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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Underwater Bubble Blowin' Users Group

Hi Mark. I reckon the Nikon 10.5 look could be achieved with a Tokina 10-17mm fisheye lens with a Canon mount. The Canon 10-22mm is rectilinear as far as I know, so you won't get that great curved look for mantas, whalesharks, etc. and will most likely look a lot more like the images from the Z1 and SWP44 port.
 
what about us non bubble blowin folks?



one at 1500 feet two at 300 feet

wanna see some at 7k feet?
 
Hey Mark. We are heading back to Johannesburg next week Wednesday. We have been pretty busy with company identity development, webpage, etc. Staring to have diving withdrawal symptoms already:waaa: Let us know when you are anticipating getting to SA so we can hook up for a frosty. We are thinking about heading to Umkomaas for some rebreather training and some tiger fun.
 
Canon 10 compared to 10.5 nikon fisheye

Canon 10 compared to 10.5 nikon fisheye

CamDiver said:
New Avatar shot with Nikon 10.5mm Fisheye. Should we expect the same kinda potential from the Canon? Photographed by Mike Veitch.Cheers,
Mark.
Click to expand...

You should get slightly wider (5%) but rectilinear. It is really a pretty phenomenal lens.

The 10-22 has been out for a couple years so there should be shots out there from underwater people shooting the 10-22 on Canon Rebel XT/EOS20D that would be almost exactly the same view as RED. (RED would be slightly higher res).

Here's a link to a guy that shoots a 20D with 10-22mm and the 60mm macro (this is their ef-s version - I would recommend the EF100 macro for RED.)

http://homepage.mac.com/maui_underwater/go/Bonaire2007/index.html
 
Russ Campbell said:
Hey Mark. We are heading back to Johannesburg next week Wednesday. We have been pretty busy with company identity development, webpage, etc. Staring to have diving withdrawal symptoms already:waaa: Let us know when you are anticipating getting to SA so we can hook up for a frosty. We are thinking about heading to Umkomaas for some rebreather training and some tiger fun.
Click to expand...
Russ, I hear ya on the 'cold turkey' side. I haven't dived here for over a week and I'm feeling it. I guess thats something I need to get used to now though. On my return to the UK I also need to look into taking the HSE Part 4 Commercial Diving cert. Basically to be freelance from the UK working in this field I have to have a recognized commercially valid underwater license, PADI just don't cut it I guess. So before going to SA, after the symposium in D.C, I'll need to do that. Its about a ten day course, another string to the bow. Then there's the Visa application process so its anyone's guess how long that takes.

Currently in discussions with the people in SA on who's work the project will be based. Optimistically I would reckon maybe sometime mid-November for an arrival date in SA. Fingers crossed.

Mike, thanks for the link. I will be going Canon for all glass. Thanks for all your input.

Best,
Mark.
 
Mike, after chatting to Sharky, we are really looking forward to hearing and seeing more about your RED housing. We will also be investing in Canon glass for the RED. Please can you keep us posted on developments. We should be getting our RED in Feb and definitely want a housing at the same time.

Mark, good luck with the commercial diving cert. You will also need to do a diving first aid course - PADI EFR doesn't cut the mustard apparently, but you do learn all about recompression, intubation, etc. See you hopefully in November.
 
Russ - there is now in the UK a media diver sanctioned by the HSE commercial course. I've got a buddy signed up to do that together on my return. He's doing more and more with the BEEB in the UK so needs that. Gotta look into it for clarification but it can be run by independent commercial instructors, one of which lives on the south coast where I'll be staying. It also includes a separate medical certification. I was a 'Brick' medic in my early days with the Brit infantry and also with the French mob so medical stuff is pretty much a doddle. Never had any faith, still don't, in anything PADI teaches, after all we all know what the acronym stands for so enough said.

Gradually tying down everything with the people in SA and DC so it looks good at the moment.

Cheers,
Mark.
 
Hey Johnny,

I spoke to Mike Hastings. He said no problem building the underwater housing for the 42" plasma monitor for your underwater RED system. The batteries are a little big though :-)
 
sharkguy said:
Hey Johnny,

I spoke to Mike Hastings. He said no problem building the underwater housing for the 42" plasma monitor for your underwater RED system. The batteries are a little big though :-)
Click to expand...
How about surface supply.....:w00t:
 
Gates Announces DEEP RED

Gates Announces DEEP RED

Disclosure: I work for Gates Underwater Products

Greetings to all,

This group has been following the development of Red One quite closely with great anticipation of underwater 4K. So you all deserve to hear the news first about DEEP RED, the underwater housing from Gates. You can read official press release here

http://www.gateshousings.com/PR.html

Some things that are not in the press release:

Price: TBD. We will release pricing closer to launch.

Availability: Sometime in 2008. We’ve gone as far as possible without actually having a camera, and this is key to continued development. Physical layout, optics tests, prototyping – all this is yet to come with camera in hand.

Collaboration. Yes, Howard Hall is collaborating on the design. Both Gates and Howard Hall Productions have purchased Red cameras, so we’re not just building housings – we’re ‘up to our eyeballs’ (to quote Howard). As noted in the press release, the design will be ‘no compromises’ which means that, amongst other considerations, DEEP RED will be designed to Howards’ stringent requirements.

What the release does not say is that Bob Cranston will be helping on the back end as well. His expertise in electro-mechanical systems is extensive, and will be quite handy in this area.

Optics. It’s worth expounding on the optics part of the press release. As we frequently say ‘The best camera in the world can’t make up for poor optics’. Well, here at Gates we’ve invested a great deal of time and energy into underwater optics so your images are free of distortion, vignetting, reflections – anything that could be an ‘image killer’.

With this experience Gates is now a leader in underwater HD for clarity and sharpness, in large part from our relationship with Fathom Imaging. As you all know HD is unforgiving to poor optics, so imagine how 4K will look if you put something inferior in front of Red One. Our expertise in this area will serve DEEP RED well as we delve into 4K underwater. “No compromises” is the goal here, too.

Heat. As you all know the Red camera generates heat in 4K mode, and not a trivial amount. Fortunately the aluminum shell of DEEP RED is inherently a great thermal transfer medium and the DEEP RED design will include measures to preclude overheating.

Your help. If you have comments or suggestions into the design of DEEP RED, feel free to make them in this forum.

On this topic I am interested in two specific items:

1) Your choice of camera lens(es) to use with Red One. Our strategy for ports will allow the use of different lenses, but the priority order of support will be based on popular demand.

2) Recording media. Having visited RDCC yesterday it’s clear that there are tradeoffs between using Red Raid and Red Flash (compact flash cards).

Red Raid is a much longer recording time (3+ hours). But the drive consumes energy (and generates heat), and increases the size of the housing shell (perhaps substantially).

Red Flash is much more compact (being affixed to the side of the camera rather than a completely separate unit). It is also more robust, able to withstand heat/shock etc. The housing shell will be smaller. But recording time (today) is very limited: 5 minutes with an 8GB card. 16GB anticipated Q2 2008. This problem goes away in due course as 32, 64 and 128 GB cards are available.

It is possible to provision for both scenarios but at added cost and complexity.

I will consider all reasonable ideas and suggestions, so ‘have at it’.

Cheers,

John
 
John,
Thank you for that great post! Excellent news that Gates is making a housing for Red. Also very exciting that Howard and Bob will be contributing to the design for Deep Red. They have so much experience and knowledge, you couldn't ask for better input.
OPTICS: I am still reading up on the lense tests and seeing what wisdom current users have to offer. So the short is that I still don't know what the best glass would be for underwater application. So I can't comment on the best port options to work on first.
CF vs RAID: Having not seeing any of the housing designs, I don't know how much extra weight the Red drive would put onto the housing. Is it an extra slice of pizza weight gain or a "Super Size Me" bulge? Personally, I would go for the slimmer housing and wait for the 32, 64 etc CF cards to increase recording time. As you point out, using the CF cards would also help with the heat and power issue.
Thanks again for the post and I look forward to reading up on the evolution of Deep Red.
All the best,
Jason
 
CamDiver said:
As of Wednesday guys, I'm gonna be 'on the road'. I'll catch up with you when I can via these pages.

Best fishes,
Mark.
Click to expand...

Mark,

Travel well mate. I look forward to your future updates on what you are up to around the planet.

Sharky
 
Welcome to the Bubble Blowers

Welcome to the Bubble Blowers

John:

It's good to see one of the other players checking in - the more the merrier. Welcome to the Underwater Bubble Blowers.

Mike

P.S. As you many of you know we made our announcement a few days ago in Sharky's "Gibby's RED takes a dive..." thread. I was going to copy the post over here since it is the obvious place for it, but I'll wait another day to avoid stepping on John's announcement.
 
RED Gates

RED Gates

GATES said:
Your help. If you have comments or suggestions into the design of DEEP RED, feel free to make them in this forum.

On this topic I am interested in two specific items:

1) Your choice of camera lens(es) to use with Red One. Our strategy for ports will allow the use of different lenses, but the priority order of support will be based on popular demand.

2) Recording media. Having visited RDCC yesterday it’s clear that there are tradeoffs between using Red Raid and Red Flash (compact flash cards).
Click to expand...

Initial comments :

1) Canon glass via Birger lens mount :
  • EF-S 10-22/3.5
  • EF 16-35/2.8 Mkii
  • EF-S 60/2.8 (macro)
  • EF 100/2.8 (macro)
  • & potentially the 10.5mm/2.8G ED DX Fisheye-Nikkor ... (but not sure yet; via Nikon Birger or adapted RED Nikkor mount)

I was wondering if the housing could be kept as small as possible (aka => modular; in line with the RED 'spirit') and the port systems specialised for the lens being utilized ? yes, the diameter of the port may be bigger than usual, but each port would then be matched & housing size could be tailored for RED body, battery & storage device only ? any comments ... (+ve or -ve !)

2) I would add RED Flash Drive to the list (lower power demand than RED Drive, bigger capacity than CF); my guess is that prices for flash drives will decrease faster than larger CF cards availability; a guess ... and happy to be corrected ;-) Either way, it would appear it's the same size as the RED Drive.

Additionally :
  • What are your plans for LCD monitoring ? Housing the RED unit ?
  • Integrated battery ? or using a RED Brick ?
  • Planning on housing electronics driving the RED (if this is possible) or driving the RED more via more traditional housing controls ?

Cheers ...
 
Cf Card Vs. Flash Vs. Hdd

Cf Card Vs. Flash Vs. Hdd

After initial testing with Gibby and Ken i thought i'd throw out there some potential answers to questions I personally had. We shot on 8GB CF cards---which is really nice. A lovely way to shoot and transport data.

Downside: need larger capacity. If memory serves me correct we had just a hair over 4mins on each card and of course only one CF card slot. ---two would be great, but since that is a moot point....I'll move on. I would DEFINATELY incorporate the HDD to my shooting specs underwater. Flash seems too expensive and a couple of HDD's as well as set of 4 16gb CF cards would do the trick in my opinion. I think CF cards have their place as do the 320gb HDD's. Shooting the camera was just awsome. We spent a load of time getting set up. But once all the pieces were in place, we were super happy wiht the results. HOWEVER.....I would much prefer longer record times that the HDD offers as well as AWAITING larger CF cards.

As Ken mentioned in an earlier thread....I kept coming up asking "another card, another card......etc.." No complaining mind you. I just would love to spend another 30-60mins at depth awaiting a another sequence to present itself and add a rebreather to the mix and now you have several hours at depth and the added time and security of nailing your shot on the HDD.

....for what that's worth.
by the way thanks to the team Gibby, Corben and the Kinningers for their boat!:weight_lift:
 
RE: Modular size for underwater housing.

RE: Modular size for underwater housing.

h2opixels said:
I was wondering if the housing could be kept as small as possible (aka => modular; in line with the RED 'spirit') and the port systems specialised for the lens being utilized ? yes, the diameter of the port may be bigger than usual, but each port would then be matched & housing size could be tailored for RED body, battery & storage device only ? any comments ... (+ve or -ve !)
Click to expand...

David: I know this was a reply to GATES' post, but I'm assuming it is also addressed to the design community at large.

I was speaking to Ken Corben today and he asked about the possibility of having the housing long enough to support the longest configurations we might need now with REDDRIVE and REDBRICK capability as the current version does, but then being to able shorten the housing later as CF becomes more feasible. I see no problem with this, estimated cost would be between $500-$1000 conversion fee.

Regarding ports, we have already done this. We are using an off-the-shelf Aquatica port system with an internal diameter just under six inches which allows Ken to use the Canon EF-S 10-22mm, as well as the Arri/Zeiss Ultraprime 8R - which is probably the ultimate underwater lens. This system has 6" and 8" dome ports, flat and macro options, extension rings, etc. - AVAILABLE TODAY - which would let you use pretty much any lens out there - cine or still type. Further, since the frontplate is removable we can pretty easily accommodate other lenses that might exceed that diameter.

The interchangeable frontplate would also allow use of a fully corrected underwater optic such as the one Amphibico used on their F900 housing. (Does anyone know if that is a FATHOM design or one of their own?) That type of optic generally needs to be closely matched to a specific lens so we need to see what shakes out in terms of lens options. With that said, it should also be noted that domes are still the mainstay for professional housings for film and video from Pace, Hydroflex, AquaVideo, etc. - because in fact they work very well.
 
GATES said:
2) Recording media. Having visited RDCC yesterday it’s clear that there are tradeoffs between using Red Raid and Red Flash (compact flash cards).

Red Raid is a much longer recording time (3+ hours). But the drive consumes energy (and generates heat), and increases the size of the housing shell (perhaps substantially).

Red Flash is much more compact (being affixed to the side of the camera rather than a completely separate unit). It is also more robust, able to withstand heat/shock etc. The housing shell will be smaller. But recording time (today) is very limited: 5 minutes with an 8GB card. 16GB anticipated Q2 2008. This problem goes away in due course as 32, 64 and 128 GB cards are available.
Click to expand...

I am certainly not the best person to ask, since I've only done two shoots in open water. But I think it's got to be the red drive or red ram for at least a few years. The capacity of CF is just not there yet. When bigger CF cards come out, bigger drives will also be out. The same RED drive might allow one to forget about changing media, almost for an entire day of diving. Could be a very good thing.

My 2 cents.

Ian
 
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