Apple Cinema Tools Alternative for Conforming

[Brian Iannone]

I know this may sound like a really silly question, so I apologize in advance for asking.

When I used to use Final Cut, Cinema Tools was able to conform a 60p clip to play back at 24p, for example. What other programs/utilities do this?

 

[Nick Shaw]

I think QTCoffee can do it if you don't mind working in Terminal.

 

[Brian Iannone]

I think QTCoffee can do it if you don't mind working in Terminal.

Thanks for the reply. So, how are people conforming files now? When people shoot at high frame rates like 300 fps, how do they get that to play back at 24 fps?

Or are people just doing it inside of Premiere, AVID, Final Cut, etc.?

 

[Kyle Gentz]

Thanks for the reply. So, how are people conforming files now? When people shoot at high frame rates like 300 fps, how do they get that to play back at 24 fps?

Or are people just doing it inside of Premiere, AVID, Final Cut, etc.?

+1 Id like to know how too.

 

[Sam Winzar]

With RED's cameras you have both a project frame rate and a shooting frame rate. If you shoot at 300fps but have your project frame rate set to 24fps, the clip will play back at 24fps giving you fantastic slow motion. This is the normal way the cameras operate.

 

[Brian Iannone]

With RED's cameras you have both a project frame rate and a shooting frame rate. If you shoot at 300fps but have your project frame rate set to 24fps, the clip will play back at 24fps giving you fantastic slow motion. This is the normal way the cameras operate.

Ah, okay. Is the project frame rate set on the camera or in REDCINE-X?

 

[Uli Plank]

In the camera.

 

[Brian Iannone]

In the camera.

Okay. How can you change the playback speed in post?

 

[Craig Parkes]

Hi Brian, as you generally always render out clips from R3D to some sort of intermediate format, you would make changes to the project speed by doing that.

In essence, it's not something you would need to do with the R3D's unless you actually set the project rate incorrectly on your shoot, and then transcoded out to proxies of a different frame rate to edit and then had reconform BACK to R3D's which had differing timecode (i.e you would have to worry about it if you screwed up majorly, otherwise you don't need to reconform the footage to a different rate.)

Footage that needs to be reconformed for slow mo is because it is shot to be editable at a standard broadcast frame rate like 50/60DF) and then slowed down to another standard broadcast frame rate (like 25/30DF, or 23.98 with pull down)

Get your project rate set up correctly, and your playback speed will be correct relative to your project rate. Any speed ramps beyond that point would be something you would do in your NLE in all normal circumstances and render out at the end of the process (rather than be a meta data change).

There might be an exceptional circumstance, but then you'd probably just render out DPX's/Quicktimes or some other intermediate footage that you could flag with a different timecode to make the change, rather than try and mess around with the timecode meta data in the R3D's.

If your situation meant you were rendering out to and then mastering from intermediary quicktimes anyway, I'd still just use Cinema Tools if I needed to do something funky (like turn 300fps footage shot at 25fps project frame rate to 300 fps footage at a 50fps project frame rate, for inclusion in 720p50, 1080i50 or 1080p50 without having the NLE double up on the frames.)

Circumstances like that are going to be reasonably few and far between though.

 

[Brian Iannone]

Hi Brian, as you generally always render out clips from R3D to some sort of intermediate format, you would make changes to the project speed by doing that.

In essence, it's not something you would need to do with the R3D's unless you actually set the project rate incorrectly on your shoot, and then transcoded out to proxies of a different frame rate to edit and then had reconform BACK to R3D's which had differing timecode (i.e you would have to worry about it if you screwed up majorly, otherwise you don't need to reconform the footage to a different rate.)

Footage that needs to be reconformed for slow mo is because it is shot to be editable at a standard broadcast frame rate like 50/60DF) and then slowed down to another standard broadcast frame rate (like 25/30DF, or 23.98 with pull down)

Get your project rate set up correctly, and your playback speed will be correct relative to your project rate. Any speed ramps beyond that point would be something you would do in your NLE in all normal circumstances and render out at the end of the process (rather than be a meta data change).

There might be an exceptional circumstance, but then you'd probably just render out DPX's/Quicktimes or some other intermediate footage that you could flag with a different timecode to make the change, rather than try and mess around with the timecode meta data in the R3D's.

If your situation meant you were rendering out to and then mastering from intermediary quicktimes anyway, I'd still just use Cinema Tools if I needed to do something funky (like turn 300fps footage shot at 25fps project frame rate to 300 fps footage at a 50fps project frame rate, for inclusion in 720p50, 1080i50 or 1080p50 without having the NLE double up on the frames.)

Circumstances like that are going to be reasonably few and far between though.

Thanks Craig!

 

[Joe Walker]

So what are the alternatives when some dude hands you off some 720p 60p clips that, as an editor, you have to use, and must conform to 24p slow motion? Because, like Brian has so eloquently stated, I'm not seeing a whole lot of conforming alternatives. When I go Avid next year, what's my solution then? Any help would be so vastly appreciated. Thanks!

 

[D Fuller]

So what are the alternatives when some dude hands you off some 720p 60p clips that, as an editor, you have to use, and must conform to 24p slow motion? Because, like Brian has so eloquently stated, I'm not seeing a whole lot of conforming alternatives. When I go Avid next year, what's my solution then? Any help would be so vastly appreciated. Thanks!

In Avid, you would open a project in the native size/framerate of the material for each source. From your master project, open the bins from the other projects and edit normally. You'll notice a green dot on the clips in the timeline - that tells you that frame rate conversion is going on under the hood.

After Effects is really good at interpreting just about any kind of footage properly, and once interpreted, it will conform the material to whatever output format you tell it to.

 

[Joe Walker]

Cool thanks!

 

[Craig Parkes]

Avid also is primarily still based around editing in an intermediate codec Joe, i.e it pretty much transcodes EVERYTHING to DNxHD unless you are working with AMA timeline, where you specifically chose to link the footage. As such I think when you import the footage it makes the choice of what it transcodes to based on your project frame rate, so it will generally conform everything on ingest to the frame rate of your project unless you connect it with AMA or import it into another project: Here's a slightly older but probably still relevant post from the Avid forums:

http://community.avid.com/forums/p/77253/430851.aspx

"1. Prior to importing the clips into a 720/23.98p project, type "IgnoreQTRate True" into the console. This will force a frame-by-frame import of the source file, rather than one maintaining speed. This won't work if the clip has audio.

2. If you're on MC4, you could import the 720/60p footage into a 720/60p project. Then go into a 720/23.98p project, open the bin and use the material. It will be automatically speed corrected by a motion adapter. In the timeline, park on the clip, open the Effects Editor, and promote the motion adapter into a TimeWarp effect, and set the playback speed to 23.976fps.

Third option would be to use CinemaTools to convert the clip's speed prior to import."

(In other words, it's still a good idea to keep cinema tools around if you are using Quicktimes as part of your workflow. It's mad useful. )

 

[MichaelP]

There is also QTChange from VideoToolshed that can modify frame rate and other metadata, strip tracks, etc.:

http://www.videotoolshed.com/product/42/qtchange


Michael

 

[Cameron Vokey]

+1 on this. Still looking for a good alternative to Cinema Tools for batch conforming files where the project frame rate vs. record frame rate were set up incorrectly. Yes it's easy enough to do in AE, but looking for a lazier way to do it.