ultraprimes and focal length for 3D

[Ketch Rossi]

Keith, I'd have to say that as a DP, I would never work with a director who shut the DP out of discussions on what lens to shoot a scene with! Doesn't matter if it's a 3D movie or not. That's like shutting the costumer out of involvement in what fabric to sew a costume out of. DP means "Director of Photography" and if lenses don't fall under the category of photography, then nothing does. What's next, are you going to work directly with the Gaffer and shut the DP out of lighting decisions as well?

David, I will absolutely and always involve the DP, that is why He is there in the first place, and why I wrote, "the decision is not that of the DP alone"
but never rely solely on the word of a DP coming from 2D for a lens recommendation on 3D, I have seen this happening the wrong way too many times
already on Major 3D sets, so this is what I meant, not to only leave such decision one of the most critically important, to the DP, unless He/She is a 3D DP, with experience in several other 3D projects.

I am a DP my self, so in my projects if a DP is required do to my self having other positions that would keep me too busy to also take
over the important position of the DP, then my DP will be consulted, but still never been given the sole role of choosing Focal unless again
He/She has already done several 3D projects and most importantly has been working on the Script with me.

But if privileged to work with some one like you David, I'm sure that lot more consulting would be done, as I love your work.


Btw, my name is spelled "KETCH" not "KEITH"

 

[David Mullen ASC]

Btw, my name is spelled "KETCH" not "KEITH"

Sorry, I'll fix that. Was typing too fast...

As a DP, I never pick a lens without involving the director anyway, that's why there's a director. And if I did a 3D movie, then obviously the stereographer would be involved too.

 

[Jason Goodman]

Michael
Do you say they have to be factory matched in order to work well on the 3d rigs?

Rather than buying a set now and a set later I would certainly recommend buying two of each at the same time and letting the factory know you will use them for 3D. This way they can match them as closely as possible. I have been on productions that used primes (Ultra Primes specifically) that have not been well matched at all. These were rental lenses, probably of widely varying ages, but it makes sense to have them factory matched. Angenieux does an outstanding job with this process, I have not evaluated any primes that have specifically claimed to be factory matched though.

 

[Ketch Rossi]

Sorry, I'll fix that. Was typing too fast...

As a DP, I never pick a lens without involving the director anyway, that's why there's a director. And if I did a 3D movie, then obviously the stereographer would be involved too.

He he, thanks David,

yeah and that is why I would be privileged to have you as a DP on any of our projects, it is not only the skills that
one brings, but also attitude, and I like yours...

 

[Michael Hastings]

Do you have the updated version?
I send you an email.
thanks

Gregory lives in my neighborhood here in Weston(ft. Lauderdale) Florida. He is bringing a set of the latest version to try on epic tomorrow. I'm just trying to help Gregory market them as I think they offer an awful lot of bang for the buck and deserve to be better known.

 

[Peter Lyons Collister ASC]

We have some fairly complete sets of UPs on Spiderman. Both 1st and 2nd Unit. 16,20,24,28,32,40,50,65,85,100,135. We found 135 to be the limit with the beamsplitter rigs.
The pairs of lenses were matched by Dan Sasaki at Panavision. We are being very exact with our pixel matching with the 3Ality rigs.

While Ketch is correct about 3D effect with wider lenses we are trying to shoot more medium focal lengths and we shoot at around a 2.8 to limit the DOF to a degree.
Remember even in 3D the filmmakers should try to direct the audience's eye to where they want it. Watch Avatar and you will see what Cameron and Darius did vis-a-vis DOF.

Remember ever scene and/or shot should not have a giant 3D effect. This is where a good relationship with your stereographer comes into play.

A good sterographer really can help a director and DP.

Peter

 

[Ketch Rossi]

We have some fairly complete sets of UPs on Spiderman. Both 1st and 2nd Unit. 16,20,24,28,32,40,50,65,85,100,135. We found 135 to be the limit with the beamsplitter rigs.
The pairs of lenses were matched by Dan Sasaki at Panavision. We are being very exact with our pixel matching with the 3Ality rigs.

While Ketch is correct about 3D effect with wider lenses we are trying to shoot more medium focal lengths and we shoot at around a 2.8 to limit the DOF to a degree.
Remember even in 3D the filmmakers should try to direct the audience's eye to where they want it. Watch Avatar and you will see what Cameron and Darius did vis-a-vis DOF.

Remember ever scene and/or shot should not have a giant 3D effect. This is where a good relationship with your stereographer comes into play.

A good sterographer really can help a director and DP.

Peter

I love the super wide focal for some of those extreme 3dimentional effects, but I also prefer for much of the story to be told
at about 35 to 75mm, and create a Depth budget with background lighted items to enhance dimentionality, yet keep it easy on
the eye when focused on the main characters.

I also believe that it is important to keep the out of screen experience to a calculated interval so to rest the visual cortex and also get more of that Wow effect.

Really can't wait to see Spiderman 3D, I firmly believe, especially after visiting the Set and observing the amount of work done,
and the people involved, and oh... of course the camera used, Spiderman will be one of those 3D movies that will mark
a new era of 3D.

 

[albert rudnicki]

Rather than buying a set now and a set later I would certainly recommend buying two of each at the same time and letting the factory know you will use them for 3D. This way they can match them as closely as possible. I have been on productions that used primes (Ultra Primes specifically) that have not been well matched at all. These were rental lenses, probably of widely varying ages, but it makes sense to have them factory matched. Angenieux does an outstanding job with this process, I have not evaluated any primes that have specifically claimed to be factory matched though.

Jason, thanks for valuable info.
Unfortunately I will not be getting two sets.
I had always imagined that ultras are ultras.
It's actually putting things in perspective now.
PS
IF anyone in Toronto or in Montreal is about to purchase a set, please let me know.

 

[albert rudnicki]

We have some fairly complete sets of UPs on Spiderman. Both 1st and 2nd Unit. 16,20,24,28,32,40,50,65,85,100,135. We found 135 to be the limit with the beamsplitter rigs.
The pairs of lenses were matched by Dan Sasaki at Panavision. We are being very exact with our pixel matching with the 3Ality rigs.
Peter

Great info Peter.
I can only assume then, that 16,24,32,50,85 will do just fine
I would imagine that tele in 3d can also be easily faked.

thanks

 

[albert rudnicki]

I love the super wide focal for some of those extreme 3dimentional effects, but I also prefer for much of the story to be told
at about 35 to 75mm, and create a Depth budget with background lighted items to enhance dimentionality, yet keep it easy on
the eye when focused on the main characters.

I also believe that it is important to keep the out of screen experience to a calculated interval so to rest the visual cortex and also get more of that Wow effect.

Really can't wait to see Spiderman 3D, I firmly believe, especially after visiting the Set and observing the amount of work done,
and the people involved, and oh... of course the camera used, Spiderman will be one of those 3D movies that will mark
a new era of 3D.

Hey Ketch, thanks for your input.
I had always imagined that 3d should stay within safe margins.
I am very much curious about 3d and super wide approach.
In live shows it could bring different dynamics.
Can you refer me to some examples.
Thanks again

Albert

 

[David Mullen ASC]

While Ketch is correct about 3D effect with wider lenses we are trying to shoot more medium focal lengths and we shoot at around a 2.8 to limit the DOF to a degree.
Remember even in 3D the filmmakers should try to direct the audience's eye to where they want it. Watch Avatar and you will see what Cameron and Darius did vis-a-vis DOF.

Yes, but keep in mind that "Avatar" was shot with a 2/3" camera so they automatically had the equivalent of 2.5 stops more depth of field... so if they shot at f/2.0 on "Avatar", which is generally the fastest you can go on most 2/3" lenses... you'd have to shoot at an f/.4.0-5.6 to get the same depth of field with an Epic. In other words, there's no way "Avatar" could get as shallow a depth of field as an Epic shooting at f/2.8, right?

 

[Ketch Rossi]

Hey Ketch, thanks for your input.
I had always imagined that 3d should stay within safe margins.
I am very much curious about 3d and super wide approach.
In live shows it could bring different dynamics.
Can you refer me to some examples.
Thanks again

Albert

Most welcome Albert,

we'll be doing some shoots that I can share, till then all I have seen and been part of is strictly NDA, can't share any images.

Yes, but keep in mind that "Avatar" was shot with a 2/3" camera so they automatically had the equivalent of 2.5 stops more depth of field... so if they shot at f/2.0 on "Avatar", which is generally the fastest you can go on most 2/3" lenses... you'd have to shoot at an f/.4.0-5.6 to get the same depth of field with an Epic. In other words, there's no way "Avatar" could get as shallow a depth of field as an Epic shooting at f/2.8, right?

Correct, even so lots of the BG blur was also added in post.

 

[AnthonyFlores]

Really can't wait to see Spiderman 3D, I firmly believe, especially after visiting the Set and observing the amount of work done, and the people involved, and oh... of course the camera used, Spiderman will be one of those 3D movies that will mark
a new era of 3D.

Although I didn't visit the set, I'm with you 1000% here ... can't wait to see it on the big screen. Really bummed that the release date is probably not until 2012 some time (right?) ... but I guess patience is a virtue

 

[Jason Goodman]

Anthony,

Sony has announced that the Amazing Spider-Man will be released July 3, 2012. The entire crew is working incredibly hard to ensure this film will be as exciting as everyone hopes and I can tell you it will not disappoint.

 

[AnthonyFlores]

Anthony,

Sony has announced that the Amazing Spider-Man will be released July 3, 2012. The entire crew is working incredibly hard to ensure this film will be as exciting as everyone hopes and I can tell you it will not disappoint.

Thanks Jason! If the world has not ended by then, I assure you I will be one of the very first in line

Anthony

 

[Rich Schaefer]

We are trying to shoot more medium focal lengths and we shoot at around a 2.8 to limit the DOF to a degree.

Hi Peter, What focal lengths would you say you and John are using most? Is it all primes or are you guys also using zooms?

Thanks much,
Rich