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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

≤$1,000 Monitor for Grading/Editing

Jeff Kilgroe said:
Spectracal can do custom LUTs just fine with the latest releases. I believe they have REC-709 presets as well now too. It all comes down to the calibration technician, or person assuming that role, who is using the software and what they can or are willing to do. LightSpace and CineSpace are much better solutions, but they are also considerably more expensive. I actually like Spectracal, although it takes a much larger investment in time and setup, or at least it did in the past, in order to get up and running with it. Originally it was indeed targeted at home theatre or corporate AV rooms. Their first focus was to calibrate for THX home theatre specs.
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I would be very surprised, if Spectracal could build a proper viewing LUT, taking into an account profiled film LUT for a filmout. Can it create an XYZ, P3 or P7 LUT? There is much more to building a iewing LUT, than just being able to profile a monitor. But it's a start...
 
Technically the CalMan software can do these things and they are trying to make it even better to cater to this industry. They now have LUTs compatible with Resolve, Smoke and several others as well. The unfortunate downside is that many LUTs and color profiles must be created by hand or from scratch. Some people are willing to share, but most are not after they put in all the time to create them. Or at least not share for free. You can create a LUT for P3 based on spec and then profile a display and try to calibrate to it. What separates CalMan from the big boys is those bigger guys already have these color space targets defined and more integrated to their tools.

Anyway, what I'm saying is that it's entirely possible. ...But so is whittling out chopsticks with a chainsaw. LightSpace or CineSpace are the better way to go for this sort of application. CalMan/ SpectraCal are great for folks who just want to conform to REC-709 and get all their displays to do a reasonable job of matching.
 
Hey guys,

I got a Crossover 27" screen and it was fine. In fact im using it right now. I got it at ebay for $350 from accessorieswhole. With 14k positive feedback, it was a pretty safe bet. I almost wish I went for the $550 30" inche screen now.
 
Yeah, I'm still contemplating getting one of those knock-offs as a second monitor. Like I said, I went with the Dell and picked up a Spyder Elite calibrator. So far so good. I must say I like the Dell way more than my Apple Thunderbolt display, which currently sits unused on my floor.
 
Seems like most of these home calibration systems install software and adjust the signal being sent to the display, or am I totally off here? Can I use these to calibrate my Panasonic LCD studio monitor that's being fed off my Blackmagic card?
 
Jarek Zabczynski said:
Seems like most of these home calibration systems install software and adjust the signal being sent to the display, or am I totally off here? Can I use these to calibrate my Panasonic LCD studio monitor that's being fed off my Blackmagic card?
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Do you know about ColorHCFR? It's free calibration software that works with a number of 3rd party colorimeter probes. Do a little web search and you'll find lots of info.

http://www.homecinema-fr.com/colorimetre-hcfr/hcfr-colormeter/

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1393853/fork-of-hcfr-started-whats-needed

Cheers!
 
It may be overkill for some users/displays, but there is a lot of info about calibration on the Light Illusion website - www.lightillusion.com
And we always answer e-mail questions, and provide great calibration support.

For many smaller operations the LightSpace HCC (Home Cinema Calibration) version is ideal, with an I1 Display Pro OEM probe, and possibly an eeColor LUT box for real accurate calibration.

As I say, feel free to ask direct questions, via e-mail or the Light Illusion forums.

Steve
 
Correct me if I wrong. Is strategy of calibrating my monitor connected via Blackmagic output card follows:
1. Play reference images on it.
2. Correct brightness/contrast/saturation visually.
3. Measure the colors via colorimeter.
4. Compare results with reference.
5. Tune my monitor's settings by pressing button on it.
6. Repeat 3-5 to fine-tune.
Is it right way for correcting HDMI connected to PC monitor via BM card?
 
Software:

Lightspace - universal, best color accuracy, outstanding support, supports all (current) probes, export any LUT, it WORKS, i.e.: BEST RESULTS

Calman - only good for reports (which are very detailed), I would not trust this for ultimate color accuracy (we've done extensive tests), half of the features do not work (lots of bugs)

Chromapure - is another option, not sure about their LUT export capabilities.

Probes:

Colorimeter: i1D3 (cheapest option, US$200) - as with every colorimeter it needs to be profiled to a spectro, as colorimeter do drift over time and are inaccurate w/o offsets, u can actually cause more inaccuracy than anything else... colorimeters are inaccurate from the day u buy them, make sure u understand that - except maybe the K10 (with it's extended tables), but will also drift over time.

i1D3 is very cheap and decently fast for the price with good low light ability. Next best step up is basICColor Discus (~ US1K) or best: K-10 A (~US$7K).

cheapest spectro: get a used i1Pro rev D off ebay (~ US$300)... or buy a new i1Pro 2 (~ US$1K).


Some of the other probes mentioned in this thread are so old and outdated (--> drift), they're no good, unless you profile to a spectro, which then you only have to acknowledge the slower speed and inferior low light ability (bad blacks 0-20%). Get the i1D3 if you're looking for a cheap starting point.

- M

P.S.: In case you are considering the i1D3 (as a cheap first meter), note that there are 2 different versions of the i1D3: i1D3 Retail and i1D3 OEM - make sure to check with your calibration software (LS | CM | CP | etc) which meter is supported !
 
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there are so many sensors available now why can't monitors auto calibrate correctly at this point to the colour space you choose. i'm hoping the red projector is capable of auto calibration. Id rather spend my time grading not fiddling
 
Bing Bailey said:
there are so many sensors available now why can't monitors auto calibrate correctly at this point to the colour space you choose. i'm hoping the red projector is capable of auto calibration. Id rather spend my time grading not fiddling
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some Eizo screens (with a built-in cheap colorimeter) have an auto-cal feature... but it's not really useful...

accurate calibration depends on a few things, such as quality of hardware (what is your screen capable of), capability of the meter (measuring instrument), accuracy of the color engine (--> calibration software) and a few other things...

they can't built the hardware of a pro grade meter into the screen, Pro meters with costs up to US$30,000 cost as much or more than some of the expensive pro grade screens... and the meters are bigger size... and need to be serviced yearly (to prevent drift)...

once you would use cheap meter hardware, all bets are off...


but what will hopefully be implemented in the near future in more Pro and (finally) some consumer screens, is that you can load LUT's directly into the screen hardware w/o the need of LUT boxes as you can currently do already with FSI etc....
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
Bjorn is correct. No matter which monitor you're buying, unless you have a way to calibrate it to some standardized working target color space, then you're kinda wasting your time. Typically REC-709 or Adobe sRGB for most basic setups, for videos and photo work respectively.

If you can find one, a used DreamColor is a great way to go because they include the color probe and have internal calibration memory.
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They don't include it, it's extra, and it is absolute garbage. it will give you clipped whites (no really, they clip at around 88%). I have one here for sale but I did warn you. Get Lightspace and the weird $600 LUT box they sell, which can handle 10 bit, 2K and is awesome. We have four of them here, one for every monitor. Black Magic LUT box does not really work, Davio is really expensive for no added utility.
 
Doug Beatty said:
I learned the hard way that Davinci is not WYSIWYG when it comes to ICC profiles created by Xrite i1Display w/ the Xrite software wizard.

If you have a nicely calibrated set up on DVI and use Resolve, your output will look completely different than what you are seeing in the GUI on the exact same monitor with the exact same settings.

Regardless of the render (any flavor of MOV, TIF, DPX, DNxHD) toggling full range data on my clips in the media pool and the auto setting in the export pane and viewing in different players, I got a sick looking green desaturated tint on my clips.

If I understand correctly, the problem is with the ICC color matrix fooling you into thinking the image looks good when in fact it's actually pushing you further away from the look you want.

This is why DVI monitors should never be used for color critical work and why color probes for DVI LCD screens are a waste of money if you are thinking about using them in your grading suite.
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It's not about that at all. You are getting ICC noise - that is you are not using an neutral 0:0 flat profile on your computer when you do the calibration. Davinci Card is just a neutral ICC. You need your DVI to also be sending a neutral ICC, and then both will match exactly. RGB >YUV is identical translation. You can buy a $50 000 Dolby monitor with a DVI input - and it's plenty accurate even out of the box.
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
Technically the CalMan software can do these things and they are trying to make it even better to cater to this industry. They now have LUTs compatible with Resolve, Smoke and several others as well. The unfortunate downside is that many LUTs and color profiles must be created by hand or from scratch. Some people are willing to share, but most are not after they put in all the time to create them. Or at least not share for free. You can create a LUT for P3 based on spec and then profile a display and try to calibrate to it. What separates CalMan from the big boys is those bigger guys already have these color space targets defined and more integrated to their tools.

Anyway, what I'm saying is that it's entirely possible. ...But so is whittling out chopsticks with a chainsaw. LightSpace or CineSpace are the better way to go for this sort of application. CalMan/ SpectraCal are great for folks who just want to conform to REC-709 and get all their displays to do a reasonable job of matching.
Click to expand...

Not all LUT math is created equal. Lightspace display corrective LUTs (for the same monitor) have less banding (none vs some for Calman) and can be pushed much further.
 
R.ChilD said:
Hi! what about the LG IPS 21:9 ULTRAWIDE MONITOR
http://www.lg.com/au/premium-ips-monitors/index

or the LG IPS ColourPrime Monitor
http://www.lg.com/au/premium-ips-monitors/colorprime.jsp
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they're not native 10-bit, they're 8bit+FRC... other than that you would need to see pre-cal and post-cal reports (utilizing a correction LUT) for truly evaluating the capability of the hardware and the final color accuracy...

price is good, though :smilewinkgrin:

btw, the LUT box Robert mentions in his post above is the eeColor box that Light Illusion sells. It is the EXACT SAME HARDWARE as Spectrcal's color box, only that Spectracal charges 2.5 times the price.

The eeColor stores 65^3 LUT's, single HDMI in / out only, 1920x1080p max (I've not tested 2K as 1920x1080p is max spec) and is 12-bit - once a 3D LUT is being processed it drops to 10-bit.

- M
 
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