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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Why I think RED Ray hasn't been released...

Torrie said:
Being able to finish a project in 2K+ and then have a way to master it with the ability to output picture and sound to send to a post house that has HDSR for a downconversion would be fantastic. The SR is still 80,000+ with all the boards.

Even if Red Ray/4K is 1/10th the price and you add a RED Rocket™™™™, you're still potentially way ahead...and I'm referring to TV post work mostly here.
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If I'm not mistaken, Red Ray is a highly compressed delivery media player. Any further downconversions should be done from a master.
 
Mark L. Pederson said:
We are talking to a network about to launch a 3D channel in less than 8 weeks about producing content - and it is PAINFUL to see 4K 3D down to 1080i (WHY are we still broadcasting interlaced!!!) - in side-by-side format (think 50% of horizontal resolution) - then CRUSHED TO HOLY HELL in MPEG2. And yes - this network is looking at the option of a MPEG4 stream in a MPEG2 wrapper, etc. - but when these 3D channels launch - ya better lower your expectation with respect to image quality.
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Wow, sounds terrible. Even HD television here makes me cringe - like you said, it's still interlaced (what idiot let interlacing be part of any HD standard, I don't know...), and then squeezed into a DVB-T transmission stream in crappy MPEG2 with one or two SD channels. I don't have cable (in Australia we have a pretty good selection of content free to air - about 12 different channels, which is plenty if you watch as little TV as I do).

I think the main problems are that they're using MPEG2, and that you are allowed to have SD channels. I would much rather that there were only good quality progressive HD H.264 channels, and that they were downscaled in the set-top box to 576i if you wanted SD. That would stop the large amount of bandwidth we waste having duplicate channels for HD and SD...

Hopefully in three years my RED 4K player will be able to download content on-demand and downscale for my 1080p TV.
 
Stephen Gentle said:
I think the main problems are that they're using MPEG2, and that you are allowed to have SD channels. I would much rather that there were only good quality progressive HD H.264 channels, and that they were downscaled in the set-top box to 576i if you wanted SD. That would stop the large amount of bandwidth we waste having duplicate channels for HD and SD...
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They would also much rather like having only good quality progressive, but the existing broadcasting infrastructure, which is uncapable of 1080p (not all, some is) needs to pay off first. Plus the fact that a large portion of broadcast content is not progressive in the first place.
 
Steven Caesare said:
It hasn't been releaesed yet because of the gestation period of the Magic Pixie.

-sc

PS- Latest comments from Red indicate that the solution is no longer going to use optical discs... solid state media and HDD's would be the assumption. And perhaps streaming.
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Where did you see those comments Steven?

Thanks
Eric
 
I'm fairly certain Fox HD is all 720P, and possibly ABC as well. And isn't HDSR in 4:2:2 recording the compression ratio 2.7/1, and in 4:4:4 recording the compression ratio is 4.2/1 as it is?

Based on Jim's recent comments about RC 250 it would make sense that Red Ray is going to be able to handle that throughput.
 
I forgot or overlooked that Red Ray should be able to play files from various RED media types and even raw r3d. My bad.

As far as further downconversion to external hardware is concerned, I'm guessing this is preconditioned with ability to output master as r3d.
 
Joseph Hutson said:
EPIC's first stage was to be out in December. They were expecting EPIC stages 2-4 to be in full progression by March so RED Ray would have the demand. Since this demand isn't there, they are saving the "punch" for a little bit later when 5K is adopted more widely.

With "drama" that has apparently come up in the last 3 months, why would RED want to jump the gun and release RED Ray prematurely?

Thoughts?
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Lol... Drama is a name of a camera system being developed in Greece.

I scratched my head for a few sceonds until I got it.

:biggrin5:
 
There was a thread with extensive discussion with Otis on DVInfo.net and he has an account on DVXUser too as you can see.

It's a 1080/24p/12bit camera, according to Otis and is a very different system from Scarlet, but definitely sounds like something worth considering, also with a very competitive price.

Message Otis there and ask some questions if you want more info.
 
The announcement of the new Sony SR memory card is interesting...I think it could gain a lot of traction being able to handle 4K...provided you can in fact write back to one of these cards. SR is hugely respected among broadcasters and QC folks for distribution.

This was being whispered about among certain engineers more than a year ago...I was asking about shelf life of an SRW-5800 and they said, "Don't"...this is coming.

It probably has Jim's attention now, as depending on the price it could be a competitor to Red Ray for mastering. But knowing Sony it will be about 10x the cost. Though it does push the envelope!
 
REDRay data at 4k 15mbps, for distribution will fit on a 50¢ DVD, or a USB stick. It's pretty hard to beat that for your quality / dollar ratio. When people see the demos at the studio, they can't really believe what they're seeing. Quite funny really. 4k doesn't have to cost $$$. We've proven that.

Graeme
 
Graeme -do you believe RedRay is a 'masterable' format? Was this the intent of the product? Is it a master format that could be used to generate broadcast deliverables?
 
REDRay is for distribution.

Graeme
 
I lived in a cinema environment for over eight years and know very well it takes a long time for things to change. There is little interest unless it is financially driven (obviously). General managers and cinemas really don't care how something is shown as long as people come through the doors. They are only just installing the DLP 2k projectors who would they change...well we know but they couldnt give a shit as long as the competitors don't have it, and it is drawing people away from them.

I think the important people to get RED 4K to is the independents (art-house) who will be seriously stung by digital cinema. They are assisted in the UK but still struggle. The problem then is a relatively affordable 4K projector.
 
Tim Hole said:
I lived in a cinema environment for over eight years and know very well it takes a long time for things to change. There is little interest unless it is financially driven (obviously). General managers and cinemas really don't care how something is shown as long as people come through the doors. They are only just installing the DLP 2k projectors who would they change...well we know but they couldnt give a shit as long as the competitors don't have it, and it is drawing people away from them.

I think the important people to get RED 4K to is the independents (art-house) who will be seriously stung by digital cinema. They are assisted in the UK but still struggle. The problem then is a relatively affordable 4K projector.
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We really want a RED RAY(or whatever it will be called when it is shipped) at the Downtown Independent. Even if we can't project 4k(right now at least) it will solve so many problems we now have with films being delivered in dozens of different codecs and billions of parametric combinations within those codecs. If we could tell clients "just send us a usb stick with RED4K" it would cure so many headaches instantly...
 
Mark L. Pederson said:
Well ... the missing link here IMHO is an affordable 4K display.

The more you look at RED originated content - the more your standards of image fidelity go up. I actually HATE watching 35mm prints now. Even if the film is shot on 35mm - I'll now take extra effort to see it projected digitally.

We are talking to a network about to launch a 3D channel in less than 8 weeks about producing content - and it is PAINFUL to see 4K 3D down to 1080i (WHY are we still broadcasting interlaced!!!) - in side-by-side format (think 50% of horizontal resolution) - then CRUSHED TO HOLY HELL in MPEG2. And yes - this network is looking at the option of a MPEG4 stream in a MPEG2 wrapper, etc. - but when these 3D channels launch - ya better lower your expectation with respect to image quality.

Sorry for the rant - but for the love of God - gimme my RED 4K !!!! And gimme 3D out of my RED RAY PRO player!!
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I could not agree with you more, Mark.. but its still ways away.. unfortunately, it tucked long in off for HD, but I wish nothing more then for it all to go 4K!!


Graeme Nattress said:
REDRay is for distribution.

Graeme
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BINGO!!
 
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