A Place for EPIC Audio Tips (feb 2012), Phantom Power info, etc

[Glen David Miller]

Hello all.

I'm a new Epic Owner. As of today (Feb 22, 2012), I understand that the Epic's Phantom Power isn't active. I hope that will arrive in the newest update. I don't know who the audio team is with Red, but I would love for you guys to offer some tips and insight for those of us who will sometimes need to use the RED EPIC (and I assume scarlet) as a Single System Audio Solution.

Until Phantom Power is enabled, what are some of the cleaner, battery powered outboard boxes that can be used to provide 48 volt Phantom power to our mics. I know that Many of the mics I use require 48 volt.

Thanks for your advice!!! (Now watch, next week, Phantom Power will return!!)

-Glen

 

[Chris McKechnie]

I use the Juiced Link DT-454. Has 2 XLR inputs as well as a mini, and you take a single mini out. It's got great pre-amps, so I don't have to use the on-board epic pre-amps.

Phantom power will be nice once it's enabled (hopefully in the next firmware release), however, by using a mini-mixer of some kind, you will have a much cleaner signal to noise ratio giving you better captured audio.

 

[Tim Duran]

"Audio team"? Glen, you think that Red has an audio team?

Red has been promising better audio since Red One came out. My guess is that Red is putting its money into image capture R&D to try to stay ahead of Sony, ARRI, Canon etc in the patent race. Sound capture is pretty passive. With SD, Sonosax, Zaxcom etc out there, I don't think Red can bring much to the table. I wish I was wrong.

 

[Elizabeth Lowrey]

I just ordered my Epic last week, and this is pretty distressing to me, along with the absolutely incredible fact that the front audio inputs apparently do not offer line level standard functionality (unless I want to drop another 3 GRAND on a still-unreleased "pro" I/O module, I guess I won't ever have that option). Funny, line level/mic level option is something that EVERY single other professional (and even prosumer) camera I've used offers. I won't have occasion often to need line level audio on camera, but I never even DREAMED I wouldn't have that option on a $52K camera package until I stumbled on that info in the forum tonight while researching another question. Literally, it wasn't even something that vaguely registered in my mind as the kind of feature I'd have to check in the specs before buying.

At least the phantom power issue is supposed to be resolved in future firmware. If it's not soon, expect a LOT of squeaky wheel noise from me until it's enabled. I'm a one-person operation that's breaking the bank just to buy the camera, and I need to be able to rely on on-camera sound, as I've always (successfully) done in the past with other professional cameras.

I love the philosophy at RED and the way they've changed the industry and brought incredible image making technology within the financial reach of people like me. And after the failures and beginner's mistakes with RED One audio, I thought sure they'd have learned their lessons on leaving audio as a complete afterthought. The fact that there are still these kinds of issues/design omissions with their newest, top of the line camera is beyond annoying to me, and really surprising.

 

[D Fuller]

Hello all.

I'm a new Epic Owner. As of today (Feb 22, 2012), I understand that the Epic's Phantom Power isn't active. I hope that will arrive in the newest update. I don't know who the audio team is with Red, but I would love for you guys to offer some tips and insight for those of us who will sometimes need to use the RED EPIC (and I assume scarlet) as a Single System Audio Solution.

Until Phantom Power is enabled, what are some of the cleaner, battery powered outboard boxes that can be used to provide 48 volt Phantom power to our mics. I know that Many of the mics I use require 48 volt.

Thanks for your advice!!! (Now watch, next week, Phantom Power will return!!)

-Glen

Sound Devices MixPre-D.

Phantom power, mic out, great preamps.

 

[Marc Wielage]

Until Phantom Power is enabled, what are some of the cleaner, battery powered outboard boxes that can be used to provide 48 volt Phantom power to our mics. I know that Many of the mics I use require 48 volt.

Another vote for the Sound Devices Mix Pre.

But realistically, you're far better off employing a sound mixer and have them mix and record sound separately. To me, trying to run audio on the camera is kind of like putting a light on the camera. Sure, it can be done... but do you really want to? Is it really the optimum way to go?

 

[Glen David Miller]

Well, when I can afford him, one of my best friends is a multiple Emmy award winning sound expert and one of the best of his field for twenty years, and he will take care of everything. But, for those other occasions, I was seeing what you guys thought. Sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do.

The other day I had to use a Mackie 802-VLZ3. Yes, it required AC power, but then again, until some battery solution arrives, so does my Epic!

Wonder how the battle between the 802-VLZ3 and the Mix Pre-D would go down? The Mix is about 4X the price.

-Glen

 

[Mark Andersen]

Sound Devices stuff is top notch.

on another note: i bought a little Sennheiser mic for scratch audio on the Epic, it didn't work at all until I found out it's not wired in a way that it will work on Epic. It's unbalanced stereo blah blah something or other, and the Epic needs 1/8 inputs that are "hot, cold, ground" or Balanced mono (something like that, it a little over my head). anyway I am having mine modified and will test it on Monday.,

 

[Mark B.]

Does Red have an estimate of when the phantom power will be enabled in the camera? I want to travel solo without the hassles that go with an external pre-amp.

 

[Joachim Hoge]

I tried with a Beachteck (I think it´s called), but I didn´t get any sound I thought. But was I wrong?
I never actually recorded anything, I just saw that the levels didn´t move. Are you guys saying that the levels don´t work, even if the Epic records sound?

 

[Sergio Perez]

Well, what I did is purchases a Zoom H4n. I'm thinking of mounting it on my belt, and record through its xlr in. At the same time I plan to use the headphone out and then through a mini jack cable connect it to the epic, and use the Epic's headphone out to monitor. Is this possible? That way I get 2 recordings, with the zoom being the master and the red internal a reference for easy matching with something like plural eyes... Anyone tried this workflow? What I'm laking right now for this test is a mini jack cable. Will a regular one work for this?

 

[Doug Beatty]

Well, what I did is purchases a Zoom H4n. I'm thinking of mounting it on my belt, and record through its xlr in. At the same time I plan to use the headphone out and then through a mini jack cable connect it to the epic, and use the Epic's headphone out to monitor. Is this possible? That way I get 2 recordings, with the zoom being the master and the red internal a reference for easy matching with something like plural eyes... Anyone tried this workflow? What I'm laking right now for this test is a mini jack cable. Will a regular one work for this?

Confirming that this works just fine, Sergio. I found for my purposes that the sweet spot for the HP/Line out is around 80 and the levels in camera around -24db.

 

[Nathaniel Kramer]

My epic, only records on one channel.. The audio sounds horrible and there is clicking sound evry second or two.. Red tech wants me to send it in but is there possibly something im not doing correctly... Not that we use camera audio, except for scratch , but I still would like clean audio from both channels... Anyone?

 

[Sergio Perez]

Confirming that this works just fine, Sergio. I found for my purposes that the sweet spot for the HP/Line out is around 80 and the levels in camera around -24db.

Doug, thanks a lot, great info ! That's why this forum and our community is excellent!

 

[Terry VerHaar]

I tried with a Beachteck (I think it´s called), but I didn´t get any sound I thought. But was I wrong?
I never actually recorded anything, I just saw that the levels didn´t move. Are you guys saying that the levels don´t work, even if the Epic records sound?

Most assuredly, the Beachtek (a rather lower quality device, IMO, to begin with) has a stereo mini-plug output whereas the input jacks on the Epic/Scarlet are both TRS mono. Not compatible. Won't work. There's a lot of discussion about the popper wiring and inputs here on RU.

 

[Terry VerHaar]

My epic, only records on one channel.. The audio sounds horrible and there is clicking sound evry second or two.. Red tech wants me to send it in but is there possibly something im not doing correctly... Not that we use camera audio, except for scratch , but I still would like clean audio from both channels... Anyone?

What are you feeding into the camera?

 

[Mark Wilkinson]

If you solved the clicking problem with the tape, and you are using the proper cabling, you should be able to get very clean audio on the Epic. On both channels.

Another posting said Red fixed the clicking when he sent his camera in.

Has Red ever chimed in on this problem?

 

[matt whelan]

Could anyone from RED give us an estimate on a date for phantom power on the epic?

thanks
--Matt--

 

[Tom Gleeson]

What are people's experience with the Epics audio limiter? I have had some clients complain that high levels hitting the limiter causes the subsequent audio levels to temporarily drop then recover. I have disabled the limiter and have no problems.

 

[Marc Wielage]

I would disable the audio limiter, and instead rely on an external mixer, preferably one operated by a human being. As one example, the limiters on the Sound Devices products are good and reliable, but I don't suggest you hit them too hard.