be due to factor's outside Red's control.

Anthony
 
Jens Jakob Thorsen said:
Please do that;-) I trust that you are getting these things out the door as fast as you can, so no need to take this any further.
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Agree, maybe close this thread?
 
Michael Hastings said:
As a billionaire, he presumably makes 50 million or so a year on interest/conservative investments so even at 50 million a year losses he would never have to close :-)

It is pretty clear Jim doesn't need our money, and red is a labor of love. From comments he has made before, he has maybe challenged himself to try to build Red more like a true startup without just constantly throwing capital at it - and so far it seems it is doing pretty well with thousands of cameras already sold, and building a team of dedicated people.

I'm one of those $5k depositors, and while I am antsy to get my camera, I have absolutely no concern about ever losing that money.
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If i was that rich, i would copy Japanese or German assembly lines or get in touch with HENRY FORD :biggrin5:
 
Peter Matthes said:
I wonder how you say that in German.
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Auf dem richtigen Weg sein.

Ok. Back on track now.

I'm not on the list for the new EVF yet (don't understand why it's still called Bomb EVF - it's all but bomb-looking). I find the "old" EVF a big coke bottle. But apart from its size the best EVF in the industry. When the new EVF ships in quantities I'll get one. I'm pretty sure that in half a year or so (when I get my Epic stage 3) the shortage will be solved. Red will sell many Bomb-EVFs, considering that most Epic packages, be it M, X, S will need one, plus the many Scarlets that will on the market by summer. If one thing of the glorious RedOne history has tought us: Red is highly adaptive. This will be the last back order squeeze.... no?


In the mean time I can only advice to get an used EVF and use it. There are quite a few for sale and not too expensive.

Hans
 
What advantage does the BOMB EVF have over the (much cheaper) RED LCD? Is it simply because you put it to your eye and therefore have a less washed up image? I would think the LCD hood I saw Steve Gibby using in his shots would solve that problem.

I would think most RED shooters would simply use the LCD instead until the supply crisis is solved, that is, it would not be a truly critical problem to not be able to get the BOMB.

Am I missing something?

D
 
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David Dennis said:
What advantage does the BOMB EVF have over the (much cheaper) RED LCD? Is it simply because you put it to your eye and therefore have a less washed up image? I would think the LCD hood I saw Steve Gibby using in his shots would solve that problem.

I would think most RED shooters would simply use the LCD instead until the supply crisis is solved, that is, it would not be a truly critical problem to not be able to get the BOMB.

Am I missing something?

D
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I'd say that as sharp as the Touchscreen LCD's are, you'd be blown away with how crisp and sharp images are when you look through the Bomb EVF. But you don't have to take my word for it. The proof is in the pudding, and you shall be able to look through one, soon enough...
 
David Dennis said:
What advantage does the BOMB EVF have over the (much cheaper) RED LCD? Is it simply because you put it to your eye and therefore have a less washed up image? I would think the LCD hood I saw Steve Gibby using in his shots would solve that problem.

I would think most RED shooters would simply use the LCD instead until the supply crisis is solved, that is, it would not be a truly critical problem to not be able to get the BOMB.

Am I missing something?

D
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There are lots of good reasons an operator would prefer to use a VF rather than an LCD screen.

Aside what anyone else feels, personally, I find when I use LCD screens I miss things in the frame that I don't when I use a VF...
 
Ivan McCullough said:
There are lots of good reasons an operator would prefer to use a VF rather than an LCD screen.

Aside what anyone else feels, personally, I find when I use LCD screens I miss things in the frame that I don't when I use a VF...
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That's interesting, my experience would be the exact opposite. I used to shoot a lot of medium format, and I miss the ability I had there to (metaphorically and literally) sit back a little from the camera and the viewfinder, and think about the composition - and pick up on things I might be missing out of peripheral vision - things I just couldn't do so easily with my eye screwed into a viewfinder; it imparts a certain tunnel vision.

My biggest regret in the transition to my current DSLR system was losing the ability to attach a WLF, something I last enjoyed with the old Kodak DCS 760 - Nikon F5 based. It's something I look forward to getting back with EPIC and the LCD display! For some of my work it won't even be possible to use an EVF, and I seriously doubt I'll be in the market for one.

Mike
 
EVF

EVF

OK, I shoot interviews with a 17" field monitor, but if anything is moving, I need an eye on an eyepiece to know what to do with the camera, especially outdoors, which is most of my work.

I can wing a shot with an LCD, but there's nothing like really seeing what you are doing, and seeing only what the camera sees.
 
David Dennis said:
What advantage does the BOMB EVF have over the (much cheaper) RED LCD? Is it simply because you put it to your eye and therefore have a less washed up image? I would think the LCD hood I saw Steve Gibby using in his shots would solve that problem.

I would think most RED shooters would simply use the LCD instead until the supply crisis is solved, that is, it would not be a truly critical problem to not be able to get the BOMB.

Am I missing something?

D
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The LCD is very crisp, and with a hood it is pretty to see a lot of detail, to focus, etc. That said, a choice of an EVF or LCD depends on what type of shots you do, and the style of shooting your do. I usually take both an LCD and EVF with me when I go on location to shoot. But because I usually shoot EFP style, rather than cine style, I almost always have either the EVF or the LCD in use on the camera - but never both at once like is routine in cine style shooting. In cine style, an LCD is usually facing out from the smart side of the camera so an AC , director, and/or a client can check out what is being framed and shot. Then the cinematographer is operating using the EVF.

In EFP style shooting, which is a what-you-see-is what-you get (WYSIWYG) environment there is almost never any need to mount both an EVF and an LCD. Critical focusing is easier with a good EVF than with a good LCD though. In EFP style shooting I sometimes mount and de-mount each of the EVF and LCD sequentially throughout the shooting day, using the EVF for tripod and most shoulder held work, then switching out quickly to the LCD (with a hood) for when I shoot super high on tripod shots, and on the ground shots, where there's no way I can easily get my eye up or down to an EVF eyecup. I also use an LCD for all Cine Saddle and stabilizer work.

Its much easier to track fast moving things (objects, people, animals, etc.) with your eye up to an EVF than standing a bit further back and using an LCD, because with my eye up to an EVF, and right hand on the tripod handle, I can simply twist my body to pan and tilt (kind of like Tai Chi). Same thing shoulder held, except my body replaces the tripod as the center axis of movement. But then again, when I shoot a big 2/3" box lens (75x, 100x) for sports productions, my eye isn't up to an EVF, but rather standing right in front of the camera top monitor, which has a hood.

If you're on a tight budget, and shooting a lot of EFP style work, you can make due with just an LCD and a hood - but at some point when you generate more funds you'll want to get the EVF also. If you have enough funds to buy the EVF, I'd say do that, then add in the LCD when you can. If you shoot a lot of cine style, then you're going to want both and EVF and LCD on the camera. If you can only afford one of them initially, then rent the other until you can afford to buy it.

Both the Bomb EVF and Red LCD are excellent pieces of kit. The Bomb EVF is the finest EVF I've used in my career.
 
Steve Gibby said:
The LCD is very crisp, and with a hood it is pretty to see a lot of detail, to focus, etc. That said, a choice of an EVF or LCD depends on what type of shots you do, and the style of shooting your do. I usually take both an LCD and EVF with me when I go on location to shoot. But because I usually shoot EFP style, rather than cine style, I almost always have either the EVF or the LCD in use on the camera - but never both at once like is routine in cine style shooting. In cine style, an LCD is usually facing out from the smart side of the camera so an AC , director, and/or a client can check out what is being framed and shot. Then the cinematographer is operating using the EVF.

In EFP style shooting, which is a what-you-see-is what-you get (WYSIWYG) environment there is almost never any need to mount both an EVF and an LCD. Critical focusing is easier with a good EVF than with a good LCD though. In EFP style shooting I sometimes mount and de-mount each of the EVF and LCD sequentially throughout the shooting day, using the EVF for tripod and most shoulder held work, then switching out quickly to the LCD (with a hood) for when I shoot super high on tripod shots, and on the ground shots, where there's no way I can easily get my eye up or down to an EVF eyecup. I also use an LCD for all Cine Saddle and stabilizer work.

Its much easier to track fast moving things (objects, people, animals, etc.) with your eye up to an EVF than standing a bit further back and using an LCD, because with my eye up to an EVF, and right hand on the tripod handle, I can simply twist my body to pan and tilt (kind of like Tai Chi). Same thing shoulder held, except my body replaces the tripod as the center axis of movement. But then again, when I shoot a big 2/3" box lens (75x, 100x) for sports productions, my eye isn't up to an EVF, but rather standing right in front of the camera top monitor, which has a hood.

If you're on a tight budget, and shooting a lot of EFP style work, you can make due with just an LCD and a hood - but at some point when you generate more funds you'll want to get the EVF also. If you have enough funds to buy the EVF, I'd say do that, then add in the LCD when you can. If you shoot a lot of cine style, then you're going to want both and EVF and LCD on the camera. If you can only afford one of them initially, then rent the other until you can afford to buy it.

Both the Bomb EVF and Red LCD are excellent pieces of kit. The Bomb EVF is the finest EVF I've used in my career.
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Thanks Gibby, always love your posts ... super informative. And I believe everything you say -- in fact, I'm totally stoked to get one of the new EVF's soon, especially since trying one at RSH last fall, just awesome in every possible way -- lightness, looks, sharpness, clarity, etc.

But for me, it's not an absolute necessity until I get the Epic -- so I can wait. Yes the original EVF is bulky and not as good, but fine for my current needs until Stage 3 kicks in. Really looking forward to that.

And like others have echo'd -- Red is a very fast learning company, and I anticipate any supply issues being fully resolved by the time Epics are shipping in greater quantities. I expect the same about media, batteries and other accessories.

This will be a good year for us as Red users, no doubt :)

Anthony
 
David Dennis said:
What advantage does the BOMB EVF have over the (much cheaper) RED LCD? Is it simply because you put it to your eye and therefore have a less washed up image? I would think the LCD hood I saw Steve Gibby using in his shots would solve that problem.

I would think most RED shooters would simply use the LCD instead until the supply crisis is solved, that is, it would not be a truly critical problem to not be able to get the BOMB.

Am I missing something?

D
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Using a VF is for many operators a must.

1. For hand held work on your shoulder you need the VF to balance the camera if you don't want to use a dedicated hand held rig. The VF in conjunction with your forehead/eye works like your left hand which now is free to adjust things like aperture or focus. When you use a hand held rig you need both hands to hold the camera. This works only well if someone else is pulling focus, etc... There are many applications you want to control such things by your own. Not everyone is shooting a feature with a big crew.

2. A VF gives you a better focus on the scene, literally. Operation is more focused and accurate. Problems like missed focus pulls are easier to spot. Often there is no time to check a shot by replaying it on a 24" monitor.

3. Most camera operators are used to a VF. This is not because they are old school dinosaurs, this is because it's the only solution that gives you a sufficient survey on the picture that you shoot onboard of the camera. Only a big monitor on set let you equally well evaluate the quality of the footage you shoot.

As Gibby said it depends on the styles you shoot. But if you look back into history you will find no single professional film/video camera without a VF. For me a camera without a VF is a moving picture capture device but hardly a "real" camera. I want a ergonomically designed camera that can be moved in seconds from tripod to handheld and work in both configurations well. For that a VF is mandatory.

Hans
 
I have never used an EVF on my RED ONE. I hope to before it goes back to RED for the Epic upgrade. But I will settle for same time delivery!
 
Something less vague would be better. I already assumed that. Looking to hear some better news.
 
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