1st 1,2,3...

[Warren Kommers]

1) Read the script or treatment

2) Come up with a photographic interpretation of the script or treatment

3) Set the histogram as it relates to that interpretation.

4) Roll camera

 

[Tony Lorentzen]

Hi Tony (Bill Giles) - We just learned at Reducation that you cant always trust Redspace for monitoring as its an approximation because its applying a LOOK. RAW monitoring will give you the most accurate histogram.

Moreover, we found we could push what appears clipped in REDSPACE, by switching to RAW (what the sensor sees) and you almost always have " a little more" room to push highlights.

cheers!

Which is why I always check my highlights in RAW (my #2 on the list)? :confused5:

 

[Marc Berger]

1) Set camera always 320/5000K because I work 100% in Raw view for exposure. I use Redspace for focusing only.
2) High contrast scene: Adjust with false color (love it). Don´t care to much about traffic lights, there is always a little headroom with traffic lights and sometimes they just indicate very small extreme highlights which are always clipped.
Normal contrast: Until traffic lights disapear. Fine tuning with false color.
3)If I have to work with Redspace and high iso I use my high contrast settings (point 2).

I think "clipping highlights" are often too generally discussed. It should be a case to case study. Different scenes have different needs. And to have a whole scene underexposed just because one is afraid of some minor clipping highlights in the background is IMO a big desaster.

Marc

 

[Alexandre Bouchard]

BEFORE ADDRESSING JIM'S QUESTION, IT IS CRITICAL TO UNDERSTAND 2 THINGS FIRST.

A. RED ONE is NOT a VIDEO CAMERA but a RAW IMAGE CAMERA! There is no onboard processing baking in a look, INSTEAD processing happens AFTER you expose. THINK FILM NEGATIVE.

B. THERE ARE 4 STEPS to VIRTUALLY ASSURE GREAT (not just good) BUT GREAT LOOKING RED FOOTAGE, EVERY SINGLE TIME
1. EXPOSURE (What Jim just asked)
2. DEBAYERING (What Graeme's magic does)
3. PROCESSING (CABOOSE EFFECT= Need to know delivery format BEFORE processing to determine optimal workflow i.e is it for FILM OUT? HDTV? etc.
4. COLOR GRADING - (Determining how you want it to finally "Look") EDIT: THe better you do with first 3, the more CHOICES you have here

BACK TO JIMS QUESTION REGARDING STEP 1. PROPER EXPOSURE.

The name of the game is a THICK negative. (read: Its all about the Histogram)

HOW TO EXPOSE GREAT RED FOOTAGE IN 3 REPEATABLE STEPS:
(Sorry Jim, its 5 or the curriculum needs to be altered at REDUCATION) BUT SINCE YOU ASKED FOR 3. HERE GOES.

1. ALWAYS Leave at Iso 320. ALWAYS. DONT EFFIN TOUCH ISO. EVER.
(Only possible exception is ISO 250 for Tungsten) USE DAYLIGHT BALANCED LIGHTING WHENEVER POSSIBLE.. or LOTS AND LOTS OF TUNGSTEN.

2. ALWAYS MONITOR HISTOGRAM IN RAW/REDLOG when setting exposure. : The GOAL is to populate the sensor (i.e. Histogram) as much as possible. THICK NEGATIVE. REDLOG Histogram is more accurate representation of the sensor than REDSPACE.

HINT:.BEST exposure is just short of clipping (no stop lights) This is because the Mysterium sensor is strong in the shadows and you can (usually) pull it back up in post with little noise.
REMEMBER: The Difference between RED and a video camera is you are setting the white and black point so you can PROCESS it later.

3 ALWAYS Shoot a Color Chart and/or the very least, an 18% GREY CARD on EVERY lighting set up. (in the light) as you will save time and money in post.

3A. For advanced users... FALSE COLOR and ZEBRAS can help you "fine tune" the Historgram if you want to push the envelope on certain shots

It's exactly what I'm tring to sell to all the DOP's I'm working with.. Not an easy thing to do...

What are your 3 steps Jim?

 

[Tim Whitcomb]

It's exactly what I'm tring to sell to all the DOP's I'm working with.. Not an easy thing to do...

What are your 3 steps Jim?

Well, part of being a RED TECH, is being a diplomat.

and these are baselines for great exposure. Sometimes you want highlights to clip, and to crush blacks in high contrast scenes as part of the art.
That's the fun part. But remind him that clipping is the equivalent to burning a hole in the negative. There is NO information to manipulate in post
when its gone its GONE!

Funny, the 4th and 5th steps are:

4. TEST, TEST, TEST and TEST AGAIN.
5. BE A DIPLOMAT and get the post house involved with the DP as early as possible.. DP's are smart people and ultimately understand that everyone is just trying to get the best image. If he/she is confident his images will look great after testing, I bet he becomes much more open minded to your recommendations.

Good luck!

 

[Andrew Wilding]

I Light to whatever stop I want for the scene. I meter every thing with my 758c, with red one profile loaded. Monitor at 250iso in redspace but switch to Raw view to double check things. I keep the skin tones in the green and pink (assuming "normal" exposure of course), False color wise. I err on the side of underexposure, slightly (though I routinely overexpose certain elements within the frame, sometimes hugely). With the new color science noise is a real non-issue for me. I guess if I was lighting something with very low contrast, which I dont do very often, I would open the lens a stop or what have you.

 

[Alexandre Bouchard]

Well, part of being a RED TECH, is being a diplomat.

Totally agree!! 10% technical and 90% of politics!

 

[Cüneyt Kaya]

1) looking at the picture.
2) histogram in raw view
3)looking at the picture

 

[Martin Weiss]

AKA the Pawel system

AKA the Pawel system

I shoot mainly uncontrolled or only lightly controlled situations.

1.) 320 ISO
2.) RAW mode
3.) opening as wide as possible before any of the three traffic lights go on

 

[Joel Spezeski]

For much of my work exposure is a compromise between what I'd like to do and what I am able to do with the time, crew and equipment at my disposal. Most of my work is in a developing country where the equipment is extremely limited and the crews have limited training. The RED ONE, by the way, has totally transformed film and commercial production here, opening up a myriad of possibilities that were not previously attainable. Thanks!

When working digital, I use my meter for contrast readings while lighting but usually not for exposure, other than a crude reading to make sure my biggest light will give me the desired baseline exposure.

I shoot RED at 320 ASA, 5600K with RedSpace unless I have a reason not to. RAW monitoring tends to unsettle directors and/or clients, so I prefer to use monitoring that appears something like what they hope to see in the end. Also, unless there are going to be a lot of special post effects radically altering the color and contrast, I look at the monitor and assume that what I see there can be easily reproduced and that's the worst the shot can look. That assumption hasn't burned me yet. I try to make an image that would be acceptable, if not optimal, if for some reason there is no color grading. If I'm ok and the director's ok we roll.

For setting exposure I often do the following. It's not an ordered list. It's more of a process that coincides with lighting and rehearsals.

1. Check highlights and hot spots I cannot control, making sure I'm not losing details I want to keep. - RedSpace is usually fine for this, though occasionally I switch to RAW when dealing with day exteriors or large light sources in frame. Zebras at 103-108 and/or False color work well for me.

2. Check dark areas and shadows I cannot control to make sure that if I get noise problems I won't lose details I want should the colorist crush noisy ares to black. I like false color for this - it makes noise and potential problem areas very easy to see.

3. Set an aperture appropriate to the requirements of the scene, the characteristics of the lens, and the abilities of my 1st AC.

4. Take a look at the histogram, possibly the waveform. Does it reflect the tonal range we've chosen for the shot?

If I've got a giant night exterior where I want a lot of contrast and the histogram readings are mostly in the bottom third, I know I'm in danger. If I see this, it's not usually a surprise. I had probably let the director know we didn't have the gear to optimally do the shot before we started the setup. I'm probably using every light and every stick of cable on the trucks. I inform the director we've done all we can and things might get noisy. If needed I play a china ball on a stick or a 575 with Chimera (which I always hold in reserve) on the talent. I set ASA to 500 so the director can see the performance better in the monitor and then we take the shot.

One note on RedSpace: if I'm using predominantly red or purple party gels on lights, the color rendition seems very poor. I can hardly see the color difference in the monitor, though it is very apparent to eye. Tungsten, Daylight, blue, orange, amber, and green light all look fine, but red and purple light doesn't seem to render well. I finally stopped gelling the lights, set up a LUT that skewed red and purple and compensated the lights that weren't meant to be those colors. Not my favorite thing to do, but again, if the director and/or clients see what they want to see in the monitor, that's job security for me and less stress for them.

 

[Pawel Achtel]

AKA the Pawel system

LOL, Martin, you forgot about the most important point 4. :wink:

 

[Sidney L. Plaut]

1. test test test - how far you can push/pull things out - what happens when you pull up shadows / pull down highlights... get to know the RED - like you would a film stock.

2. use my eyes and look at the scene - highlights ... midtones... shadows... what do I want to expose for. what is ok to be black or what is ok to Clip...

3. check RAW meter / false colors in RAW or REC709... just to get a sense of where I am exposure wise and what that will mean when I grade.

4. get a cup of coffee while the lighting department set up the lights. (actually I bring the lighting department some coffee).

 

[sergio arguello]

1. Light meter; I always check ratios for a base. Many say set the meter to 250 but I have tested and found 320 to be a comfortable setting.

2. Set stop then look at the histogram to make sure all is well.

3. False color to double check.

Once the process is second nature then it only takes a few moments to go through all the steps. In the end, I'm confident the lens is at the stop it needs to be to get the image I want.

~Spencer Meffert

Sorry Spencer just being Lazy as we share the same precedural method...with one exception i also refer back and forth from color space ie...redspace rec709 to raw just to train my eye to know what i like it to look like and know when im in my pitch

 

[Carlo Rho]

We generally works looking to RAW and his histogram at least for exposure. Spain clients are happy with HD monitoring, as far as they're used to Arri's cameras PAL,
and they know they will see real colors in CC.

1.Check the histogram and traffic lights then close the Iris until there's nothing clipping.
We learn a lot using the false color but now our eyes are trained and so we expose more with RGB Histogram (in view RAW) and real picture than with false color.
We use the false color if we want to expose a part of the picture in a specific point of camera range ie Blue/Green Screen.

2.Put in the MB the correct amount on NDs to reach te desired Iris. We generally use Tiffen IR HotMirror filter if it's 4 or more stops (1.2) of ND.

3.We shoot generally @ ISO320/400 interiors and @ ISO 200/250 Exteriors
But real results depends from post production:
3A. After us there will be a good post with conscious people taking care of highlights and transcoding to REDlog/Camera RGB DPX or using original RAW for CC, we're happy.
3B. We don't know or there's someone in a hurry that will transcode straight with log and transfer to FCP without looking to histograms, that could be a problem!
So we'll try to don't shoot the last 1/3stop in the highlights and manage the ISO, looking in REDspace view, to avoid big problems.
You shoot right, they transcode badly and some funny producer calls you in the middle of the night...

We have made long and extensive tests about REDone exposure with DoP Alfonso Parra AEC, DCS, published on Spain's magazine Cameraman, you can now download them for free here.

 

[christopher witzke]

1. Only iso 320

2. adjust until histogram in RAW mode that makes me resemble Richard Dryfuss eating mashed potatoes ( thick neg )

3. Shoot a macbeth/grey card combo slate for WB/tint accuracy.

I try to shoot for the most information I can so I have the most room in post for options.

 

[Eren Ozkural]

FOR THE SCENE:
1. ACCEPTABLE NOISE FLOOR - You want this to be consistent shot-to-shot so figure this out first for the whole scene. For greenscreen & FX, you don't want important details too dark & too close to the noise floor. So expose to the right - around ISO 250 on RED ONE. For drama / location work, more visible grain in the end product is OK - eg shoot at ISO 500 if you don't have enough light. If you plan on doing heavy noise reduction in post, then you can shoot with a higher ISO.

2. PROTECT HIGHLIGHTS - How much clipping of highlights is okay? If you have a high-contrast scene, bump the ISO up a notch or expose a little to the left (planning to bring up the midtones in post) to protect your highlights. Use histogram, raw mode, etc to check.

FOR THE SHOT:
3. TWEAK F-STOP - If there's light to spare, set this creatively using ND filters - since shutter speed is usually not flexible (between 1/40 - 1/60 for us, unless we're doing greenscreen & adding motion blur in post).

Obviously there's some juggling & back-and-forth of 1,2 & 3.

Of course we watch for highlights clipping unexpectedly or things getting too dark on a shot-by-shot basis - and adjust for that by tweaking the lighting (if we can), the f-stop, or repositioning the actors. As a last resort, we expose a little to the left or right, knowing we're going to push or pull the midtones of the shot to match the others in post. We generally set the ISO per scene when we're doing initial lighting for the wides and leave it after that. You don't want the noise floor to jump around when going from shot to shot.

Also, I do noise reduction in post on 75% of my footage which maybe explains why I'm okay with ISO 640 etc. In-camera NR is a big reason why other HD cameras seem so noise-free. Film scans often go through a lot of NR. Don't shoot yourself in the foot by not considering it for your RED projects.

ONE SUGGESTION: I'd love an easy visual interface for switching between a set of custom curves / LUTs. It's too difficult right now on RED ONE.

In post I always reset the ISO back to 320 and do a nice S-curve (the shape of the curve depends on where I want to bring midtones to simulate a particular ISO). I don't particularly like setting ISO on RED to 500 because when I'm there it shows clipping when there isn't. But since I can't easily load different curves or LUTs, changing ISO is what we go with - since it gives me the closest approximation of the final image that'll result in post and it's something understood by most DPs and operators.

How about this: since RED ONE is really 320 (and any other setting is just an exposure push in one direction or the other), why not combine ASA ISO & curves?

EG:

(curve preview changes on monitor as you select different ones)

or if you can do multiple LUT/curve previews, this would be cool:

Histogram would stay RAW, of course.

It says "SELECT CURVE" instead of "SELECT LUT" because that might be confusing (if it's just a basic set of tone curves to approximate different film ASAs, not a whole 3D LUT film print simulation thing).

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com

I know this isn't a features request thread but I just have to second this brilliant suggestion by Bruce. I would be ecstatic to see this kind of curve/LUT implementation with preview thumbnails if possible.

This is exactly my process when I am in uncontrolled lighting situations.

Ditto on run and gun. As for a narrative/music video shoot? Leave it to the DOP and consult him/her on the goal.

 

[Eduardo Ruiz]

1. Set ISO to 320 (5600k) or 200 (3200k) - unless some noise/grain or other look is intended for dramatic reasons

2. Lightmeter during lighting and last check with "color" (caucasian skin with a little of pink)

3. START BUTTON

 

[Pascal Scheffers]

With higher ISOs being so clean, I've taken to just dialing ISO up and down a lot.

This is mostly from stills, but it works quite well with the movie mode on the 5D. This way aperture and shutter speed can remain the same much longer without grabbing NDs.

1. Check histogram, when not in daylight also the RGB one.
2. Expose moderately to the right for lower ISOs, strongly to the right for higher ISOs

So the question for me is, can we assign one of the wheels/buttons on Scarlet to ISO and will different ISOs look sufficiently alike that you can change the setting during shooting?

 

[Hrvoje Simic]

ONE SUGGESTION: I'd love an easy visual interface for switching between a set of custom curves / LUTs. It's too difficult right now on RED ONE.

Nice one, Bruce. I'd add: select curves + customize - adjust curve (with dial or touch slider) + adjust curve center - if that is possible in camera.

 

[Fergus Meiklejohn]

I just use the histogram and my eye. Looking to get much information in the histogram as possible but also being sensitive to the reality of the scene, after all some scenes should be dark, some very light..

But mostly I'm fighting to get the image bright enough without creating a lot of noise.. I don't know why, but I seem to always be photographing things in the dark I don't know how the new Canon's do it, but I'm hoping the new RED's will match their low light performance. I'd surely rather buy a RED camera next year..