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Tesla Motors...thoughts?

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Darren Orange

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This seems way off topic. So I posted it here. I know there are few people like Elon Musk or people that can even be compared. I've seen a lot of hating on his work lately mostly with Tesla. People seem to be forgetting how easy it is to completely fail.

In case of Elon he is making major strides with Tesla(SpaceX is already there locked and loaded).

I'd love to hear peoples thoughts and feedback because I feel like the people here have a better perspective on doing hard things and investing into an idea that is nothing more than that. Look at what RED has done. I would argue obviously the scope of effect of what Elon is doing is massive when compared to RED but at the end of the day the goals philosophically seem to line up.

It would be awesome to see what Jim and Jarred even think, but I don't want to put any pressure on them to post here.

Free power, all electric 100% green? Is this our future?
 
I'm all for alternatives and a more diverse market in the auto industry. I also think we need more people like Musk running around and being crazy.

... but Tesla has lost $864 million since it's founding. That's not good.
 
tesla announced the charging stations yesterday....i believe there are 6 in CA right now and plans for many, many more.....all solar powered....all tesla S get to charge for free.....forever....a car company "throwing in" the gas for free with the car.....and of course the tesla S starts at 50k? and is an amazing car, beautiful, fast, tons of room.....and uses 0 emissions (as long as it is solar powered, which is no problem in LA and most parts of CA, or the southwest, or south....so pretty much most of the USA....)
elon musk is up there with steve jobs for me....real innovators and i really think that it is getting harder and harder to do this because the system does not want these people to succeed......
on a much smaller (less world saving) level, RED has a similar approach.....doing things that most say can't be done.....
 
A loss of nearly $1 billion gives us all some idea of how hard (and expensive) it is to follow through on BIG ideas. Thankfully, there are those who have that kind of money and, even more surprisingly, are willing to risk it. Sometimes, for some people, it really isn't about the money. Teslas are way cool cars and, one way or another, I think they'll succeed; probably by patterning with (or being acquired by) one of those deep-pocketed but too-conservative-to-risk-that-much auto companies. More power to them. These are the guys that make the future.
 
The technology industry moves *FAST*. Remember how fast digital took over film? The challenge is always that the first movers often aren't the winners--so Tesla may very well fail. But their failure would at the very least pave the way for future success by someone. Tesla is essentially a gamble that they can position themselves to be ready to move on a radical shift in battery prices. In the mean time I hope they capitalize on their perception as a premium-tech savvy company and invest heavily in features that nobody else has like being first to market with a self driving car.
 
I hope they succeed. There is something great, however you measure, about being daring enough to rock the world and shake the status quo. Gavin is right in that the trailblazers aren't always the ones to reap the benefits. The drafters have an easier go sometimes.
 
Sadly unless you have your own solar /wind power it isn't 100% green because it is using energy from the grid.
I am surprised that the marketing ignores this fact.

I am about to put down a deposit for the X even though I'll get limited use of it here in oz.

Availability of power on typical long trips or simply a busy day driving, is an issue.
A survey of new apartments under construction in Australia came up with NONE of them providing power sockets in the parking garage.
A trip to visit my folks in their aged care home, would occasionally require negotiation with the facility for use of power!
And parking on a suburban street.. how to get power cable across a sidewalk?

If Tesla made a version with a small diesel engine driving front wheels they would sell more.

The Citroen DS hybrid is my favourite car at them moment, cheap, stunning looks and true 4 wheel drive, 2 x gas and 2x electric at rear. But only about 110 litres of boot space due to battery.
I'd be investing in the companies making the motors as they are idea for 4x4s, plenty of torque and no mechanical lockup diffs to maintain.

Im not sure an electric car with comparably few bells and whistles is enough to lure a gadget savvy driver away from the all the latest driver aides, such as lane drift warning, adaptive cruise, blind spot monitoring, auto wipers, steering headlights ect.

The citroen DS has all the gadgets and enormous range due to the combustion engine, it just seriously lacks boot space and considering its meant to be a family car it is dead in the water.

Green Technology isn't developing that quickly whilst internal combustion engines are continuing to be tweaked, the new norm is 5-7 litres per 100km.
The 2013 Range Rover has gone over to aluminium body and chassis, they have paired 350kgs from the weight of the 2012 steel model! Land rover are promising 7.5lts per 100km (31mpg) and it is also a second faster to 60mph!

Tesla say they simply want to make the best car, period, problem is the bar is being raised higher and along with it expectations of drivers.




Mike Brennan
 
If I had the money I would buy the 4.3 million shares they are offering. I can't see them failing with such great products. Red and Tesla are my two favorite companies. Tesla's products are so great because Elon Musk designs them specifically for himself, just like Jim does. Red and Tesla would not exist if Jim and Elon didn't want the best electric cameras and cars capable of being made.

I wouldn't worry too much about missing features. People say that once you drive a Model S you have to buy one. It's just that good. It's sort of like seeing good 4k footage projected. Once people start giving their friends test drives I suspect pre-orders will double and then double again.

Just for clarity's sake, the only Tesla Model S that can use the chargers for free is the $70,000+ one. The $60,000 one is capable of using them for a fee and the $50,000 one is incapable of using the high speed chargers.

Free solar charging for Tesla customers makes me even more excited for the inevitable free 4K video hosting for Red customers.
 
Alex Kiritz said:
Red and Tesla are my two favorite companies.
Click to expand...

Same here. I love the design of the Model X with the dual-motor and falcon wing doors.

I'm really hoping I don't have to sell one of my Epics to be able to afford it. I guess it is a good thing Model X #971 won't be ready until 2014.

Also, I have never owned a car before. Tesla will be my first. Just like my first camera was the Red One!
 
Yes Tesla has lost nearly a billion dollars. But they're pioneers, much like RED. I think its also important to note that they're not just building car(s) but new technologies and infrastructure as well.

It has never made sense, or been in the best financial interest, for major automotive companies to produce a viable alternative for fossil fuels. Tesla had the guts to essentially go and re-invent the wheel. The company was founded by and comes from the dot com start up mind set of silicon valley. And a immediate profit or return on investment is certainly not their biggest concern. They built the roadster not with the intended purpose to make it for the general population, but rather to buck the idea that electric was slow, boring, or would look like a 'smart car'. Being from the silicon valley and I was lucky enough to actually see speak with some important people at Tesla in the early days of the company.

Yes electric doesn't necessarily make sense for everyone in every circumstance, but it's about changing the way we live. To be smarter and more sustainable. There are many misconceptions about being green. You don't necessarily need direct sunlight to gather energy for solar power, and there's also wind and water energy to be harnessed. Yes tapping into the grid isn't a completely green solution, but its also about cutting down on emission and eventually modifying existing grids to be powered by greener sources.

One way or another, I'm tired of ugly cars. And say what you will but at the least Tesla's designers certainly have a handle on things.
 
Justen Nguyen said:
Yes Tesla has lost nearly a billion dollars. But they're pioneers, much like RED. I think its also important to note that they're not just building car(s) but new technologies and infrastructure as well.
Click to expand...

When I was considering buying stock I was like "I'm probably going to lose money on this thing." But then I thought about how much of a shift Tesla can make in people's perceptions of the viability of electric cars and knew that I had to support bold innovative ideas like that or we would never make progress. There's actually a really interesting economic theory out there that success emerges out of failure. When a really bold company goes belly up all of their assets and patents get sold for pennies on the dollar--and whoever can scoop up that treasure trove gets all of the assets, research and technology for a fraction of the price. Part of the drop in solar panels is attributed to this. The price drop is in part thanks to all of these companies going bankrupt and their assembly lines being purchased (free of debt) for a fraction of the original price. Suddenly the new company can sell the same product for a lot less.

One way or another either they or their zombie corpse I think is going to set the stage for electric cars.
 
Earlier design of their Model S were amazing and I put a deposit down immediately after it was revealed but the production model came out looking like a sad & stretched Jaguar XK and refrain from buying it. Fisker Karma is what I would buy if I didn't have a camera gear addiction :-) It is fast, sleek and can add gas if I want to go for a longer trip. One problem... it cost over $100K which I can use to buy some lenses :-)

Audi is cooking up some serious electric with intelligent MMI that adapts to your driving and I can't wait for an S5/RS5 Electric with same performance and precise Gzerman Engineering!
 
Consider a Chevy Volt. It's not the bleeding edge that Tesla is - I'm totally a fan of their cars in concept- but I simply can't afford one. GM, however, has sunk a fortune into the design and manufacture of the Volt, and it's not selling at the pace they expected. If you live in the U.S., there's a $7500 federal tax credit, plus GM is now giving HUGE discounts- like 10 grand- to get them moving. If you have good credit and your dealer works with the right banks (I don't know if Ally is doing it or not, but US Bank is) you can lease one for under $300/month, no money down.

I've been driving a Volt since August 1, and have yet to buy gas. My home meter gets switch over to time-of-day billing as of this weekend, so I'll be paying pennies for my transpo most days, plus, our Solar PV system at the office is was literally just switched on about an hour ago!

Volt is NOT the car of the future - it's car for RIGHT NOW- an amazing bridge between the old and the new. The tech is amazing- it has 3 engines - The styling is a bit... uh... faux Jetson via Detroit. Even on gas it's 37 miles per gallon. I'm a car junkie, but not a car collector, so I've had something like 15-20 different cars in my life. My favorites were the 911- it can't really be called a car- but gets... what... 12 miles to the gallon on a good day? Then, the Honda S2000... then, this Volt. I really love this car. No, it's not a Tesla. But it's $300-400/month. Seriously. Go get one right now. Tesla is a dream for most of us, and I'm all in favor of you early adopters, but the Volt is a real car, right now.

It comes with a 110v charger that gives you 35-40 miles on an 8 hour charge, or, in some US cities, the department of energy will give you a 220v charger (4 hours to charge a Volt.) and you get special rates from most utility companies. The Volt doesn't necessarily require changes to your house wiring- but the Tesla definitely does as it draws SERIOUS juice. (

In the EU, I bet this car is an even better value - since your normal power level is already 220v.

If you're in Los Angeles area, this weekend is also 'Alt Car Expo' (in addition to 'carmageddon 2,' the closing of the busiest freeway in the world for 54 hours) in Santa Monica - you can try all the EVs and Hybrids, including the whacky ones. Don't know if Tesla is participating, but it's the first place I saw the Fiskar.

Just my opinion. I hope Tesla has a long, rich future. But I hope VW (audi) GM, Ford, and Fiat all make a killing in electric, too.

www.altcarexpo.com
 
I'll give you folks a bet for the 'faster than anyone expects' technology: Google Drive. Self-driving cars.

That's going to hit the streets faster than anyone expects, and go from loony fringe to largely universal FAR faster than most people believe possible.

It's a problem that's been talked about and waiting for a solution for decades. It took someone with the vision and deep pockets of Google to throw money at it and say 'Make it so!'

Speaking of 'Make it so!', if you want a *real* blue-sky transportation development, consider the Alcubierre-White warp drive:

http://www.space.com/17628-warp-drive-possible-interstellar-spaceflight.html

Mike, boldly going back to work...
 
Darren Orange said:
Free power, all electric 100% green? Is this our future?
Click to expand...

Michael Brennan said:
Sadly unless you have your own solar /wind power it isn't 100% green because it is using energy from the grid.
I am surprised that the marketing ignores this fact.
Mike Brennan
Click to expand...

How is it that people think electric cars are "green"? As Mike Brennan alluded to in his post, they are obviously ignorant of the fact that ALMOST HALF of all electricity used in the United States in generated by burning coal!

And the politicians and media gleefully perpetuate the lies. Politicians bad-mouth coal/oil/natural gas extraction and use, and promote "green" ideas, which are a step back into a previous century. It's all about money, power, and controlling the uneducated masses.

America is the home of the dumbed down.
 
I know a couple of people who own or lease the Chevy Volt and really like it.
The Volt was just a bit too pricy for me on my 'educational salary', but it came very close.
Ann Arbor and UofM are both starting to put in ***free*** charging stations and exclusive places to park.
That might be just enough extra savings to make it my next new car.
I have a 50 mile a day commute, and it does get very cold in S.E. Michigan, but it does have a gas engine too.
I figured it was best to wait until some of the bugs become known and fixed.
The good news is there is new battery technology coming that has real promise of holding more juice and very fast re-charge times.
This is the future. Screw Big Oil! I am sick of their price games, oil spills and their power over our elected leadership.
 
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