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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

13th responses here...

Alex.Mitchell said:
I want to get the $2,500 Scarlet with a RED mount, but I want the lens from the fixed lens version. Does anyone know if that lens will be available separately? I don't see it on the list, but it'd be a perfect counterpart to a set of primes.
Click to expand...

FIXED lens. Fixed. Meaning it doesn't detach. It's fixed.

Sorry, was angry with the wife, I should have kicked the dog instead.
________
Washington medical marijuana dispensaries
 
HHEEYYY.... number 194 (after almost 24 hours) No comments from the RED gang, looks like they're gettin some sleep after last night. Jim probably took everyone to the Riviera I'm thinkin...nobody home till Monday? hahahah Well deserved to say the least.
Would be nice to see a dvd of the party at Red least night--right? Cal L
 
I'm sure there's going to be a zoom lens for the $2500 Scarlet body - they only announced the primes but it's just a matter of time.

Can you brilliant people explain to me why one would opt for the $2500 body and primes over the other body with the fixed zoom? (assuming that you only cared about the primes that fell within the capabilities of the fixed zoom) .. is zoom necessarily bad if you don't plan on actually zooming?

Sorry, I'm such a camera noob :blink:
 
6 x 17 CM

6 x 17 CM

Great! I was hoping for an epic digital banquet camera. Now the world is about to receive one. Expect that I'll hold onto my analog film gear while the early adopters test drive it, then shop for their surplus digital gear when today's cutting edge becomes tomorrow's nearly obsolete hand-me-down. It's been my profitable and cash-positive strategy for ages. During the wait, I'll be on the edge of my seat trying to anticipate what's next on the leading-edge horizon. Hail to the conquering technology leaders.
 
and while your waiting to save a few dollars , people will be advancing in their industry...
 
Jim and the Red Team, I have so much respect for you. You listen to customer input and strive to provide your customers with the best possible products. I am exceedingly happy with the products you announced today. I plan on purchasing a Scarlet S35 and some Nikon primes and being able to produce imagery for ~ 15K that would have cost more than 100K to produce just a few years ago. Couldn't ask for more from a company - looking forward to the future! Thanks again,
Matt
 
Have I read all 195 pages of this spontaneous insanity? No, :-) so I am sure my thoughts will have been mirrored several times over by now. But in the spirit of keeping things simple and to the point, here are my impressions from the news of the day:

RED clearly listened, in a way I don't think they did before. Not only can you now have your cake and eat it too, you can get that cake in 2 billion different flavors. Amazing. Even those crazy anamorphic people are covered. :-)

My biggest push from the beginning - and something RED has clearly addressed here - is that to take digital cinema to the next level, the S35/PL-mount barrier had to be broken, and broken in a big way. Bigger physical sensors with larger photosites are where the extreme image quality advancements are going to come from. I really, really applaud them for not only taking the bull by the horns and making a FF version that canon and nikon users are really going to appreciate, but making a "medium format" 645 option as well (and of course that absolutely uncanny 617). I am not sure how they're going to make all of their proposed deadlines with so many parts and logistics to address here, but it doesn't really matter at this point. The gauntlet has been thrown down and their thinking is all in the right area. They've evolved without leaving the little guys behind and they've managed to find a way to make everything truly upgradable and compatible. This is a company that really does make a product that is designed with the end user in mind; a true rarity in this day and age. I couldn't commend them enough.

It will be interesting to see which "brain" everyone is interested in (I absolutely know which one I will be purchasing), as there are pros and cons to each and everyone is going to have their own personal justifications. The waiting is going to be the hard part.

Thanks again, Jim, for keeping early RED ONE owners in mind; your respect for those who have believed in you from day one has never wavered and it feels good to be a part of the club. This is going to flip the industry on its head.
 
I think it was more than listening to customers.... It was listing to the sanity of the customers... The crazy none experts and the theories behind them... The dreamers... The hivemind... This is an absolute revolution in business dealings more than anything. If you read through the last two years of red user you would learn more about business than doing an mba... The "experts" that always seem to get it right in retrospect will devour this like a vulture devours a carcass.... For others it is being a part of history... I dont think a lot of people fully comprehend the magnitude of what is happening here... I can seriously say that there has not been such an advance in technology since the invention of the portable printing press... Laugh at me if you will, but contemplate the absurdity of what i am saying as well...
 
its kinda cool when someone says to you that such and such film (insert name here) was shot in 2k, and you're like: sowhat? im shooting S35 in 5k.
 
My Debriefing:

My Debriefing:

While today’s announcements certainly did their part and blew my mind away, there were still some topics that still concern me. I’m not saying I’m unhappy with the offerings, or that they fell short of my expectations. On contrary, they certainly exceeded it. Maybe multiplied them by 6,5.

One of the things that still doesn’t make sense to me is that they offered us too much choice. Maybe, in the heat of the moment, they just opened the hatch and said, let’s give 'em all. That makes me worried that once they realize they over did it, they might just go back in the “subject to change” small type and kill a few of those parts, just like they did with some bizarre REDONE accessories.

Another concern is that, by making it modular, how much more expensive it all has gotten? A Scarlet, that should give us 3K for less than 3K costs 2500 without a lens. Since a CF module should cost around 500 bucks, it’s now 3000 without lens and LCD. How much more are we talking about to add batteries, lenses, recording options, and I/O?

And finally, some problem that might remain from the DSMC concept: It’s a lot of money for not a lot of resolution, comparatively speaking. If I want to shoot stills with a RED, I’ll have to pay “at least” 2500 dollars for a 5 MP camera. By the way, it doesn’t work with my still lenses because it’s 2/3”. Great video, specs, but not so stellar for still capture...

For instance, let’s analyze each brain in their selection, and see what advantages they are bringing to the table:

Scarlet 2/3” - Fixed Lens

Certainly their price TBD, and the price of accessories is the final piece for the puzzle. Is it still the original Scarlet? could it be 3K for less than 3K for a workable package? judging from the other brains, I don’t think so. Still, this makes a lot of sense to me. A great image in a compact lightweight and almost “plug and play” package, for an enormous cost-benefit product. Something that exceeds any prosumer equipment twice as expensive. 120 FPS is great, and perhaps, is something that makes real sense for a camera that’s designed to be a perfect crash cam!

Scarlet 2/3” - Interchangeable

And then comes the interchangeable 2/3” Scarlet, that should sell for people who want to use their HD glass. I’m sorry but I don’t see quite a lot of users here. But even if there are tons, there is something I HONESTLY don’t get: Who will buy 2/3” Primes on mini red mount? Do we really think there will be a lot of users shelling dollars for prime lenses that does not work for any other camera in order to shoot glorious 3K on 2/3”? Wouldn’t that block the whole upgrade path of just dumping the 2/3” and going to S35? Wouldn’t a prime lens set investment make a 2/3” Scarlet close the (steep) gap to the S35 version? I believe these lenses will not see the light of the day, as soon as they realize nobody will actually have any use for them.

Scarlet S35 - Mysterium

So, I guess this should be the new RED, but it can’t shoot hi-speed. S35, 11 Stops, RED (AF), PL, Nikon and Canon Mounts. Again, it’s a little expensive for a still camera (are we sure they are going to sell plenty of AF lenses?), but at least it shoots 10 Megapixels. Almost as good as a 1000 Dollar Nikon. If it is cheaper to have a 2/3” Camera for video and a Nikon D90 in the same bag, maybe not many people are going to jump into this whole DSMC concept. Anyway, it’s a slightly different RED, for a lot less money. I guess they hit the Jackpot here. 7K for a brain, would probably make for a 12-15K shooting package with certain ease. Much cheaper than buying a RED ONE body for 17,500. and making it a real useable package for 30K.

Scarlet FF35 - Monstro

Now things start to get really complicated. This 12.000 Dollar brain is Full Frame. Why? Is this designed for still shooters who despise S35 format? If feels kind of abnormal to me, that a camera that isn’t optimized for motion work (with a small selection of lenses that were actually made for that, in a proprietary mount, RED-Mount), is also way too expensive for a 10MP still camera. Sure, it’s 6K resolution, but isn’t 5 enough, since every cinema in town is not going to be more than 4K? Makes me wonder.

Epic S35 - Mysterium
Epic FF35 - Monstro

Then we get to the EPIC, Higher resolution, Hi-Speed capable, higher priced. Still the same dillema: FF35 or Super 35.

Epic Medium Format
Epic Large Format

And finally the huge medium format cameras that will certainly have it’s specific applications, but that won’t sell by the thousands. They seem great, but most will not have enough money for them.

What would make a little more sense to me would be this:

-Original Scarlet - 2/3” Fixed lens.
-Super 35 Scalet - Mysterium (Maybe for a little less than 7000, maybe 6000?)
-Super 35 Epic - Monstro (35000)
-Medium Format Epic - Monstro
-Large Format Epic - Monstro

What do you guys think?
 
ok, the journey towards scarlets and epics tech specs and price anouncement was fun and full of suspense till the last moment. my reference point blured there for a while and i thought that i might be in the customer target group of red digital cinema.

i was hoping prices would come closer to my budget but that was not the case eventually.

the materialization of modularity seems to be demonic, i trully believe that.
i just hate 2/3 format sensors and lenses
i didnt really expected that so many people would be impressed by the 28k brain to be honest


i like reds attitude and products. red digital cinema seems to be the best there is out there, more affordable than the "competition" when actually there is no competition to what red is offering, let alone red prices that are somewhere between low end consumer and professional high end (but not really high end compared to red) prices.
but red still targets the professional or the master professional as it is stated industry. and that industry remains expensive

so with all its problems and limitations my reference point still is an hv20 and an sgpro with nikon,canon,zenith etc. lenses and a small portable tft vga monitor for video acquisition and a some zoom h4s for sound acquisition. this is a place i can hold on.

i was dissapointed the moment i read Jim's post but now after about 20 hours i am ok.
it was fun but now i have to focus and continue.

Everything in life changes... but war, war never changes...

and guerilla remains guerilla.
 
I think that most of the offerings would be stripped down to market needs. Dont get me wrong, i love options, but too many can hurt the head (and pocket too). Im really pleased and amazed at what Red is offering. This is revolutionary and i aint nagging. Just wished it could be simpler, like pick A, B or C. Not pick them in a zillion ways.
 
Jim and RED team,

Any thoughts on releasing a 2/3 zoom lens for Scarlet instead of/in addition to the primes?

Thanks for today. Great excitement.
 
taubkin said:
While today’s announcements certainly did their part and blew my mind away, there were still some topics that still concern me. I’m not saying I’m unhappy with the offerings, or that they fell short of my expectations. On contrary, they certainly exceeded it. Maybe multiplied them by 6,5.

One of the things that still doesn’t make sense to me is that they offered us too much choice. Maybe, in the heat of the moment, they just opened the hatch and said, let’s give 'em all. That makes me worried that once they realize they over did it, they might just go back in the “subject to change” small type and kill a few of those parts, just like they did with some bizarre REDONE accessories.

Another concern is that, by making it modular, how much more expensive it all has gotten? A Scarlet, that should give us 3K for less than 3K costs 2500 without a lens. Since a CF module should cost around 500 bucks, it’s now 3000 without lens and LCD. How much more are we talking about to add batteries, lenses, recording options, and I/O?

And finally, some problem that might remain from the DSMC concept: It’s a lot of money for not a lot of resolution, comparatively speaking. If I want to shoot stills with a RED, I’ll have to pay “at least” 2500 dollars for a 5 MP camera. By the way, it doesn’t work with my still lenses because it’s 2/3”. Great video, specs, but not so stellar for still capture...

For instance, let’s analyze each brain in their selection, and see what advantages they are bringing to the table:

Scarlet 2/3” - Fixed Lens

Certainly their price TBD, and the price of accessories is the final piece for the puzzle. Is it still the original Scarlet? could it be 3K for less than 3K for a workable package? judging from the other brains, I don’t think so. Still, this makes a lot of sense to me. A great image in a compact lightweight and almost “plug and play” package, for an enormous cost-benefit product. Something that exceeds any prosumer equipment twice as expensive. 120 FPS is great, and perhaps, is something that makes real sense for a camera that’s designed to be a perfect crash cam!

Scarlet 2/3” - Interchangeable

And then comes the interchangeable 2/3” Scarlet, that should sell for people who want to use their HD glass. I’m sorry but I don’t see quite a lot of users here. But even if there are tons, there is something I HONESTLY don’t get: Who will buy 2/3” Primes on mini red mount? Do we really think there will be a lot of users shelling dollars for prime lenses that does not work for any other camera in order to shoot glorious 3K on 2/3”? Wouldn’t that block the whole upgrade path of just dumping the 2/3” and going to S35? Wouldn’t a prime lens set investment make a 2/3” Scarlet close the (steep) gap to the S35 version? I believe these lenses will not see the light of the day, as soon as they realize nobody will actually have any use for them.

Scarlet S35 - Mysterium

So, I guess this should be the new RED, but it can’t shoot hi-speed. S35, 11 Stops, RED (AF), PL, Nikon and Canon Mounts. Again, it’s a little expensive for a still camera (are we sure they are going to sell plenty of AF lenses?), but at least it shoots 10 Megapixels. Almost as good as a 1000 Dollar Nikon. If it is cheaper to have a 2/3” Camera for video and a Nikon D90 in the same bag, maybe not many people are going to jump into this whole DSMC concept. Anyway, it’s a slightly different RED, for a lot less money. I guess they hit the Jackpot here. 7K for a brain, would probably make for a 12-15K shooting package with certain ease. Much cheaper than buying a RED ONE body for 17,500. and making it a real useable package for 30K.

Scarlet FF35 - Monstro

Now things start to get really complicated. This 12.000 Dollar brain is Full Frame. Why? Is this designed for still shooters who despise S35 format? If feels kind of abnormal to me, that a camera that isn’t optimized for motion work (with a small selection of lenses that were actually made for that, in a proprietary mount, RED-Mount), is also way too expensive for a 10MP still camera. Sure, it’s 6K resolution, but isn’t 5 enough, since every cinema in town is not going to be more than 4K? Makes me wonder.

Epic S35 - Mysterium
Epic FF35 - Monstro

Then we get to the EPIC, Higher resolution, Hi-Speed capable, higher priced. Still the same dillema: FF35 or Super 35.

Epic Medium Format
Epic Large Format

And finally the huge medium format cameras that will certainly have it’s specific applications, but that won’t sell by the thousands. They seem great, but most will not have enough money for them.

What would make a little more sense to me would be this:

-Original Scarlet - 2/3” Fixed lens.
-Super 35 Scalet - Mysterium (Maybe for a little less than 7000, maybe 6000?)
-Super 35 Epic - Monstro (35000)
-Medium Format Epic - Monstro
-Large Format Epic - Monstro

What do you guys think?
Click to expand...
great post.
 
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