The Internal Focus Motor Thread

[Elizabeth Lowrey]

This whole area is a HUGE part of the reason I bought an Epic and why I waited when my original RED One reservation came up. At that time, the only way to achieve this integration of technology was with the Birger mount, and once the issues between Birger and RED were added to the delays in production, it made waiting for the Epic with advertised NATIVE capability to control EF focus a no brainer. I'm so happy to see this finally happening and look forward to the competition between RED and 3rd parties for wireless FF solutions. Good times.

 

[Joachim Hoge]

something like this Joachim?

Exactly. I haven´t followed your product or a while (last time I checked your web page there was not much info), but the version I saw was certainly bigger than this.
This looks great for my needs. Do you sell these now with the mount or is this something else?

 

[Zhibo Lai]

I'll be watching this very carefully as a remote iOS FF app is high on my list for development. I have another solution of using the iPhone that, hopefully, can provide lag-free, and accurate results without any additional hardware, but that is until Red updates the SDK to allow for smoother than 1cm movement. For now, it'll be a good time to be in beta development mode.

 

[Jacek Zakowicz]

Exactly. I haven´t followed your product or a while (last time I checked your web page there was not much info), but the version I saw was certainly bigger than this.
This looks great for my needs. Do you sell these now with the mount or is this something else?

Yes this is the new OptiTron2.
Basically the biggest part is the focus knob- that was the objective. We launched it at the NAB this year and, just so happened, RED opened their protocols to 3rd parties. We are trying to take advantage of that and integrate OptiTron2 with RED through the SDK.
Looks promising so far...

 

[Loic Parent]

I'll also be watching this very carefully, been waiting on affordable birger+impero replacement since the Epic landed. next step is access to the full USM motor resolution !

 

[Patrick Tresch]

+1

to show interest (if needed).

Pat

 

[Kyle Gentz]

+1,

Cant wait!

 

[Robert Ruffo New]

Birger owns many patents in this area, which the Optitron licenses. It works very, very well (as do all Birger Mounts, and Erik at Birger is a great guy).

 

[Robert Ruffo New]

Little technical note regarding FOCUS and the RCP protocol opened to 3rd party (which is different than what the THC controller uses).

At the moment we do not access the lens micro steps directly but can only ask the camera to ask the lens to go to a specific focus distance.

One of the main problems I ran into when developing lens control in my OS X app foolcontrol is that the minimal step is 1 cm. So for 'macro' or close focus operation there is no way to smooth anything between say 33 and 35 cm.

So of course you will be able to control focus using motorized lens and get pretty accurate focus, but for now this will NOT replace a good cine lens with 300+ degree rotation and a good AC (using a manual or motor FF system) and I will for a few more years (or maybe months if things change quickly) still consider it as a toy... a nice and useful toy but still a toy.

Once my OS X app is finished, my plan is to port parts of it to iOS and use some cheap bluetooth controller to control focus/iris.
But "bluetooth"->"iOS"->"wifi"->"REDLINK bridge"->"camera brain"->"lens" again might not be as fast and as accurate as a "good eye" -> "hand" -> focus barrel (or a no lag external motor system)

Erick at Birger solved this, and has a patent on the solution. It involved very advanced math. It has virtually no lag.

 

[Jacek Zakowicz]

Not much longer

 

[Robert Ruffo New]

Deleted.

 

[Elizabeth Lowrey]

Not much longer

This is great news, Jacek! Can you elaborate on the time frame? You said somewhere, can't recall if it was here or another thread, that you'd be showing at Cinegear, I believe, in early June. Do you anticipate having an Epic control version of these available for sale before then?

If I can be so bold for a moment, let me beg you: please, PLEASE put some time into getting your website updated with product info and ordering capability. That's been a legitimate knock, I think, by folks interested in the original Optitron, and I know it dissuaded me, along with difficulties in getting in contact with you. I'm sure it must be very hard for small companies to devote time in all the places needed, but this aspect is crucial.

I really like the streamlined look of what you posted earlier in the thread, and if it works as well as the THC did at NAB and is priced right, you'll sell a TON of them (one of them to me, for sure.)

Question: will the REDLink hardware be required for your product, or will you be using your own solution to wire into the Gig E port on the back of the camera? What are the power options for the Optitron 2? Can it use both a small, common battery (e.g., Canon DSLR batteries) and also take a wired input from a lemo or battery plate? What voltage and current draw? I've never used wireless anything yet on my Epic rig, and am trying to figure out power accessories and requirements when I get my new Letus Helix this month.

 

[Philip Lanyon]

+1 on everything Elizabeth said!

This is great news, Jacek! Can you elaborate on the time frame? You said somewhere, can't recall if it was here or another thread, that you'd be showing at Cinegear, I believe, in early June. Do you anticipate having an Epic control version of these available for sale before then?

If I can be so bold for a moment, let me beg you: please, PLEASE put some time into getting your website updated with product info and ordering capability. That's been a legitimate knock, I think, by folks interested in the original Optitron, and I know it dissuaded me, along with difficulties in getting in contact with you. I'm sure it must be very hard for small companies to devote time in all the places needed, but this aspect is crucial.

I really like the streamlined look of what you posted earlier in the thread, and if it works as well as the THC did at NAB and is priced right, you'll sell a TON of them (one of them to me, for sure.)

Question: will the REDLink hardware be required for your product, or will you be using your own solution to wire into the Gig E port on the back of the camera? What are the power options for the Optitron 2? Can it use both a small, common battery (e.g., Canon DSLR batteries) and also take a wired input from a lemo or battery plate? What voltage and current draw? I've never used wireless anything yet on my Epic rig, and am trying to figure out power accessories and requirements when I get my new Letus Helix this month.

 

[Jacek Zakowicz]

+1 on everything Elizabeth said!

Thank you for the kind words and suggestions- duly noted. I'll have a better idea about the time frame when we are done testing next week.
The OptiTron uses very little power(1-2 watts) and accepts wide voltage range so powering it will not be a problem. We will have couple of options and I'm sure there will be plenty of suggestions based on different setups. No redlink for us thus far. We have a tiny receiver for wireless operation and we are planning to use it. This way the back of the camera can stay open for different modules.

 

[Elizabeth Lowrey]

Thank you for the kind words and suggestions- duly noted. I'll have a better idea about the time frame when we are done testing next week.
The OptiTron uses very little power(1-2 watts) and accepts wide voltage range so powering it will not be a problem. We will have couple of options and I'm sure there will be plenty of suggestions based on different setups. No redlink for us thus far. We have a tiny receiver for wireless operation and we are planning to use it. This way the back of the camera can stay open for different modules.

Thanks for the reply, Jacek, and that sounds like good news on the power, even better that REDlink won't be required.

BUT . . . when you say you have a wireless receiver, I'm not fully following. How are you communicating with the camera if not through either the REDLink module or the Gig E port? Just to be 100% clear, I'm assuming that what you're planning for the new Optitron is unlike the first in that you are not using the Birger mount but the native RED Canon mount. Is that correct? If so, how are you talking to the lens and/or camera if not through REDLink or Gig E?

Also I forgot to ask. How many controllers does the Optitron 2 have? Is there a lever or other controller for iris also? Anything for zoom control for lenses that might be equipped with compatible external motors?

 

[Alvise Tedesco]

+1 on everything Elizabeth said!

+2 on everything Elizabeth said

 

[Philip Lanyon]

You could technically build a reciever that hooked up to the gig-e port. We could retain the Red EF mount and lose the red link.
Might still be hampered by the lens motor resolution though.

Jacek Is is your receiver RF or Wifi?

 

[Jacek Zakowicz]

Thanks for the reply, Jacek, and that sounds like good news on the power, even better that REDlink won't be required.

BUT . . . when you say you have a wireless receiver, I'm not fully following. How are you communicating with the camera if not through either the REDLink module or the Gig E port? Just to be 100% clear, I'm assuming that what you're planning for the new Optitron is unlike the first in that you are not using the Birger mount but the native RED Canon mount. Is that correct? If so, how are you talking to the lens and/or camera if not through REDLink or Gig E?


Also I forgot to ask. How many controllers does the Optitron 2 have? Is there a lever or other controller for iris also? Anything for zoom control for lenses that might be equipped with compatible external motors?

The receiver or the OptiTron plug into the back of the camera- we don't use Redlink at all.
Yes on the Red Canon/Nikon mount.
OptiTron is a 2 axis controller- traditional knob for focus and slider for iris.
Zoom needs to be on a separate device since it usually is placed in a different location. Also electronic lenses do not have zoom motors so it's a separate system we are developing...

 

[Philip Lanyon]

All great news!

Does plugging in to the back of the camera allow for full motor resolution? or is it still limited to the 1cm step until Red opens up that functionality?

Would it ever be possible to use the iris slider to control the motion mount ND amount?

Just watched the NAB 2014 video again https://vimeo.com/92764586

This is super exciting, if you could bring all the functionality you brought to the sony to the Epic/Scarlet I'm sure you would sell a ton of them.

Thanks for listening to our feedback Jacek, I'm really liking this controller!

The receiver or the OptiTron plug into the back of the camera- we don't use Redlink at all.
Yes on the Red Canon/Nikon mount.
OptiTron is a 2 axis controller- traditional knob for focus and slider for iris.
Zoom needs to be on a separate device since it usually is placed in a different location. Also electronic lenses do not have zoom motors so it's a separate system we are developing...

 

[Jacek Zakowicz]

All great news Jacek!

Does plugging in to the back of the camera allow for full motor resolution Also Rf or wifi or bluetooth? or is it still limited to the 1cm step until Red opens up that functionality?

Would it ever be possible to use the iris slider to control the motion mount ND amount?

We bypass the 1cm steps and access full resolution on lenses. We would not do it otherwise. The Rx just relays the OptiTron commands - it's transparent to the camera.