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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Arri Alexa and Mysterium-X...

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Jannard said:
Some people still think RED is a scam. :-)

Jim
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The thing that frustrates me to no end is that people automatically assume that high quality is equal to high price. There's a substantial part of the population that actually feel better when they pay more and get less. They, also, won't evaluate a product that costs less because it's below what they expect to pay.

It's the burden you have carry if you want to disrupt the status quo.
 
Roberto, indeed you could measure max and min illumination values that produce total black and clipped white. It's not the way that cinematographers generally work (I think - correct me if I'm wrong) with their light meters, but it does make a kind of sense. My only real issue with light meters is their inaccuracy - I measured mine to to be around 20% out.

Graeme
 
Roberto Lequeux said:
If I know what the/my noise floor lumen and the white clip lumen values are, then I will know the goal posts. I can then shove anything in between them as I chose, and know that I will be able to pull it out and stretch it as much as RedCode's magic allows (at 4k measured!).
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This is my feeling too. It would be great to be able to tell a DP "You can get a great image up to 2000 ISO, but your highlights will always clip at X".
 
BradWright said:
The thing that frustrates me to no end is that people automatically assume that high quality is equal to high price. There's a substantial part of the population that actually feel better when they pay more and get less. They, also, won't evaluate a product that costs less because below what they expect to pay.
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Brad,

a good point and well said.
 
Graeme Nattress said:
My only real issue with light meters is their inaccuracy - I measured mine to to be around 20% out.

Graeme
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But at least DP's can use their light meters to go in and pre-light a room. Once they turn on the camera, they can use zebra stripes or false color to know if they got it exactly right.
 
HOLY SMOKES!!! This thread is moving fast... I didn't realize that so many where up at this hour. : )
I Quickly deleted my post to add to it, in hopes it would be better rounded before Graeme got to it... :P
Here it is, with one additional paragraph at the bottom:

Mark L. Pederson said:
I think it's amazing that the FIRST camera RED built - with a sensor upgrade - is right alongside the THE industry leading camera manufacturer's next-gen camera technology.
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Well... second generation sensor and image interpretation, right? But does that make it any less astounding of a feat? :sifone:

Graeme Nattress said:
Julio, so what you're really asking is "if ISO800 puts mid grey where we want it, at what ISO would that mid grey be at clip, or in other words, how many stops above mid grey do I have?"

Graeme
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Graeme, doesn't the white clip remain at a set "lumen hitting the sensor"?

I thought it was constant. If so I would think it is a great way to approach exposure, not that my opinion should yet count amongst the likes reading this thread.

If I can come in knowing what the/my noise floor lumen and the white clip lumen values are, then I will know where the goal posts are. I can then shove anything in between them as I may, and know that I will be able to pull it out and stretch it as much as RedCode's magic allows (at 4k measured!).

Don't light meters have a reflected light gun feature? I suppose the way to use this would then be to get your readings from the hottest and darkest and to do some math to adjust for filters... or perhaps they have meters that allow you to punch in filters into the meter itself doing the math for you. Then you can work within those with ratios in any way you'd like.
 
Julio Quintana said:
But at least DP's can use their light meters to go in and pre-light a room. Once they turn on the camera, they can use zebra stripes or false color to know if they got it exactly right.
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Yes - rough in with a light meter and then fine tune with the camera.

Graeme
 
ARRI DRTC>>>Just to see and read what they (ARRI) are talking about:

Arri_DRTC_02.jpg


The original ARRI document link >>>
 
Graeme Nattress said:
My only real issue with light meters is their inaccuracy - I measured mine to to be around 20% out.

Graeme
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Wow. I own $1000+ in light meter technology (Minolta and Sekonic) and can measure light within (realistically) 2/10ths of a stop. I've used them for Ikegami, Sony, JVC, Panasonic, RCA(lol), etc.. broadcast cameras and also film: Zone System, chromes.. strobes, hot lights... you get the idea.

Seriously, Graeme.. where did you get your light meter... a garage sale? "20% out" sounds uncalibrated or broken.

:laugh:

~s
 
That was my brand new Sekonic 758 (is that the right model number) ? And I'm talking 20% out in it's cd/m2 measurement, not in terms of stops. Either way, not accurate enough for my needs.

Graeme
 
Graeme Nattress said:
That was my brand new Sekonic 758 (is that the right model number) ? And I'm talking 20% out in it's cd/m2 measurement, not in terms of stops. Either way, not accurate enough for my needs.

Graeme
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copy that.

I looked into/tried out one of the original Sekonic models of this type (combo incident/spot) by Sekonic many years ago.. was not accurate, btw. That's how I ended up with two digital meters(one spot, one incident reading).

~s
 
Sarah C. said:
Seriously, Graeme.. where did you get your light meter... a garage sale? "20% out" sounds uncalibrated or broken.
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Graeme's other light meter is a $20k one.
It's pretty good :)
 
Do light meters with inaccurate luminosity values at least provide accurate ratios? Meaning, while the scale may be off the notches are at least correctly spaced?
 
Michael Bravin said:
Albert
Doing the test is how you determine the result. On page 3 of the download it explains the test. You do not need to have film to make this test and determine performance characteristics at different ISO ratings, you get a nice chart that shows you the results to simply evaluate and compare.
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ISO is somewhat subjective though based on grain/noise and tonal resolution. Not even film iso is accurate, it's a "recommendation".
 
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