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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Anyone want to test some film stock emulation software for RED?

Just to add to the pile: grain is something I usually work on in the later stages of colour grading, and definitely last in the pipeline.

As a stand-alone app this would not be useful to me, but the grain in the examples looks good enough that I would be interested in a plugin. OFX would be a good start - since many grading and finishing apps support it. Although implementation of the OFX SDK seems to be different across apps: not every OFX plugin works without problems on all apps. Once you get there, let me know if you need someone to test on Scratch.
 
Nigel Stanford said:
So far we have the following votes for plugin platforms:

5 - Davinci
3 - Redcine X
1 - Scratch
1 - Eyeon Fusion
1 - Baselight
1 - Lustre
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How about Adobe CS5.5/ After Effects? AE plugin would also support the new Lightworks open source NLE too.
 
Yes, please allow the option to only add grain and bypass the gamma and color matching etc.
 
Tom.Wong said:
+1 for resolve, and integration into all NLE's and compositing software would be nice too. not sure how you would get it into resolve though, but ideally I think it should function as a tabbed window in your color room where you tab between hsl, curves, etc. there you can choose "camera, film stock, etc" hopefully maybe you guys can contact BM and work out a deal to integrate this. would be a stellar feature.

also when you guy start releasing more processing for different cameras, are you selling those as individual license, or if we buy a license, it's good for all camera versions?
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Hi tom, pricing is not finalized, but it is likely that a red version will also process canon footage, and any canon version would be a bit cheaper. But that has not been 100% finalized.
 
+1 for RCX, AE and Fusion, plus throwing in a vote for Nuke.

Basically, just make a plugin for all the top tools :)
 
I work with resolve in log space for film out (using redlogfilm). would be great to emulate just the negative stock and give a log output, just like an scanned log dpx. From then it's just like a DI workflow.
I think it'll be difficult to make it a resolve plugin, but if it's necessary, you can use it with conformed material and pre convert the material to grade in resolve. If you make a RCX plug, you can do the conform there and export (with redrocket help) dpx sequences and then reconform in resolve.
Good luck!
 
Daniel Dávila said:
I work with resolve in log space for film out (using redlogfilm). would be great to emulate just the negative stock and give a log output, just like an scanned log dpx. From then it's just like a DI workflow.
I think it'll be difficult to make it a resolve plugin, but if it's necessary, you can use it with conformed material and pre convert the material to grade in resolve. If you make a RCX plug, you can do the conform there and export (with redrocket help) dpx sequences and then reconform in resolve.
Good luck!
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Hi Daniel,

By request we will be adding the ability to just export to negative stock to match scanned log DPX. Plugin support is being added too :)
 
I'm still a beginner at this, but this seems to do a remarkably good job with color and gamma, much better than anything else I've seen. The grain feels a little digital, but not terrible, better than Color's grain effect, which I overuse.

I totally disagree about putting the LUT and grain overlay last in the pipeline. When you shoot film if your exposure or color is a bit off, then you boost that in post or with printing lights and the structure, color, and texture of the grain all change a bit shot-to-shot. Absolutely this is an unintended consequence, but... When I'm watching a movie and I see the grain structure change shot-to-shot it feels natural, organic, especially since the contrast and saturation will change a bit, too, if a shot or scene has been pushed or pulled or printed up or down... If every shot has the exact same grain over it no matter how the rest of the shot looks looks it just looks like "oh yeah, they put a grain effect over it." For that reason I can be fooled by a single insert shot digitally, but digital movies shot with a "film look" always look digital to me. So baking in the LUT and grain early in the workflow makes a lot more sense to me if you're going for a "film look" and not a "nice digital look."

Also, I can't afford this software so it's a moot point, but if you make this for dSLRs there are all these picture look settings that populate the internet and each has pretty different gamma and color. The ultraflat ones do an unintended number on skintones, though I've heard the technicolor profile is good. The default profile is really bad, too much sharpening and contrast. So if you do that for dSLRs, consider which picture looks to reference. Imo neutral is best, but I hear the technicolor one is nice, too.
 
Matt W. said:
I'm still a beginner at this, but this seems to do a remarkably good job with color and gamma, much better than anything else I've seen. The grain feels a little digital, but not terrible, better than Color's grain effect, which I overuse.
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Hi Matt, not sure what you mean by the grain looking digital. Are you rendering out or looking at the preview?

Here is a screen grab of the preview. Hopefully you can see the grains in each square, which are not like digital noise...

grain_1.jpg
 
This looks very good to me. We would like to use it with in Resolve, FCP 7, Smoke on Mac and possibly Scratch. Would be good for Color thought its EOL. If its being productised we need as many cameras are supported as not everything we do is on Red unfortunately. We have zero interest in PC Windows boxes. Thanks for making this available.
 
Dave Blackham said:
This looks very good to me. We would like to use it with in Resolve, FCP 7, Smoke on Mac and possibly Scratch. Would be good for Color thought its EOL. If its being productised we need as many cameras are supported as not everything we do is on Red unfortunately. We have zero interest in PC Windows boxes. Thanks for making this available.
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Thanks Dave. Unfortunately, the most requested plugin in formats RCX and Davinci don't have plug in capability. It looks like Adobe and OFX are the front runners at the moment. FCPX when they add red support. And yes we'll be working on adding other camera support. Canon has been the most requested so far.
 
Why everybody wants to ad grain to a beautiful EPIC image? For reducing and flatten it when the movie has to be encoded for Blu-Ray or other encoding flavors? I love film grain on screens, but I hate this ugly flattened plastics images on Blu-Ray or similar digital files.
 
Grain can increase the perceived sharpness and detail in an image, and very often it adds a quality to the image that we find pleasant. I'm not talking necessarily about precisely reproducing the look of film grain, but an organic quality to the image can be nice.

Think of it like an electric guitar through an amplifier. Some tunes are nicest in clean mode - but there's a place for all levels of distortion and 'grunge'. There's room at both ends of the spectrum - and some in the middle ;-)
 
Nigel Stanford said:
I personally prefer the subtle flicker of grain on a flat surface in a background, vs a pure clean slab of color.
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+1, to the nth.
I was re-watching some scenes from Inception, partly shot on 65mm, and even with that HUGE negative and the slowest speed stocks, you can tell there's some grain. Minimal, I'd say, but it's there. And I absolutely LOVE it. I really don't like uber-clean surgical digital images for most projects.
 
Daniel Dávila said:
Red Rocket support?
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It is supported, as in it works but we are not currently taking full advantage of the red rocket. Would need to get a good indication from a number of people that they want it, and we will add it.
 
Well, I just tried it and I have to say, this is probably the first time ever that I like the result from a "film-like" filter. The results are well balanced and pretty natural.

Now, as others have said, it is not very easy to use as a standalone version, because we have only access to very limited tools in there. So I'd really like to be able to combine this with the other usual grading tools (curves, saturation, secondaries, power windows,...), and apply this filter over the rest (especially the grain needs to be applied last).

Having some more film presets would be nice too, how abut some black and white ones for example ?

But this might become a fantastic tool, if you keep it at an afordable price.
 
Nils Ruinet said:
Well, I just tried it and I have to say, this is probably the first time ever that I like the result from a "film-like" filter. The results are well balanced and pretty natural.

Now, as others have said, it is not very easy to use as a standalone version, because we have only access to very limited tools in there. So I'd really like to be able to combine this with the other usual grading tools (curves, saturation, secondaries, power windows,...), and apply this filter over the rest (especially the grain needs to be applied last).

Having some more film presets would be nice too, how abut some black and white ones for example ?

But this might become a fantastic tool, if you keep it at an afordable price.
Click to expand...

Hi Nils,

We are working on making the software available as various plugins... hopefully it won't take too long to do this. Black and White is coming, as are some other cool surprises :)
 
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