Vizzywig 4K Footage (Anamorphic Lens - Swift M3 Stabilizer)

[David Kuhn]

Very impressive 4k video test output - does look like 24fps of iphone stills (both from 'the good' and 'the bad' perspectives), I could see this being pretty handy for shots in tight spaces, and I doubt the 4k gopro will look any better (have not been overly impressed with gopro footage... it's not BAD... but it does look about the same as phone footage).

I'd not pay a grand for it unless I really needed to get into a tight spot and had to get the shot, which is to say... maybe but only if there was a specific need.

 

[Les Dittert]

is there a reason that the examples seem to be static tripod shots? Phone shooters will usually not be using a tripod and be more likely to be shooting run and gun.

 

[michael zaletel]

i agree with their assessment: i would buy this for 49.99 in a heartbeat and my iPhones, iPads are full of apps i thought had potential and i never use. this i would probably use but there is no way i would pay that much for it. panasonic just came out with the DMC-CM1 http://nofilmschool.com/2014/09/pan...pact-camera-lx100-gm5-price-cost-release-date and i believe it is 1100.

Thanks Christof,

I think most people don't realize how expensive it is to develop software. Take RED for example, how much do you think they spent on just the software side of developing their cameras and workflow tools? The challenge with a $49.99 price is that in the AppStore ecosystem, we have to give free upgrades for the life of the app. That's really hard to do for years to come as new devices are launched. Everyone says, well, just sell tens of thousands of copies at $50 instead but they don't realize how hard that is to do. There are over 1 million developers and over 2 million apps. How many of those make even $100 a day?

I realize there are inexpensive 4K cameras but those are not capturing full 4K still images at the rate of 24 individual 3MB JPG photos per second. Our 4K is future proof. You will be able to archive the still image sequences and audio files and apply H.267 compression to it 10 years from now or even resample it up to 8K with new software that works best only on high shutter speed 4K still image sequences with no motion compression or motion blur baked in.

But most importantly, none of these other devices allow you to EDIT 4K, trim and move clips, insert smooth 4K transitions, apply smooth zoom moves, add 4K titles and lower thirds and scrolling credits and background music and then export still image sequences of the entire edited session plus HD and 4K H.264 then upload it to YouTube or Vimeo in 4K. You cannot just compare Vizzywig 4K to another 4K camera, you have to compare it to the camera plus the laptop plus the NLE software. Mostly though, why wouldn't you pay $1,000 for the convenience and time savings vs. the alternatives?

-Michael

 

[michael zaletel]

Very impressive 4k video test output - does look like 24fps of iphone stills (both from 'the good' and 'the bad' perspectives), I could see this being pretty handy for shots in tight spaces, and I doubt the 4k gopro will look any better (have not been overly impressed with gopro footage... it's not BAD... but it does look about the same as phone footage).

I'd not pay a grand for it unless I really needed to get into a tight spot and had to get the shot, which is to say... maybe but only if there was a specific need.

Thanks David. I personally believe it looks amazing and I would cut it in with high-end 4K in many cases.

With iOS 8, we will be able to explicitly set the shutter speed and ISO. Right now, with iOS 7, it is using a very fast shutter speed outdoors in almost all cases. However, I personally like that because the stills are pristine, I can slow the heck out of it with Twixtor since there is no motion blur and I can add motion blur easily in After Effects if necessary.

What's more... I can put Vizzywig 4K up in the air on a $2,700 drone or underwater in a $100 case. I just see it as another tool for when it would cost too much to fly or dive another 4K camera, for location scouting, for breaking news coverage and for any other situations where I don't have time to download and edit after the event.

Here's another example I shot today. Shooting with an iPhone definitely requires a tripod or stabilization of some sort but again, I can put the iPhone on a 3-axis electronic gimbal for $300 instead of $3,000 and more importantly, the gimbal will fit in my glove box.

 

[michael zaletel]

is there a reason that the examples seem to be static tripod shots? Phone shooters will usually not be using a tripod and be more likely to be shooting run and gun.

Here is the same scene using a small handheld gimbal. I was using a very fast shutter speed though so no motion blur whatsoever. Keep that in mind.

Mostly because the iPhone is tiny and really needs an extremely steady hand, a tripod or a stabilizer like the Swift M3. One of the reasons we have it priced at $999.99 is because people who don't understand that would complain about the shake at 24fps with high shutter speed. However, we do have a solution coming soon whereby we will measure the gyroscope and accelerometer data for each frame captured and apply slight scale and rotation to stabilize. Also, the iPhone 6 Plus has OIS so that will be cool too.

 

[Christof Paul]

Thanks Christof,

I think most people don't realize how expensive it is to develop software. Take RED for example, how much do you think they spent on just the software side of developing their cameras and workflow tools? The challenge with a $49.99 price is that in the AppStore ecosystem, we have to give free upgrades for the life of the app. That's really hard to do for years to come as new devices are launched. Everyone says, well, just sell tens of thousands of copies at $50 instead but they don't realize how hard that is to do. There are over 1 million developers and over 2 million apps. How many of those make even $100 a day?

I realize there are inexpensive 4K cameras but those are not capturing full 4K still images at the rate of 24 individual 3MB JPG photos per second. Our 4K is future proof. You will be able to archive the still image sequences and audio files and apply H.267 compression to it 10 years from now or even resample it up to 8K with new software that works best only on high shutter speed 4K still image sequences with no motion compression or motion blur baked in.

But most importantly, none of these other devices allow you to EDIT 4K, trim and move clips, insert smooth 4K transitions, apply smooth zoom moves, add 4K titles and lower thirds and scrolling credits and background music and then export still image sequences of the entire edited session plus HD and 4K H.264 then upload it to YouTube or Vimeo in 4K. You cannot just compare Vizzywig 4K to another 4K camera, you have to compare it to the camera plus the laptop plus the NLE software. Mostly though, why wouldn't you pay $1,000 for the convenience and time savings vs. the alternatives?

-Michael

thanks for the response, i understand that this is a tough business situation and i wish you best of luck. the app sounds amazing and i am sure as iPhones get better and better so will this app. i completely agree that the single frame approach is key to great looking motion.
i guess i hope this will work out really well and you can lower the price

 

[michael zaletel]

thanks for the response, i understand that this is a tough business situation and i wish you best of luck. the app sounds amazing and i am sure as iPhones get better and better so will this app. i completely agree that the single frame approach is key to great looking motion.
i guess i hope this will work out really well and you can lower the price

Thanks again Christof. Greatly appreciated.

 

[Wayne Morellini]

Michael, these are the things I've been pointing to for years. I was going to suggest s networked work flow, film with IPhone wirelessly proxy edit and monitor on the iPad, even multiple, so that you can have a crew working together, and dumping wirelessly to raid sever for the crew.

If you are filming even a $10,000 mini production, you will still likely have crew, camera person, director/colorist/focus puller person, colorist/focus puller, and editor/colorist can work together realtime (the raid server can stream to studio) which ever crew configuration works. You do a scene, everybody else says its good and you go to next scene. Just thoughts that might be useful to somebody.

We will find out that anything above a $1000 camera is not really necessary for 2D filming (not saying that more expensive cameras won't prove better). BMD might prove to be a future Arri.

As for the mobile shakes, fumbles are good, like that one for the IPhone, but we are looking at simple aces diaries and rigs. But it also come down to how steady you handle it and deshake software, so full sensor images help. I get minor shakes in my hands, which is bad for phone footage, but given these other things it should be OK.

As you said, reporters, hook over to new shooter and talk to them. I always envisaged a video or newspaper/web reporter being able to see such a camera to interview and film when a separate camera person is not available. Such a team could set up one or two tripods for the interview, ask the person to stand in the box, and the camera man can roam with a third camera taking side footage. But the reality us that as many cameras as you want could be setup around the space to select angles, and a wide angle 4k+ frame could be used to track a full HD frame around the interviewed subject as they move, and zoom in and out. This is the sort of thing I came up with in the 90's. It is easy for people around here to arrogantly put others down, but not as easy to be as good as those others in working things out. Maybe those people should respect other people's skill and experience in working virtually 'anything' out rather than annoy them trying to be a mere shadow of them (if I know somebody has the skill and knowledge I don't, I ask and listen, and hopefully don't get bs which I don't expect).

Michael, can you record p48/50 4k at reduced quality at the same data rate, that would be useful for me in sports filming?

The price, given them your personal email and phone you might need $1000. You are brave. But $100 and third world support is good (in program help, help labels/balloons, FAQ, knowledge base, and online version, and chat, then email and if all else fails phone calls. The in camera help is just an older updatable version of the online, if users fail to resolve, then chat/email, failing that you get to a actual expert person on a call (which should hardly ever happen as you have an jn camera and online bug and suggestion reporting with radial buttons for areas of bug/suggestion and known issues list (current software if they have not upgraded and latest software). As has been suggested to BMD. All designed to keep customers happy and reduce costly interactions with them, while increasing quality (bug and suggestion reporting).

Thanks Michael.

 

[michael zaletel]

Michael, these are the things I've been pointing to for years. I was going to suggest s networked work flow, film with IPhone wirelessly proxy edit and monitor on the iPad, even multiple, so that you can have a crew working together, and dumping wirelessly to raid sever for the crew.

If you are filming even a $10,000 mini production, you will still likely have crew, camera person, director/colorist/focus puller person, colorist/focus puller, and editor/colorist can work together realtime (the raid server can stream to studio) which ever crew configuration works. You do a scene, everybody else says its good and you go to next scene. Just thoughts that might be useful to somebody.

Hi Wayne,

All good points. The technology is finally making the vision possible.

Just like Vizzywig, Vizzywig 4K is also a 4K multi-camera studio. That's right, it's the only solution in the world that allows you to simultaneously record and live switch 4K from multiple 4K cameras. Only the "active frames" and full audio track from each "player" device are transferred to the stage when recording stops or the user can choose to transfer all frames and edit switching.

Please, anyone here on RedUser tell me how else in the world, at ANY cost, you can record still frame 4K from multiple synched cameras at the same time and live switch real-time then edit, add 4K titles and upload to YouTube or Vimeo or FTP in 4K in minutes without a PC, cables or substantial compression?

Check out our Prizmia for GoPro app to see what we are already doing with filters, effects and grading. That technology will make its way to Vizzywig 4K in the future.

-Michael

 

[michael zaletel]

For $999, it doesn't record in true 4K, it records in 2K or 3K and uploads "4K Quality" videos to YouTube.
Is it True or it just me?


http://petapixel.com/2014/09/16/want-record-4k-video-using-iphone-999-app-will-let-just/

Hello Kwan,

It's my app and yes, it is the real thing. When used with the Moondog Labs Anamorphic Lens we are capturing 4,350 pixel x 2,448 pixel raw still images at the rate of 24 photos per second with synched audio from multiple synced iPhone 5S's at the same time (That's right, multi-Camera 4K) and then scaling DOWN to 3840 x 2160.

How about I fly to New York City and we spend a day shooting comparison footage?

-Michael

 

[michael zaletel]

IBC 2014 News Coverage on Vizzywig 4K. This was streamed off the tricaster so the Vizzywig 4K examples shown are interlaced and compressed for that reason.

 

[Jeffrey Loewe]

Gotta say its a pretty cool overall concept. Personally in my situation I don't have $1000 to spend on it, and can't say I would for awhile.

With that said, I do see the value in something like this, and would really be intrigued to see tests with it handheld. I could see this being useful to reporters in the future that are in the field and need to get something done immediately. Price is tough in this world. I think overall its determined by the person who needs it. If its something you need you make room for it.

Good work! I see you're listed as being from Phoenix Michael. I just moved here 3-4 months ago. Curious if you ever do demo's? Id be interested in checking it out if you have free time and are around. I work in the Scottsdale area.

 

[michael zaletel]

Gotta say its a pretty cool overall concept. Personally in my situation I don't have $1000 to spend on it, and can't say I would for awhile.

With that said, I do see the value in something like this, and would really be intrigued to see tests with it handheld. I could see this being useful to reporters in the future that are in the field and need to get something done immediately. Price is tough in this world. I think overall its determined by the person who needs it. If its something you need you make room for it.

Good work! I see you're listed as being from Phoenix Michael. I just moved here 3-4 months ago. Curious if you ever do demo's? Id be interested in checking it out if you have free time and are around. I work in the Scottsdale area.

Thanks Jeffrey,

I have a home in Phoenix but I live in Puerto Rico. Next time I am in the valley, I would be glad to give you a demo. One thing I am planning to do is put together a few loaner packages including the Moondog Lens, Swift M3, iPhone 5S and Vizzywig 4K that I can ship to people here on RedUser for them to try it out for a few days for free and ship the package to the next person in line. I keep saying it's all about the workflow, if you need to shoot a 1-minute segment made up of 9 shots in 4K, edit it and get it on YouTube in 4K quickly, there is nothing like Vizzywig 4K in the world. If that saves you an hour or two hours, it becomes a matter of your hourly rate or your opportunity cost. I am betting there a lots of people that need the two hours of their time back more than they need the $1,000 it will cost them to buy our app. Just stop and imagine for a second how much longer it would take you to shoot that same 2-minute segment on an EPIC, ingest it into a laptop, edit it, transcode it and upload it to YouTube. It's at least an extra hour, maybe three.

-Michael

 

[Jeffrey Loewe]

Thanks Jeffrey,

I have a home in Phoenix but I live in Puerto Rico. Next time I am in the valley, I would be glad to give you a demo. One thing I am planning to do is put together a few loaner packages including the Moondog Lens, Swift M3, iPhone 5S and Vizzywig 4K that I can ship to people here on RedUser for them to try it out for a few days for free and ship the package to the next person in line. I keep saying it's all about the workflow, if you need to shoot a 1-minute segment made up of 9 shots in 4K, edit it and get it on YouTube in 4K quickly, there is nothing like Vizzywig 4K in the world. If that saves you an hour or two hours, it becomes a matter of your hourly rate or your opportunity cost. I am betting there a lots of people that need the two hours of their time back more than they need the $1,000 it will cost them to buy our app. Just stop and imagine for a second how much longer it would take you to shoot that same 2-minute segment on an EPIC, ingest it into a laptop, edit it, transcode it and upload it to YouTube. It's at least an extra hour, maybe three.

-Michael

Right on man! I'll shoot you a PM.

 

[Gavin Greenwalt]

I feel like there is more business at $50 * 10,000 vs $1,000 * 500. 10,000 is a very low estimate and I feel like 500 is very high. I can't see this selling more than a couple hundred copies at $1,000. I can see thousands buying it to show off to their friends that their iphone shoots 4k unlike their friends' Android.

 

[michael zaletel]

I feel like there is more business at $50 * 10,000 vs $1,000 * 500. 10,000 is a very low estimate and I feel like 500 is very high. I can't see this selling more than a couple hundred copies at $1,000. I can see thousands buying it to show off to their friends that their iphone shoots 4k unlike their friends' Android.

Of course I respect your opinions Gavin. I have for six years now.

Maybe you are right. It's hard to say. I've experimented with a lot of price points on a lot of different apps. Time will tell. We have already sold multiple copies across six different countries. Maybe we would have sold more at a lower price, maybe we wouldn't have. I can tell you that Vizzywig 4K has been written about in 1,970 articles in just about every country and language in the world over the past 72 hours and sales of Vizzywig regular edition have doubled. Maybe that wouldn't have happened if we had priced it at $49.

I ordered the LG G3 and the Xperia Z2 today so that I can show everyone the BIG difference between what we are doing with Vizzywig 4K on iOS vs. what is being done on Android. It's mostly an issue of data rate, there is no way their 4MB/sec can compare to our 72MB/sec no matter how big or great the sensors are on those phones. I'll post some comparison frames soon. The Key here is that we are introducing an entirely new genre of shooting STILLS FOR MOTION instead of shooting motion for stills. It's actually an old genre, it's how the movie business started. Video was just a way to solve the problems of technological limitations around bandwidth, storage, network speeds and data rates.

Vizzywig 4K is future proof because we preserve every single raw still frame through the entire process and we even create raw still frames for every delta of the transitions, zooms, titles and scrolling credits. When you export 4K in Vizzywig 4K, you export a still image sequence, an audio file and an H.264 4K video at whatever data rate you choose but then you still have the raw still sequence you can import into an NLE. Imagine what you will be able to do with the still frame sequences 10 years from now. Imagine how much easier to grade, apply super slow motion, stabilize and even resample up to 8K if you have still frames instead of motion compressed video.

In a few years, Vizzywig 6K will be capturing 60 16MP photos per second on the iPhone 8 but the amazing 4K stills workflow we've invented will remain the same.

-Michael

 

[michael zaletel]

I have an LG G2 with a mod that enables it to shoot UHD @ 30fps @ 30mbps. This means 1mbit / frame. Your app captures 24MBit / frame (if I calculate correctly), so that's 24 times the data rate that I'm getting. Astounding. How long can your app keep capturing stills like that (if storage space is not the limiting factor)?[/COLOR]

We currently stop it at 2 minutes which is about 5GB but it should be able to record for 20 minutes straight on a 64GB model with 50GB free. Vizzywig 4K supports multi-camera 4K recording and live switching so you could record for 20 minutes and live switch on 16 devices in 4K. When you stop recording each device only needs to transfer the frames for which that camera was the active camera. I will run a test and let you know. The iPhone 6 with 802.11ac may enable us to write out over WiFi to an external laptop or drive in real-time. We will be testing that.

 

[Les Dittert]

I'd love to see a demo of this vs a lowly Samsung note 3 or maybe the note 4 ( with OIS ) when it comes out.
I have the Note 3, and was pretty impressed by what I saw at h264 50 megabits. My Panasonic GH4 is considerably more impressive at only 100 Mb.
Jello artifacts are a concern.

Next week I will be shooting Epic MX vs Dragon ( V 2 OLPF ) vs the GH4 , the underdog 4K 8 bit camera.
I will linearize the image data from the Red's and properly expose each to almost sensor clipping, ignoring the LUT on the Dragon that is giving it it's so called 'highlight protection' so I can compare them more fairly as far as noise and range. The GH4 is for reality checking fun
Part of the fun will be making a LUT for the MX that gives it 'highlight protection' and seeing how much the darks suffer on that sensor as a result.
All data will be posted in the R.U. forum.

 

[michael zaletel]

I'd love to see a demo of this vs a lowly Samsung note 3 or maybe the note 4 ( with OIS ) when it comes out.
I have the Note 3, and was pretty impressed by what I saw at h264 50 megabits. My Panasonic GH4 is considerably more impressive at only 100 Mb.
Jello artifacts are a concern.

Next week I will be shooting Epic MX vs Dragon ( V 2 OLPF ) vs the GH4 , the underdog 4K 8 bit camera.
I will linearize the image data from the Red's and properly expose each to almost sensor clipping, ignoring the LUT on the Dragon that is giving it it's so called 'highlight protection' so I can compare them more fairly as far as noise and range. The GH4 is for reality checking fun
Part of the fun will be making a LUT for the MX that gives it 'highlight protection' and seeing how much the darks suffer on that sensor as a result.
All data will be posted in the R.U. forum.

Hi Les,

Want me to send you a 5S with Vizzywig 4K, an LG G3 and an Xperia Z2 for 48-hours to add to your test?

-Michael

 

[Brennan Klensch]

Very very cool app, very very dedicated support, and incredibly mobile and convenient, however, as many are pointing out, there is absolutely no way I or many of the other amateur or independent filmmakers I know can or are willing to pay $1000 for the app.

Please understand I'm not just being stubborn or critical but the app marketplace is pushing it when they ask $20-$50. You are talking about 20-50x that price. I totally hear you and I can't imagine the cost of developing the app and I get the VIP support and I get the convenience but the most I would personally feel comfortable paying is $100 (this gives a total sense of "premium" in the app marketplace without seeming pretentious). I'd consider making different versions of the app with different capabilities at different price points ( i know this is much easier postulated than implemented ) but giving people options is key. Maybe if you make this app $100 (even if it means cutting down some of the features) you'll be able to propose new apps as "upgrades" for higher prices and because people are so pleased with this product, they'll be willing to consider prices like "$300," "$500," or "$1000"

Maybe

$100 gets you
4k only (no anamorphic mode)
No Wi-Fi Monitoring Support
Limited Exporting Options


$300 gets you
4k Standard & Anamorphic
More exporting options

$500 gets you
all of $300 option +
3k, 2k options
Moondog Labs Anamorphic Package

$1000 gets you
All the above +
Wifi Monitoring Support
Realtime desqueeze
Swiftcam M3


Anyway, just my thoughts. Great great job on the app