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1080P 3k newbie question

C

Carlbattreall

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Sorry to sound clueless but why can the Scarlet shoot 120fps at 3K but only 30fps at 1080P, isn't 3K higher in resolution. What am I missing?

Thanks,
Carl
 
Because it's 1080P scaled and not cropped.

The camera is getting the FULL sensor information and resizing it (somehow) to 1080P then compressing it.

So, more processing power needed.
 
Impagliazzo said:
Because it's 1080P scaled and not cropped.

The camera is getting the FULL sensor information and resizing it (somehow) to 1080P then compressing it.

So, more processing power needed.
Click to expand...
How does the final BD product compare to a BD produced from a Panasonic AJ-HDC27H. I would like to know this because I am trying to compare these two cameras/workflows for my application, which is, narrative story direct to BD.
 
Peter Hodgins said:
How does the final BD product compare to a BD produced from a Panasonic AJ-HDC27H. I would like to know this because I am trying to compare these two cameras/workflows for my application, which is, narrative story direct to BD.
Click to expand...

1. Scarlet isn't out yet, so how can anyone possibly say?

2. Blu-Ray is a delivery format. Acquisition formats all effect the final output to BD, but they are not the only factor in determining the quality - post production and processing can all ruin well captured footage, and for prosumer users, often do.

What I can say is that I have completed BD products shot partially on DVCProHD cameras with Pro35 adapters, and RED One footage as well. The R1 footage was noticably smoother and better quality when viewed on BD. I was not suprised by this at all.

There are many ways of acquiring footage, and all have cost/quality tradeoffs. Why not wait until it is out and try it for yourself.
 
Ben Holmes said:
Why not wait until it is out and try it for yourself.
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I'm hoping people who have produced 1080X1920 using the Red One can shed some light on this question ... I'm thinking of getting a Red One then perhaps upgrading/switching to Epic/Scarlet

Ben Holmes said:
What I can say is that I have completed BD products shot partially on DVCProHD cameras with Pro35 adapters, and RED One footage as well.
Click to expand...

I'm trying to decide to get a Panasonic AJ-HDC27H or similar Panasonic or get on the RED bandwagon, my final product is direct to BD. So if the application is a narrative direct to BD, what camera/workflow ensures the highest quality result. (I don't use no stinkin' 35mm adapters). I want to compare the RED system to High end Panasonic AJ-HDC27H or Panasonic VariCam 3700 P2 HD Camcorder type cameras.
 
In general, at least as far as I know, the better the output from the camera the better the print, even after downscaling/compression. (All other things [dynamic range, lens quality, sensor type, post, processing, etc.] being equal).

Wouldn't this make the RED 3K RAW the best option, followed by the RED 3K 1080p, then the 720P from the JVC?

Also, does that JVC camera really cost $45,000? My goodness.
 
So, if I had a client who wanted 1080P, but I needed to over crank the footage because the client wants plenty of slow motion shots.

Would I shoot in 3k, so I could over crank it, and down-res the footage to 1080p in post? Or would I simply edit the RAW 3K and just output the footage at 1080P?
 
Peter Hodgins said:
I want to compare the RED system to High end Panasonic AJ-HDC27H or Panasonic VariCam 3700 P2 HD Camcorder type cameras.
Click to expand...

After a brief web search, AJ-HDC27H is 720p DVCPRO HD, which means it has only 960*720 resolution - not much more detail than in standard definition cameras. So it's a clear loser of the three at least in that regard, the result will inevitably look much softer than the others.

VariCam 3700 seems to be full raster 1920*1080 HD, so the image sharpness might be comparable to RED after put on a BD disk - though i do doubt it, as cameras don't usually deliver footage that's fully as detailed as their nominal resolution implies.

Red one can shoot at much higher original resolution, which means the 1080p file will be as detailed as is technically possible for the format.

As far as the formats go, DVCPro HD has the benefit of somewhat simpler and lighter post production workflow, while RED workflow is (usually) heavier but allows for much more control.

When it comes to overall image quality RED one (and the future red cameras) should be very, very clear winners out of these three.

The Panasonic cameras have 2/3" sensors, and normally use regular HD video zoom lenses, and the S35mm sized Red one is usually paired with cine glass. Red one has shallower depth of field at any given field of view / f-stop combo, which can be a benefit or a curse - images look "more filmic", but focusing is much more critical.
 
I mean, dude, in most situations you are going to want to shoot RAW unless you absolutely have to shoot 1080.
 
Tom said:
I mean, dude, in most situations you are going to want to shoot RAW unless you absolutely have to shoot 1080.
Click to expand...

Makes sense, just like with still photography, why shoot jpeg when you can shoot Raw.
 
The only justification to record 1080p from 3K to memory or hard disc will be to save on space.
Also it gives you 1080p monitoring capability.
RED did this 1080p only because customers did ask for it but it was argued for some time that it doesn’t make sense to have 1080p on 3K camera.
You can scale it down in post.
Yes, it saves space to dowres it on fly and store 1080p
It will probably be the best 1080p recorded quality on the market.
Price to pay, well 30fps instead 120fps at full 3K
 
There could be situations where you want to shoot 1080p just so you can quickly hand a client some footage or perhaps if you are running low on recording media. Also, post time on 1080p will be much faster than post time on 3K RAW.

But if you're trying to shoot something nice, 3K RAW is where it's at.
 
Remember, unless things have changed dramatically, you're only saving a significant amount of space if the 1080P is RedCode RAW, which it may be, but my understanding (which may be incorrect) was that 1080P was RGB scaled from the full sensor, since there are all manner of serious problems with scaling a RAW image.
 
Good point, Jason. There may not be a space savings.

The fact that the footage has already been demosaiced with 1080p will make post faster, but at the expense of quality, possibly.

With my timelapse on the 5D2, I tried a few shots in full JPEG, just because the CF space is less and render times in AE are like 1/5th the render times of full 5.6K RAW. But in most cases, I paid a heavy price for that convenience. Sometimes there would be hot pixel artifacts in the JPEGs (very tough to get rid of), or maybe the color temp or exposure were wrong.

For quality work, you cannot beat RAW.
 
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