RPAs...

[James T Mather]

For me it depends on the project - visually zany whacky comedy? Wide angles might suit it. Sombre adult political thriller - not so much. Horses for courses.

Aside from that if you happen to come from a country where the rooms are not all 30 feet across then wider lenses might be a necessary requirement - the 35mm on R1 visually matches a 28mm - that's not a great wide angle option in a location based drama where I live. Look forward to the larger neg of the epic.

 

[Cüneyt Kaya]

I've done four 35mm anamorphic features and personally, I try to never use anything shorter than the 40mm because it just looks too wide and distorted, but I always carry a 35mm anamorphic lens just for those occasional shots where I have no choice. I've never used anything wider-angle than that in anamorphic.

Basically it's similar to using a 17.5mm lens in spherical 35mm cine to get your wide shot -- some people do that all the time, I tend to try to avoid going wider than a 24mm most of the time, unless I'm working with a wide-angle style director.

Again, a 40mm anamorphic is like shooting in Super-35 with a 20mm spherical, more or less, so ask yourself if a 20mm lens is not wide enough for your needs. If it isn't, you are going to need a 35mm anamorphic or shorter.

But I'm talking about shooting 4-perf 35mm. The anamorphic camera aperture is 22mm x 18.5mm in that case - on the Red One it is closer to 15mm x 12.5mm. With that degree of cropping, you need a 28mm anamorphic just to get what a 40mm anamorphic gives you on a 4-perf 35mm camera, and a 24mm anamorphic to get you what a 35mm anamorphic gives you.

first i want to thank you david, reading through your posts is like having yoda here talking to the padavans..hehe.

2nd so what would be a 40 mm ana (4perf 35mm) on a 5k Epic?
and what wou personnally prefer on a digital sensor when shooting ana, a 16:9 sensor or a close to square sensor?
thanks for your time and knowledge....if there is only a 16:9 sensor would you shoot ana on digital cameras just for the beauty of the lenses?

and maybe this is a more a q related to the ask d.mullen thread when would you never ever want to choose ana?

 

[Sanjin Jukic]

Btw., as I know that 50mm, 75mm and 100m are the most common focal lens sizes for anamorphic format on S35mm and maybe it looks limited but it's like it is...

so could be that some people think that is no enough but probably they should watch more movies shot anamorphic and learn about it...

 

[David Mullen ASC]

With a 2X anamorphic lens, all you are going to use of a sensor is a 1.20 : 1 area to get a 2.40 : 1 image.

So if the MX sensor in the EPIC is 30mm x 15mm, and you can use the max height of the sensor for recording, then a 1.20 : 1 area would be 18mm x 15mm -- compared to the 22mm x 18.5mm area used in 4-perf 35mm anamorphic.

That's a 1.2X magnification factor, so you'd use a 35mm anamorphic on the 5K Epic to get the same view as a 40mm anamorphic on a 4-perf 35mm negative. Or to think of it another way, just use the next shorter focal length to compensate -- 35mm instead of a 40mm, 40mm instead of a 50mm, etc. (Though you'd have to get the rarer 60mm anamorphic to match a 75mm anamorphic on a 35mm camera.)

40, 50, 75, 100 are probably the most commonly used focal lengths on a 35mm anamorphic shoot. As pointed out, almost every shot in Wes Anderson's last three anamorphic features were shot on a 40mm, except for the zoom shots. I think a lot of "Raiders of the Lost Ark" was shot on a 40mm. On the other hand, a lot of long-lensed stuff in Panavision anamorphic movies are shot on the 180mm E-Series lens (the longest front-element anamorphic prime they have, after that, they are all rear-adapted telephoto lenses.)

If I had a 16x9 sensor camera, then I'd only be using anamorphic lenses for that unusual bokeh and flare, otherwise it's actually a decrease in resolution compared to just using a good spherical lens and cropping top & bottom.

 

[Cüneyt Kaya]

With a 2X anamorphic lens, all you are going to use of a sensor is a 1.20 : 1 area to get a 2.40 : 1 image.

So if the MX sensor in the EPIC is 30mm x 15mm, and you can use the max height of the sensor for recording, then a 1.20 : 1 area would be 18mm x 15mm -- compared to the 22mm x 18.5mm area used in 4-perf 35mm anamorphic.

That's a 1.2X magnification factor, so you'd use a 35mm anamorphic on the 5K Epic to get the same view as a 40mm anamorphic on a 4-perf 35mm negative. Or to think of it another way, just use the next shorter focal length to compensate -- 35mm instead of a 40mm, 40mm instead of a 50mm, etc. (Though you'd have to get the rarer 60mm anamorphic to match a 75mm anamorphic on a 35mm camera.)

as always, thank you david.

 

[B Stanford]

You know Jim, with your new Hollywood location it would be very cool if you set up the final word in Red equipment rentals. Since I'm not in a position to buy every piece of glass or new accessories for my R1, it sure would be great to have a family rental company!

 

[Jannard]

You know Jim, with your new Hollywood location it would be very cool if you set up the final word in Red equipment rentals. Since I'm not in a position to buy every piece of glass or new accessories for my R1, it sure would be great to have a family rental company!

We are NOT going into the rental business. There are several rental companies nearby that can support you.

Jim

 

[Eric MacIver]

We are NOT going into the rental business. There are several rental companies nearby that can support you.

Jim

Thanks Jim. Yes, there are several of us... A few of which will carry everything Red makes, including these Anamorphics. I was just about to consider other options... Nice addition to your lens line.

 

[Todd M.]

Thanks Jim. Yes, there are several of us... A few of which will carry everything Red makes, including these Anamorphics. I was just about to consider other options... Nice addition to your lens line.

Just a word of support... have worked with Indie many times and always got great equipment and service.

 

[Nils J. Nesse]

Anamorphics that are actually affordable, fantastic. And something tells me they will outperform the competition. (Though I love Hawks.)

Please make them 2x, and cover the FF35 sensor!

 

[Dane Brehm]

This may sound silly but would it be appropriate for the RPA's to give you the accurate DOF and FOV of a true 35mm, 85mm, 100mm RPA based off the RED M-X Sensor Spec at 5K or 4K for that matter? If we are to use these lenses for RED products wouldn't we want to be correct when conveying information to others such as DPs? When I put a Panavision Primo or a Vantage Hawk on a Camera I can expect it to be what it says it is +- 1-2mm of focal length as not to create confusion? I can accept 3K and 2K Mode but I'm speaking specifically about RPA on RED Sensors M or M-X.

I am biased as I co-Own a Set of LOMO Anamorphics 35, 75, 100.

Thats my 2 cents,

BTW please, please make a 24mm I know it will cost more but the hardest Anamorphic lenses to get are the Wide ones. 35mm in 4K ANA is more like 40mm+ FOV.

 

[Tanner Field]

So, with the announcement of these new RPA (Which I hope to be using in a future shoot during spring of '11.) Is there any hope that the Scarlet models will gain a "de squeeze" anamorphic mode like the RED One and the Epics have?

 

[Emanuel A.]

I've done four 35mm anamorphic features and personally, I try to never use anything shorter than the 40mm because it just looks too wide and distorted, but I always carry a 35mm anamorphic lens just for those occasional shots where I have no choice. I've never used anything wider-angle than that in anamorphic.

Basically it's similar to using a 17.5mm lens in spherical 35mm cine to get your wide shot -- some people do that all the time, I tend to try to avoid going wider than a 24mm most of the time, unless I'm working with a wide-angle style director.

Again, a 40mm anamorphic is like shooting in Super-35 with a 20mm spherical, more or less, so ask yourself if a 20mm lens is not wide enough for your needs. If it isn't, you are going to need a 35mm anamorphic or shorter.

But I'm talking about shooting 4-perf 35mm. The anamorphic camera aperture is 22mm x 18.5mm in that case - on the Red One it is closer to 15mm x 12.5mm. With that degree of cropping, you need a 28mm anamorphic just to get what a 40mm anamorphic gives you on a 4-perf 35mm camera, and a 24mm anamorphic to get you what a 35mm anamorphic gives you.

Worthy advice (with B plan, opening doors rather than close them ;-) and true filmschool lesson, for free.

That « wide-angle style director » was funny.

 

[Emanuel A.]

That « wide-angle style director » was funny.

I guess there was no irony intended but above all, it made me smile anyway 'cause it was preceded by "a proper" «unless».

 

[Emanuel A.]

A lot of these lens discussions seem to break down into people who like really wide-angles and those that think they are a necessary evil but not preferred.

To me, they are visually "cool" and "neat" but that's also the reason I tend to avoid them, they make the shot "artificially" interesting, just because of the lens distortion. For a commercial or music video, that's fine, or for a stylized moment in a movie, but for more traditional narrative driven by performance, I find it hard to justify being that flashy.

BTW, I remember the hilarious story told about the famous Truffaut talks-interview to Hitchcock to whom the Nouvelle Vague director would have asked why there weren't shots outside the trains in his movies. Hitch replies why? For the cow's POV?... LOL

I wonder what he'd say if he could follow today the dandy shots inside the frigo, supermarket car or the oblique angles so often reproduced ad nauseum a little bit allover the media nowadays -- No mention of editing. ['The' MTV editing. Alright, I just said it! :-]

 

[Sven Seynaeve]

Superb!!!!!!!

 

[Ryan S]

So....if Red is planning for these lenses to be ready by the end of '10, how long will it be before we see some nicely stylized renders?

 

[Lewis-M Soucy]

A lot of these lens discussions seem to break down into people who like really wide-angles and those that think they are a necessary evil but not preferred.

To me, they are visually "cool" and "neat" but that's also the reason I tend to avoid them, they make the shot "artificially" interesting, just because of the lens distortion. For a commercial or music video, that's fine, or for a stylized moment in a movie, but for more traditional narrative driven by performance, I find it hard to justify being that flashy.

You just answered an annoying question that's been running in my head for weeks... Buy the RPPs set now, or wait for the RPAs, or buy the RPPs set now THEN sell it to buy the RPAs, OR buy the RPPs now AND buy the RPAs when available and keep both since they might have their individual use and personality... I agree with the lens affecting the performance. It's as much of a graphic choice as it is an emotional one...

Thanks for the clever post, you nailed it for me (and killed my budget in the process...) :thumbsup:

 

[Bal Deo]

looking forward to these.

 

[Shawn Nelson]

I noticed we didnt hear anything at all about the RPAs at NAB. Are they on the "backburner" so to speak? I heard a murmur that they are now 2x squeeze factor.