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ZF or MM 85mm f/1.4?

Roberto Lequeux

Roberto Lequeux

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I am thinking about picking up an 85mm for portrait photography.

How would you say a great sample of a Contax MM 85mm f/1.4 stacks up against the ZF counterpart?

I am having a hard time finding samples of the MM. All I found so far is THIS review, which I believe isn't about the correct lens.

And which is best? Japan made or German made?
 
Don't know the Contax, but I can tell you the 85/1.4 ZF is the cream of the crop.

If I could use it all the time I would. In my opinion it's the best ZF.
 
I just played with one today and loved it too. However, it is a little more money and this is my personal (small) kit. Also, it requires an adapter for Canon DSLRs since you need to use the Nikon mount or you lose the aperture ring.

It seems the German version isn't better, just "more authentic". And it seems the Japanese version is a bit sharper wide open.

I'd love to see more samples, but I can't find many.
 
Now that I think of it, I believe I heard that they are made in the same factory in Japan, and Zeiss just market them.

In fact, they may be the exact same lenses!
 
jimhare said:
Now that I think of it, I believe I heard that they are made in the same factory in Japan, and Zeiss just market them.

In fact, they may be the exact same lenses!
Click to expand...


There is a lot of miss-information on the net concerning Zeiss Contax Glass.
Here is the correct Contax mount 85mm lens info, & where each model was produced.

The Zeiss 85mm in a Contax, or C/Y mount was available in the following configurations...

85mm f1.2 Planar MM Germany
85mm f1.2 Planar AE Germany
85mm f1.4 Planar AE Germany
85mm f1.4 Planar MM Japan
85mm f2.8 Sonnar AE Germany
85mm f2.8 Sonnar MM Japan

As far as how the older Contax mount lens stacks up against the newer ZF mount lens... the quality is going to be comparable.
In my opinion, I put the advantage in the C/Y mount corner for the following reasons.
The Zeiss Contax mount lenses focus the same direction as cinema lenses.
The C/Y mount lenses are less expensive than new ZF mount lenses.
The ZF lens range is still limited, while there are over 40 different lenses available in the C/Y mount lineup.

Enjoy!
 
Thanks.

I guess I am after an MM f/1.4. I heard the MM's were better in some aspects due to an update in the design.

While there are 40 it seems people don't want to let them go cause I am not seeing too many of them for sale. I was trying to figure out what a good set would be and tried looking for prices, but I found next to nothing in terms of prime variety.
 
Roberto Lequeux said:
Thanks.

I guess I am after an MM f/1.4. I heard the MM's were better in some aspects due to an update in the design.

While there are 40 it seems people don't want to let them go cause I am not seeing too many of them for sale. I was trying to figure out what a good set would be and tried looking for prices, but I found next to nothing in terms of prime variety.
Click to expand...

Roberto:

I used C/Y lenses exclusively for several months in early '08 when I had a birger EOS mount before it had a focus knob. The C/Y can be used on Canon Birger or the Canon DSLRs with a simple ~$20 adapter.

We used The 1.4 50mm 28mm 2.8 85 1.4 and 300mm F/4 and these are all beautiful lenses: sharp and with that beautiful zeiss microcontrast - essentially the same optically as the new compact primes. I still use these lenses even though I have Birger/EOS fully functional now because I have the 17-55 and 70-200 Canon zooms that are f2.8 so they are two stops faster.

The other thing about them is the sweet mechanics. Focus rotation is about 200 degrees on the 50mm; 250 degrees on the 85mm; and about 320 on the 300mm.

I have duplicates of the 85mm and the 300mm because Jorge at Cinematechnic was going to convert them to PL mount but never got around to it (from what I understand the telephotos are fairly easy to convert because there is plenty of room to move the iris), as well as a duplicate 50mm f 1.4 that came with a Contax 139 body that I bought.

I would sell those for whatever the reasonable going rate is.

I also have a 28mm f2.8 that I would sell since I don't use it much - it is covered in the 17-55 zoom with same stop. Feel free to call me to discuss.

The 85 and 28mm say made in Germany (so I assume they are the MMs); the 50 and 300 are made in Japan.

PS I was so impressed with the C/Y Zeiss lenses I am thinking of getting the Epic 645 and using Contax 645 lenses to shoot 9K.
 
Don't know about the MM but I've owned the C/Y 85mm f1.4 and it was, optically, bloody amazing. I mean, needing permanent Softars kinda sharp. The focus ring was the only issue. The ring was so thin you could make the focus bind by gripping too tightly. I've often wondered if a geared ring might actually help keep it round and stop it distorting.
 
Hey Roberto, on Michaels' lenses, that 28mm is a real gem too. Just a lovely look to it.

I miss my RTS's.
 
Roberto Lequeux said:
Thanks.

I guess I am after an MM f/1.4. I heard the MM's were better in some aspects due to an update in the design.

While there are 40 it seems people don't want to let them go cause I am not seeing too many of them for sale. I was trying to figure out what a good set would be and tried looking for prices, but I found next to nothing in terms of prime variety.
Click to expand...


The basic difference between the MM and AE lenses...
The older AE lenses work in aperture priority, auto exposure, & manual modes. The later multi-mode, or MM lenses will also work in program AE & shutter priority, auto exposure, as well as aperture priority & manual modes. But since you are not using these lenses on a Contax SLR camera, you'll get no substantial benefit from purchasing MM lenses over AE lenses.

At one point all of this wonderful glass was readily available.
But when 35mm DOF adapters came on the scene, people started scooping up high quality vintage glass, driving the prices way up because of demand.
You might have a look on ebay, as they usually have a pretty good supply of lenses for sale.

Here are a few of mine.
 

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Here is my example from Germany.
A little worn, but after a fresh rebuild & focus gear install, I'll have to say it is a great hunk of glass.
 

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Michael, thanks for the offer. Just FYI: ATM I am trying to figure out if I can get a low rental on the 85mm for portrait photography. And use my (little) left over cash for a Tokina 11-16 f/2.8, which I need more to compliment the 24-70mm f/2.8 I have on the mail. If I can't line up a good rate on rentals I will make sure and contact you before purchasing to see if we can make a good transaction for both.

David, if I could, I would kick you in the chin, repeatedly. You bastard. ;)

Shane, I saw some 28mm samples and I agree with you! That 28mm is a gem. I would probably go for the f/2.0 though since, while not as perfect, the 24-70mm f/2.8 does perform very well at 28mm wide open. I suppose that coupled with a fast 50mm and a the 85mm, and the Tokina, it would be a very decent set to slowly work my way towards building.
 
Roberto Lequeux said:
That 28mm is a gem. I would probably go for the f/2.0 though since, while not as perfect, the 24-70mm f/2.8 does perform very well at 28mm wide open..
Click to expand...


The 28/2.0 also has a little better close focus with the floating front element than the 28/2.8, 5" compared to 5 1/2" if memory serves correctly.
 
Something else I forgot to mention concerning the Zeiss C/Y AE & MM lenses.

I own both an AE & MM version of the 50/1.4 lens because of the changes in the diaphragm between the 2 models. The AE produces that ninja star bokeh between f2-f4
where the MM does not.
 
Of course that Ninja Star bokeh is not something that everyone likes.
It sort of reminds me of the MK 1 B-Speed bokeh.
But if you are shooting a medium shot of a couple on an ice skating rink for a christmas promo with glittery lights in the background,
and you want something just a little different to set off the BG, here ya go.
 
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