Two MacPro for DIT system

[Kevin Roy]

Hi All,

I'm in the process of building a DIT system/cart for our film program here and I've been doing research for the past month to get a sense of the direction that we should go. I like to buy equipment that will allow for several years of performance. We have a nice Red One package that continues to serve us well.

My question is regarding Mac and Thunderbolt. It seems to me that two MacPros, rather than one, would be a better option (and perhaps cheaper than a 12-core) simply because such a system would be less throttled by Thunderbolt. Correct me if I'm wrong, 20Gbps X 2 per MacPro, correct? It seems that with everything connected to just two TB ports, data rates would be eaten up in a heartbeat.

My current thought is, if we have two MacPros that can be networked together at 10Gb/s through TB, wouldn't it be better to have one computer to handle ingest/backups and another to handle color correction, transcodes and monitoring? Perhaps in that configuration, the networked MacPros presents a bottleneck that defeats the whole purpose.

Thanks. Trying to piece all the parts together for the most efficient long lasting system.

Kevin

 

[Shiblon Wixom]

You might be better off with a Mac pro trashcan or iMac 5k and wait for the next gen Macbook Pro Retina. Being familiar with both a modular tower system and more portable laptop DIT solution might be a better experience.

 

[Evangelos Achillopoulos]

Hello Kevin,

Backing up and/or ingest (you mean offloading files?) isn't that demanding and it is only limited to the card reader/SSDmag speed you have, given that you have a fast disk array. Especially backup is shoot and forget process with software like YoYotta id... The main bottleneck is your disk array speed that has to have lots of disks (at least 8 disks) to get the same high performance all the way passing the 50% capacity with RAID-6 protection. Color correction isn't that much of a work load for a Mac either... Only transcoding needs muscle. From what I have measure with this set up http://bit.ly/1Dw0rqV with the latest MacBook Pro fully loaded with nvidia and the fastest i7 it can do everything with no issue...

The only thing you might get better with a MacPro it might be the transcoding. But the difference will not be substantial unless you use an accelerator like RedRocket-x

So I don't thing that 22fps speed to transcode a ProRes (26fps with H264) at 1/4 resolution I get with YoYotta id, during backing up at 350MB/sec RED mag all that while I CC in Scratch Lab in the foreground... would be much of a trouble...

You also have to consider power when you use MacPros out in the field, you have to carry a UPS to handle everything, disk arrays, two systems etc... So it adds up quite fast...

Bottom line I think that the fastest MacBook Pro is the best balance between speed and portability especially if combined with a ThunderPack that makes the whole setup a very fast system.

Disclaimer, I'm manufacturing ThunderPack so I might be biased.

 

[Chris Hagan]

I manage ingest and color on a Retina Macbook Pro and connect a headless Mac Pro to it via Thunderbolt. I use screen sharing to queue up transcodes on the MacPro. I find this setup to work really well. If you choose to run the MacPro headless you'll want to pick up an HDMI dongle that tricks the mac into thinking a display is connected. I have found not having the dongle will cause some odd behavior with the MacPro that I believe is GPU related... the difference between having a "virtual" desktop that is generated by software or a real desktop you're peering on powered by the GPUs. Like Evangelos said, you'll need a fast RAID with a lot of disks to compensate for simultaneous access of two machines.

 

[Evangelos Achillopoulos]

Yes Chris, that is a good combination. And to add something, you can connect MacBook Pro to the hard disk array via Thunderbolt and then connect the MacPro with the second Thunderbolt (Lan via TB ports) in order to have maximum access speed... With a ThunderPack that works and its super fast.. I get >600MBps all the way to 100% capacity...

Check this http://www.macworld.com/article/2142073/connecting-two-macs-using-thunderbolt.html

 

[Jason Osterday]

If it's for an academic program I suggest a single Mac Pro 2014 (trashcan) with at least an 8 core or 12 and a nice GUI monitor that's manageable in size on the cart. Concentrate on general workflow, signal path (for monitoring and color) and the process of creating dailies. Multiple macs, networking, screen management...all those things start to bog down the process for students who are ultimately only shooting one camera anyway and don't have strict production deadlines involving uploading dailies to LA, or VFX pulls for teams in another country and so forth - in my opinion let them build upon the foundation of DIT work and data management.
Thats my .02

 

[Kevin Roy]

Thanks all, for the insight. Very helpful. The laptop idea is a good one, it seems, rather than two trashcans...for portability. So, to elaborate on the setups that Chris and Evangelos were talking about...let's say we go with a MBP and a MP. Since transcoding needs most of the muscle, as mentioned, and thus a direct connection to the RAID seems important, so I would connect the MacPro, via Thunderbolt, directly to the RAID. The MBP would be connected (via networked Thunderbolt) to the MacPro. The MacPro would be controlled through screensharing to cue up transcodes. So, we'd use the MBP for ingest/backup and also color correction. But with regard to the transcoding, is it possible to set up Resolve on the MBP and configure it to transcode using the MP in this configuration? Or is there a better application. It seems processing muscle needs to be closer to the RAID, so to speak, to gain maximum speeds.

(And I do see that this may be overcomplicating things for students. Keeping that in mind.)

 

[Evangelos Achillopoulos]

I would say, what as a user you do is in higher priority coz it needs interaction. So MBP first and then MP... All the rest will work. If I was you I would first try the MBP and then if its not enough I would add the MP... The disk array speed is the crucial part of the equation.

My two cents...

 

[Kevin Roy]

Thanks Evangelos, Looking forward to checking out your rig in Vegas...