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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Don't forget...

B

Brook Willard

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...we mount a lot of stuff on these cameras. The modular design is totally awesome... but there won't be a module for everything.

5_1229920011.jpg


How do the rest of our accessories fit into the Epic equation?
 
I am going back to Bolex, .... winding the spring :)
 
"Holy 2nd's Nightmare Batman!!!! :waaa:
 
It makes me laugh to see RED's "renders". They always look so "elegant". Start including cables in your renders or rethink how the pieces are going to fit together.

Hilarious!
 
Dylan Macleod said:
It makes me laugh to see RED's "renders". They always look so "elegant". Start including cables in your renders or rethink how the pieces are going to fit together.

Hilarious!
Click to expand...

Thanks... I think.

The only cable missing from our renders is the LCD (or BombEVF) cable to make the camera operate. Some will use it this way. Others will create a "spaghetti train". Since we can't anticipate everything someone will plug into the camera, it doesn't make much sense to throw a bunch of random cables in our renders... and screw up the "elegance". :-)

If it helps you... all modules (other than displays) have internal connections and don't need cables to "talk to the Brain".

Jim
 
Jim,


Pay special attention to the design & testing of the internal connectors,
Ikegami and Sony both had some minor issues with the multi-pin "sandwich plate" design that allows the use of different modules. The plates would get dirty or pins would get misaligned etc.

I think the Module design is great! If you are able to incorporate a down converted analog out from the camera we could eliminate the AJA Box shown in the picture.

Dave
 
The Epic Renders ( as shown ) seem to be a bit lacking in 1/4 -20 screw holes with which to attach all the in-elegant, but still necessary stuff that it sometimes takes to actually use a camera.

There ones in the front will no doubt be quicky consumed by a top handle and EVF bracket.

Do you think we could get a few additional pairs of tapped holes towards the rear?

Matt Uhry
www.mattuhry
 
Stuff

Stuff

The modular design is totally awesome... but there won't be a module for everything. How do the rest of our accessories fit into the Epic equation?
Click to expand...

Hey Brook, that's pretty impressive.

Care to share a list of what's hooked up there?
 
Brook Willard said:
...we mount a lot of stuff on these cameras. The modular design is totally awesome... but there won't be a module for everything.

How do the rest of our accessories fit into the Epic equation?
Click to expand...

I'm assuming by using the words "we" and "our" you're referring to your strictly cine-style, large crew, union setups for work with RED One as pictured.

As you know, RED One has been, is now, and will continue to be used extensively in non-hardlined EFP production, usually with small, mobile, sight focusing crews using setups which almost always feature a lot less cables and attachments than you have pictured - and more often than not, no matte box or follow focus. In terms of sheer volume of productions worldwide each year, non-hardlined EFP dwarfs all other styles and sub-styles of production, and our style of production is generally much more streamlined than cine style.

Being smaller and more modular than RED One, IMO Epic will be used even more broadly in non-hardlined EFP production than RED One is. Then comes the DSMC concept also. The non-hardlined EFP shooters tend to be the convergence shooters who will maximize the breadth of production techniques that the DSMC cameras enable. On most non-hardlined EFP projects the small, non-union crews will also use Epic (and Scarlet) in the DSMC mode, getting production stills on location.

When you show pics like those, and use words like "we" and "our" in referring to them and the ergo/connector/setup needs of Epic (and Scarlet), I think it is important for RED User members, and RED Team to understand that you aren't speaking for the overall needs of all of us, but rather your own cine-style, union, large crew needs.

With the millions of ways to set up an Epic and Scarlet, and the extremely broad range of styles of production, genres and sub-genres the cameras will be used in, modularity and flexibility in exterior cable and accessory option are not a luxury, but rather a necessity.

I'll be buying several Epic and Scarlet cameras - and I fully expect to setup them quickly and easily for the non-hardlined EFP and hybrid cine-EFP style work me and my crews do - and also for shooting digital stills, and for the occasional pure cine-style work we do.

Epic and Scarlet are convergence cameras, and as such, workers in one style will have the flexibility to set them up for their workflow, but need to be sensitive to the needs of those of use who are non-union, and will use them in all the styles that the cameras enable, and that RED intended them to be used in.
 
Hi Stewart,

Could actually be worse, only 1 out of 5 of those shots has any audio hooked up ! and only 2 out of 5 have electronic lens controls in evidence. There is a reason AC's get so fussy about where connectors are and the angle they rest at.

The render that Red posted in late august, where the connectors pointed 45deg. towards the rear looked good any chance of getting back to that, still in a module?.

Also make the audio component a distinct module from picture related stuff. Let a reputable digital audio company make it. Sound guys will NEVER be happy with anything Red makes, regardless of how good it actually is. Built in audio to them is like a fixed lens to a D.P.

Matt Uhry
www.mattuhry.com
 
Matt Uhry said:
Sound guys will NEVER be happy with anything Red makes, regardless of how good it actually is. Built in audio to them is like a fixed lens to a D.P.

Matt Uhry
Click to expand...

My RED cameras have received the sound board upgrade - and it seriously rocks. My sound guys, and myself when I also do sound work when using my cameras, are all now very happy with the in-camera sound capabilities of RED One.

As I posted in my last post on this thread, RED One, Epic, and Scarlet were all planned by RED and designed to be setup for use in cine-style (where audio is usually off-camera), non-hardlined EFP style (where audio is frequently in-camera), and stills mode (obviously without audio).

If you don't need the in-camera audio in your workflow, fine, don't use it. But for those of us who regularly use the in-camera audio capabilities of RED One (and Epic and Scarlet to come), the capability needs to be there.

BTW - many of us multi-genre and multi-style DPs with open minds and broad skill sets regularly get excellent images with fixed lens cameras and will do so when it makes sense with the Scarlet fixed lens version :-)
 
Hey Gibby,

What you say is true, however, there are those of us who do use our cameras with all that gack on them, and Epic seems to be targeting that market, so I don't really get your point. Sure you can use a camera stripped down, but shouldn't you make it compatible with standard production protocol?

I also think that there are going to be a lot more epics shooting spots and episodic, than NGT specials and surf videos.

Just my opinion, I may be wrong,

Nick
 
Jannard said:
Thanks... I think.

The only cable missing from our renders is the LCD (or BombEVF) cable to make the camera operate. Some will use it this way. Others will create a "spaghetti train". Since we can't anticipate everything someone will plug into the camera, it doesn't make much sense to throw a bunch of random cables in our renders... and screw up the "elegance". :-)

If it helps you... all modules (other than displays) have internal connections and don't need cables to "talk to the Brain".

Jim
Click to expand...

This is great news!
 
arrinick said:
Hey Gibby,

What you say is true, however, there are those of us who do use our cameras with all that gack on them, and Epic seems to be targeting that market, so I don't really get your point. Sure you can use a camera stripped down, but shouldn't you make it compatible with standard production protocol?

I also think that there are going to be a lot more epics shooting spots and episodic, than NGT specials and surf videos.

Just my opinion, I may be wrong,

Nick
Click to expand...

Actually RED has targeted Epic at the cine, EFP, and digital still market, depending on how you accessorize the camera. That's why it is so modular and flexible in setup options.

Yes, the option to make Epic compatible with standard protocol needs to be there - just as the quick options to re-accessorize the camera for EFP or stills work needs to be there - otherwise it is a less flexible camera system.

I disagree that numerically there will be a lot more Epics shooting spots and episodics than non-hardlined EFP productions. Features and spots get a lot of publicity, but the overall EFP market dwarfs the features and spots market in terms of number of productions done each year.

Epic and Scarlet are convergence cameras. It shouldn't offend the ego of straight cine-style workers that EFP and stills people are also using those cameras. There no need to stake out Epic as a "my workflow" camera - it will be and should be a "whatever workflow I need" camera.

That "NGT specials and surf videos" comment about my work was uninformed and uncalled for. I work in a broad range of EFP and cine genres and sub-genres of production for 14 different broadcast and cable networks. You can read my bio on my the Redconnector link in my signature block.
 
Hi Gibby,

No offense intended by the NGT/surf video comment. Honestly, I have no idea what you do. I have shot a bunch of National Geographic Television Specials, and used that as an example of a job I would not want an epic on, and figured surf/skate/snowboard videos was another end of the spectrum that would want a more straightforward camera that's all.

I just think Epic is the wrong choice for a one man band Doc shoot, and it will most likely be gunning for the high end market. I see Epic targeting Jobs with crews, not stuff that used to be a guy with a varicam and a sound guy if he was lucky.

Sure you can window the sensor, use eng lenses etc, but at that point why are you using the camera in the first place?

On the other hand, I just finished a Doc shoot in the Middle East with the Red, 35mm lenses and the crew was Me, 1st AC, and sound guy, so go figure......
 
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