Steven Soderberh’s State Of Cinema Talk

[Elsie N]

Thanks Ketch, and Elsie, I’m glad someone is reading my post, you kind of get cabin fever here in Costa Rica, not the place, but a lack of people to talk about filmmaking!...
...
Humberto Rivera

Same here about a lack of nearby people to talk movie making. And I always read your posts '-)

 

[Humberto Rivera]

There are a lot of Filmmakers on this Board, whether some small ones with their Scarlet Cameras all the way up to Guillermo Del Torro with “Pacific Rim” and his multi-rig Epic 5K M - X, all Filmmakers nonetheless.

What is a Filmmaker, I thought I was a filmmaker before I went to USC Cinema in the Mid 60 s, then I went to USC Cinema in the Late 60 s, to early 70 s while in the USMC, I made some US Marine Corps training films, on the ground, air, and sea, really, just like the song. Then I got out of the Marine Corps and decided to go to California State University, and met two wonderful women, so we started a Film Company, we also bought a used 16 mm Éclair ACL, with a zoom lenses which we kept for 15 years, a lot of Color Negative went through that camera. We also had tinny a Nagra SN synchronized to the camera. Then along came “Video”, and we jumped right in at the beginning with a PBS Series. But the question persisted, what is a Filmmaker? I knew I was Filmmaker but belief it or not I just never asked; when I entered another country there is a space that asked for your occupation (I’m on my forth (or fifth) US Passport, with VISAs from all over the world), I always put FILMMAKER, so I decided to find out after all this time what it means, I’m 71 years old or young depending on how you look at it!

Wikipedia; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filmmaking TO QUOTE; “Filmmaking (often referred to in an academic context as film production) is the process of making a film. Filmmaking involves a number of discrete stages including an initial story, idea, or commission, through scriptwriting, casting, shooting, editing, and screening the finished product before an audience that may result in a film release and exhibition. Filmmaking takes place in many places around the world in a range of economic, social, and political contexts, and using a variety of technologies and cinematic techniques. Typically, it involves a large number of people, and can take from a few months to several years to complete.” Wikipedia

IT TALKS ABOUT ALL OF IT; “Film production involves several major stages”;

“Development — The first stage in which the ideas for the film are created, rights to books/plays are bought etc., and the screenplay are written. Financing for the project has to be sought and green-lit.”

“Pre-production—Preparations are made for the shoot, in which cast and film crew are hired, locations are selected, and sets are built.”

“Production—The raw elements for the film are recorded during the film shoot.”

“Post-Production—The images sound, and visual effects of the recorded film are edited.”

“Distribution—The finished film is distributed and screened in cinemas and/or released on DVD.” Wikipedia

So what it says in Wikipedia is exactly what Heather Howell and I did in making my (our) first Civilian Production “The Murals of East Los Angeles”, it was an hour production, we did it all for a local Los Angeles Television Station for $5,000.00, including the negative cutting, all of it, with that we obtained our first bank loan. I think it was around 1976, but don’t quote me on that! From then on we moved on to all sorts of projects. I’ve been a filmmaker for quite a long time, now that I think about it. So read what Wikipedia has to say about it, it’s sort of interesting! Are you a Filmmaker?

I’ve been in Costa Rica for the last thirteen years, and not picked-up a Film or Video Camera, not even once, that may change in the near future when the Red 6K Dragon Camera is finally released, we’ll see!

Humberto Rivera

 

[Elsie N]

...
IT TALKS ABOUT ALL OF IT; “Film production involves several major stages”;

If I may, I'll give you my version of a low-budget Indie view of what movie production involves.

“Development — The first stage in which the ideas for the film are created, rights to books/plays are bought etc., and the screenplay are written. Financing for the project has to be sought and green-lit.”

In my world, ideas for thirteen (yes, 13) movies emerged in a burst of creativity some years ago. I purposely haven't fleshed out all the dialogue in any of them because as director, I will want to make ongoing changes within the outline. I do make a record of things I particularly like for the movie in question. No rights to the material need to be addressed as they are owned solely by me.

Financing... While I consider myself a good conversationalist, I am not a good salesman of my material. One reason is I get frustrated when I begin explaining the story of my first intended movie Chrysalis being about a longhorn cattle drive from what was once the Big Bend area of Texas to the coast at what was once the western edge of Death Valley. All they hear is "cattle drive" and respond "Oh! it's a western!" Then when I explain to them it takes place well into the future and the cattle are driven by dogs with their handlers riding antique Segways, and the story is about how we as humans adapt to cataclysmic events rather than showing the cataclysms on screen, they lose interest. I have decided to proceed sans financing.

“Pre-production—Preparations are made for the shoot, in which cast and film crew are hired, locations are selected, and sets are built.”

Pre-production in my case consists of self-deprivation... for the purpose of channeling any and all liquid assets into gear, props, accessories etc. for the making of a movie. Having been raised on a farm during a time of drought I learned the difference between doing a job with make-shift tools and doing the job more quickly and effectively using the proper tools. Two Epics will put me on the cusp of the acquisition part of having the proper tools needed to make a movie and will drastically reduce the number of crew needed.

Actors will be unknowns for the most part and if no funds are available for both pay and feeding, I will feed and choose actors that are willing to take a bet on the movie with me and accept deferred payment tied to the success of the movie if self-distributed or to the sale price of the distribution rights. I will attempt to treat cast and crew as I would want to be treated, within limits that only a producer/director can understand. If they all work well together and with me, I will want to keep them happy in order to work with them again.

My movies do not involve elaborate sets for the most part, and because of that will be translatable to existing natural locations.

“Production—The raw elements for the film are recorded during the film shoot.”

As director, editor, and writer I know what I want on screen. Sometimes that will allow me to shoot less... other times, I will shoot more to get what I need. My only pre-regret in this phase is I will not have the artisan's eye of someone like David Mullen to guide me in getting shots... especially some that I deem Rosetta stones for the interpretation of the movie, to wow! in the proper degree. My hope is that I can capture the images with enough information to get some of that wow! factor to show up on screen through post.

“Post-Production—The images sound, and visual effects of the recorded film are edited.”

While I can't call myself a "professional" in this part of movie-making, I'm not a total stranger to any of it. Trial and error sort of stuff but with enough time, that is, time to walk away from it and let the subconscious solve any issues, I can generally get there. Plan B is to contact some of the post people on this forum and show them parts of the movie to help them decide if they want to work out a deal to finish the movie using their established skills. Editing will remain with me.

“Distribution—The finished film is distributed and screened in cinemas and/or released on DVD.” Wikipedia

Wikipedia needs updating on the venues available to release a film. Reading that Resolve 10 has a connection to an Easy DCP plug-in to output to that format... which is potentially becoming less of a requirement but should still be considered an option. Distribution is no longer the foot on the Indie movie-maker's throat that it once was.

Are you a Filmmaker?

We'll see. '-)

I’ve been in Costa Rica for the last thirteen years, and not picked-up a Film or Video Camera, not even once, that may change in the near future when the Red 6K Dragon Camera is finally released, we’ll see!

Humberto Rivera

Humberto, surely the statute of limitations has run out on whatever has sent you to find refuge in a land with no fellow movie-makers to talk to? (My excuse is that I grew up here where I live. '-)

 

[Humberto Rivera]

Sounds Very Good Elsie, we are all different, and have different ideas of how to get to the same place, a “Theatrical Motion Picture”. We’re after the same thing, but we take different routes to “end-up” is the “same location”. I seem to recall a fellow saying; “Anything you say in the “Movie Business” is “True”, no matter how outrageous it may be”!

You have a “leg-up” on actors like “Denzel Washington” who spends some time learning how it feels to be “water-board” in South Africa for the Picture “Safe House”! He spend countless hours practicing the choreograph move of fight. I think you have knowledge of the subject matter, not only from the story in your head, but how things work in a cattle drive, that’s invaluable! Your thirteen ideas are good, narrow it down to two or three and from those pick one to develop (or mixed several), if you already haven’t chosen one. I say; “GOOD LUCK TO YOU”!

I WOULD LIKE TO QUOTE FROM WHAT I SAID IN #86 OF THIS THREAD; “I was thinking out loud, how can we make the film that we want, but at the same time find a Distributor, or do-it our self’s. I’m ASSUMING a few things; we need a realistic budget, say maybe $10,000,000.00. Remember “Everybody and Everything” in the Film Business wants to be paid up-front, or by the weeks, and don’t forget the Union Payments for which there is a software, and it will be, what it will be.

You’ll need a Script, a Budgeting Software, a Production Breakdown Software, and an artist to draw anything from a full storyboard to a few drawing. You need to know what you’re going to do (Script), how much it’s going to cost (Budget), when and how long is going to take (Production Break Down), what some or the whole film is going to look like (Storyboard) all to convince the investor that your movie is the one they should go with.” Humberto Rivera

I think that for most Film you’re going to need someone who has the same vision as you, but also has the money, they are hard to find, but they are out-there. To develop the material to the Script, Budge (put in any realistic amount), and Production Break Down, most of the tools for getting to this point are relatively inexpensive, and you’ll have a ready to shoot project. I would recommend Movie Magic Screenwriter Version 6; http://www.writersstore.com/movie-magic-screenwriter-screenwriting-software it was developed by “Steve Greenfield” back in the 80 s with Version 1, a nice guy, they also do Budgeting, and Script Breakdown, there good people. http://www.writersstore.com/movie-magic-budgeting-and-scheduling-bundle/ these tools will help you to crystallize your thoughts, find problems, and concentrated on the Film when in Production. Thirty years of water have passed under the bridge, I wonder what ever happened to him, and we use to argue about the Mac Vs. the PC at that time. David Lynch said in the video posted by Brice Ansel at #176 herein said; “Enjoy the doing!

Humberto Rivera

 

[Elsie N]

Sounds Very Good Elsie, we are all different, and have different ideas of how to get to the same place, a “Theatrical Motion Picture”. We’re after the same thing, but we take different routes to “end-up” is the “same location”. I seem to recall a fellow saying; “Anything you say in the “Movie Business” is “True”, no matter how outrageous it may be”!

You have a “leg-up” on actors like “Denzel Washington” who spends some time learning how it feels to be “water-board” in South Africa for the Picture “Safe House”! He spend countless hours practicing the choreograph move of fight. I think you have knowledge of the subject matter, not only from the story in your head, but how things work in a cattle drive, that’s invaluable! Your thirteen ideas are good, narrow it down to two or three and from those pick one to develop (or mixed several), if you already haven’t chosen one. I say; “GOOD LUCK TO YOU”!

I WOULD LIKE TO QUOTE FROM WHAT I SAID IN #86 OF THIS THREAD; “I was thinking out loud, how can we make the film that we want, but at the same time find a Distributor, or do-it our self’s. I’m ASSUMING a few things; we need a realistic budget, say maybe $10,000,000.00. Remember “Everybody and Everything” in the Film Business wants to be paid up-front, or by the weeks, and don’t forget the Union Payments for which there is a software, and it will be, what it will be.

You’ll need a Script, a Budgeting Software, a Production Breakdown Software, and an artist to draw anything from a full storyboard to a few drawing. You need to know what you’re going to do (Script), how much it’s going to cost (Budget), when and how long is going to take (Production Break Down), what some or the whole film is going to look like (Storyboard) all to convince the investor that your movie is the one they should go with.” Humberto Rivera

I think that for most Film you’re going to need someone who has the same vision as you, but also has the money, they are hard to find, but they are out-there. To develop the material to the Script, Budge (put in any realistic amount), and Production Break Down, most of the tools for getting to this point are relatively inexpensive, and you’ll have a ready to shoot project. I would recommend Movie Magic Screenwriter Version 6; http://www.writersstore.com/movie-magic-screenwriter-screenwriting-software it was developed by “Steve Greenfield” back in the 80 s with Version 1, a nice guy, they also do Budgeting, and Script Breakdown, there good people. http://www.writersstore.com/movie-magic-budgeting-and-scheduling-bundle/ these tools will help you to crystallize your thoughts, find problems, and concentrated on the Film when in Production. Thirty years of water have passed under the bridge, I wonder what ever happened to him, and we use to argue about the Mac Vs. the PC at that time. David Lynch said in the video posted by Brice Ansel at #176 herein said; “Enjoy the doing!

Humberto Rivera

Humberto, I think we have a different view of what it takes to make a film. You seem to cling to the old ways of following the "Hollywood" formula. My being new to the process frees me from that and allows me to travel a completely different path.

I'm not admonishing you for your clinging to the old formula... as you said we are all different and have different ideas of how to get to the same place. But each of our plans have some of the same hold-ups. Yours being spending time going from money-changer to money-changer trying to get funding... mine being spending time doing the things you would hire done after getting your funding, if ever.

In essence, mine is the holistic approach to making a movie. That is, with a hand in every aspect of the process my end result will be true to the vision.

The piece-by-piece way where others put their stamp on the different parts and then try to assemble them together sometimes fail in telling the story in a coherent way.

To be clear, oft-times the piece-by-piece method succeeds and irregardless, has to be done that way on a complex big project shoot because few would be able to make such a project holistically. So I'm not disparaging that.

I'm just saying that a simple story can sometimes be told better when done holistically.

 

[Christopher Mills]

one paradigm I really think should be followed

one paradigm I really think should be followed

Planning:

Having made and worked on films from no budget to gigantic budget..

it costs you so little to use screenwriting formatting software and schedule and budgeting software (less if you have a friend who can get educational pricing for you), that you have no excuse to leave these out of your toolkit.

If you don't make a map and an itinerary, you will not know where you are going.

I respect the analogy of doing tasks with improvised tools versus purpose built ones. However, when you need a pair of pliers, a hammer is pretty useless.

Also, if you have the tools to do standard formats on your scripts, schedules, and budgets (yes, do the tasks in that order), then your answers from financial sources will change, even if those sources are family and friends with personal direct financial investment.

Also, the scripts you don't produce yourself become viable format wise to be considered for purchase, and make you look like a better prospect for an agency to represent.

Best of luck, and I do like the underlying concept that you have shared with us.

 

[Humberto Rivera]

Yes Elsie, like we both said, we’re all different and we have different ways of working, but the end goal is the same the creation of a “Motion Picture Film”! I do think that if you’re going to use such things as; a crane; Master Primes (or Canon Lens); lights; the kinds of tools that make a film better, well you need to pay for them all (or maybe not). The Actors whether free or for pay have to eat, they have to be transported to their locations, they need a place to stay, it all cost money, even if is a pay-as-you-go kind of thing.

You’re going to need a Script, if not a Script an Outline, because you have to compute on which days and where you’re going to need certain Actors (Script Breakdown), what equipment, and such things. I agree any film can be done for $10,000 or $100,000 or even a $1,000,000 but you do need some money, there are just expenses that cannot be avoided, just every day things.

I seem to remember the film “Mariachi” by Robert Rodriquez some time ago; I think he did for $10,000 that was really low budget (or no-budget), with a lot of freebies thrown in. I don’t DOUBT that you thought you’re method all the way THROUGH, and I always encourage anyone to make a film in way that works best for them, just go ahead and try it, because at the end they will have a “Motion Picture Film” done, look at “David Lynch” he is shooting with a Sony Video Camera like the one many people have at home. But he is doing what he wants.

Christopher Mills makes some good points, a Map if your Itinerary, just like the Travel Agent gives you, so you’ll know when and where you’re getting someplace, what you’re going to do there, and when to come back. Again all the best you, good luck, really!

Humberto Rivera

 

[Elsie N]

Planning:

Having made and worked on films from no budget to gigantic budget..

it costs you so little to use screenwriting formatting software and schedule and budgeting software (less if you have a friend who can get educational pricing for you), that you have no excuse to leave these out of your toolkit.

If you don't make a map and an itinerary, you will not know where you are going.

I respect the analogy of doing tasks with improvised tools versus purpose built ones. However, when you need a pair of pliers, a hammer is pretty useless.

Also, if you have the tools to do standard formats on your scripts, schedules, and budgets (yes, do the tasks in that order), then your answers from financial sources will change, even if those sources are family and friends with personal direct financial investment.

Also, the scripts you don't produce yourself become viable format wise to be considered for purchase, and make you look like a better prospect for an agency to represent.

Best of luck, and I do like the underlying concept that you have shared with us.

Hello Christopher,

I actually have the screenwriting software and use it to establish scenes and some of the dialogue in each one. But I purposely only write the idea I want to convey for the character and will fill in the actual dialogue as the scenes are shot (probably close to being in order) because I expect the story to evolve as I shoot it.

And as I get in to actual pre-production, I will have an itinerary because even on a small cast shoot, there will still be logistics to take into account.

I think too, that I may have left the wrong impression vis a vis the tools analogy. The point I was trying to make was the justification of purchasing two Epics (and upgrading to Dragon sensors) in order to make the job on set and in post easier because of using the right tool for the job.

I somewhat agree that approaching a "legitimate" investor with properly documented script, schedule, and budget augers toward a more favorable response in regard to financing. In my case I've only been sending out feelers to certain people (who are not typically movie investors) and I have trouble getting past the story précis without their losing interest. Not only that, figuring out budget etc. is not my strong suit since hardly any of those costs are known. I could come just as close to being accurate by pulling a guess out of thin air.

As for providing scripts for sale, I am largely committed to doing some of my own scripts first and with thirteen previously identified (I'm actually seeing Chrysalis as a potential franchise with at least a sequel and possibly a three-quel. Since it is placed in the future, there is no end to the future storylines as long as civilization exists. '-)

But after getting my feet wet in the actual production of one or more of my scripts, I very well may flesh out some of the others because one in particular... The Imam's Daughter, is projected as a trilogy and could require a big budget to be made properly. Another, Jaime Bond, would definitely require a big budget.

Chris, although it may sound like I am discounting your advice, that is not the case since I think what you outline truly applies to both Indies and others.

But I've been called a "One-er" in my past and I really didn't know what that person meant since the term was unfamiliar to me. I've since come to understand the meaning and I guess I have to own it.

 

[Humberto Rivera]

HERE IS THE LINK TO EL MARIACHI, BY ROBERT RODRIGUEZ; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Mariachi “El Mariachi is a 1992 American action film that marked the debut of writer and director Robert Rodriguez. The Spanish language film was shot with a mainly amateur cast in the northern Mexican bordertown of Ciudad Acuña. THE US$7,000 PRODUCTION WAS ORIGINALLY INTENDED FOR THE MEXICAN HOME VIDEO MARKET, but executives at Columbia Pictures liked the film so much that they bought the American distribution rights. Columbia eventually spent several times more than the 16 mm film's original budget on 35 mm transfers, promotion, marketing and distribution.[3]

The success of Rodriguez's directorial debut led him to create two further entries, Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003), in what came to be known as the Mexico Trilogy. For the two sequels, Antonio Banderas took over from Carlos Gallardo for the main character El Mariachi, though Gallardo co-produced both films. In 2011, EL MARIACHI WAS INDUCTED INTO THE LIBRARY OF CONGRESS TO BE PRESERVED AS PART OF ITS NATIONAL FILM REGISTRY for being culturally, historically, or aesthetically significant.” Wikipedia.com

El Mariachi cost $7,000 (spent $7,225 of the $9,000 he had planned) to make according to Wikipedia, whatever it was it was a no-budget production, now at Library of Congress, and what a story. So yes, films can be made for no-money, but they are rare. Read the Production description, it’s interesting! He said; "because if you start to spend, you cannot stop anymore." How true!

TO QUOTE FROM THE AWARDS SECTION; “El Mariachi won multiple international awards, and writer/producer/director Rodriguez went on to gain international fame, being interviewed on such shows as Sábado Gigante, and going on to make more Hollywood-backed films such as The Faculty and Sin City. In December 2011, El Mariachi was deemed "culturally, historically, or aesthetically significant" by the United States Library of Congress and selected for preservation in the National Film Registry.[7] Citing it as the film that "HELPED USHER IN THE INDEPENDENT MOVIE BOOM OF THE EARLY 1990S", the Registry gave special mention to director Robert Rodriguez and his ability to merge two separate genres of films—"the narcotraficante film, a Mexican police genre, and the transnational warrior-action film, itself rooted in Hollywood Westerns"—successfully "despite the constraints of a shoestring budget." Wikipedia.com

Humberto Rivera

 

[Christopher Mills]

. The Spanish language film was shot with a mainly amateur cast in the northern Mexican bordertown of Ciudad Acuña. THE US$7,000 PRODUCTION WAS ORIGINALLY INTENDED FOR THE MEXICAN HOME VIDEO MARKET, but executives at Columbia Pictures liked the film so much that they bought the American distribution rights. Columbia eventually spent several times more than the 16 mm film's original budget on 35 mm transfers, promotion, marketing and distribution.[3]

The success of Rodriguez's directorial debut led him to create two further entries, Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003), in what came to be known as the Mexico Trilogy. For the two sequels, Antonio Banderas took over from Carlos Gallardo for the main character El Mariachi, though Gallardo co-produced both films. In 2011, EL MARIACHI WAS INDUCTED INTO THE LIBRARY OF CONGRESS TO BE PRESERVED AS PART OF ITS NATIONAL FILM REGISTRY for being culturally, historically, or aesthetically significant.” Wikipedia.com

El Mariachi cost $7,000 (spent $7,225 of the $9,000 he had planned) to make according to Wikipedia, whatever it was it was a no-budget production, now at Library of Congress, and what a story. So yes, films can be made for no-money, but they are rare. Read the Production description, it’s interesting! He said; "because if you start to spend, you cannot stop anymore." How true!


Humberto Rivera

To paraphrase Rodriguez's dad... and there was the $250,000 in money I cosigned for to do a sound finish, answer and release prints and get it to where the major distributor put up another few million to recut and remix and make their release materials....

but yes, the $7K was what he spent to get it in the can as a one man band. and he did a great job that showed him to be a viable film maker that much larger entities would work with.

Elsie, one of your assets will be your networking on Reduser, so that you can show your film to a large community that is far from shy about championing their friends.
I am not denigrating this.. it really is a good thing.

 

[Elsie N]

...

Elsie, one of your assets will be your networking on Reduser, so that you can show your film to a large community that is far from shy about championing their friends.
I am not denigrating this.. it really is a good thing.

I really do appreciate your current and past input Chris.

It's a true fact I wouldn't be at the stage I'm at now if not for the knowledge gained being on REDUSER. Taking what I've learned here and combining it with what I've deduced on my own will go a long way toward dictating whether I'm successful or not. But irregardless of outcome this place is, on the whole, an asset that those who shun all things RED are missing out on.

Some on here will find this hard to swallow but I will measure success in the mere finishing of the movie to my satisfaction. Any further acceptance will be dessert.

 

[Humberto Rivera]

Well the stories are beginning to come out in the Media; Hollywood has had a bad summer, what a surprise, it was bound to happen, Spielberg and Lucas said they were going to IMPLODE. Things don’t happen all of sudden, but rather they begin with a trend. Look at today’s NY Times; http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/22/movies/turbo-and-ripd-open-to-disappointing-results.html?hpw&_r=0 “Weekend Box Office Reflects a Season of Big-Budget Stumbles ‘Turbo’ and ‘R.I.P.D.’ Open to Disappointing Results” by Brooks Barnes

TO QUOTE A LITTLE FROM THE ARTICLE; “Studios have also tried to sell most of these as “original,” which in Hollywood-speak means not a sequel or a remake. In reality, movie companies have largely just reassembled familiar parts. “Pacific Rim,” which featured giant robots, seemed to share DNA with “Transformers.” “The Lone Ranger” was “Pirates of the Caribbean” in Old West drag. “R.I.P.D.” was “Men in Black” lite. Moviegoers are pushing back. THE NO. 1 MOVIE IN NORTH AMERICA OVER THE WEEKEND WAS “THE CONJURING,” A PERIOD HAUNTED HOUSE FILM THAT COST WARNER BROTHERS $20 MILLION TO MAKE and received stellar reviews. It took in $41.5 million, according to box office estimates compiled by Hollywood.com. Universal’s “R.I.P.D.,” which starred Jeff Bridges and Ryan Reynolds as ghost cops, took in a disastrous $12.8 million, for seventh place. Universal said the movie cost $130 million (not including marketing), but the Hollywood trade news site Deadline.com said the actual price was $154 million.” NYT

Humberto Rivera

 

[David Kuhn]

I wonder if the easy availability of meta-databases of critical feedback (both from pros and viewers) is exacerbating the problem. I know that before I go to any movie I hit Rotten Tomatoes to get feedback, and while in some cases I'm not looking for a high rating (I didn't expect Pacific Rim to have a great rating since Godzilla like movies are usually thin on dialog... and would have seen it in any case since I'm a fanboy of giant monsters AND giant robots) it has frequently caused me to move a film from a 'theater' to a 'rent' viewing.

 

[Christopher Mills]

Anyone here know if these large budget failures were vetted by the current wave of project analysis companies?

Anyone going to admit it if they were?

 

[Humberto Rivera]

I was kind of glad to that Pacific Rim seems to be INCHING forward ever so slowly to a breaking-even point! The International Market has become an important part to the Movie Releasing Process. In fact is more important than the “Domestic Numbers”, which still remains important because of the old system; were whatever works in the USA and Canada, is what going to work in the World, but that’s changing soon!

http://www.deadline.com/2013/07/pacific-rim-1-internationally-over-weekend/ ‘Pacific Rim’ #1 Internationally Over Weekend” By NIKKI FINKE, Editor in Chief - Monday July 22, 2013 @ 6:25pm PDT

Christopher, I have to admit that I wasn’t aware of “Project Analysis” for Motion Picture Films, so I looked it up; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Film_finance Thank! I knew about the Tax Breaks that place like Puerto Rico give Motion Picture Films (I think it one of the largest). I would say its recommended reading for any one in financing a Film! Well it well put together.

I just wanted to add; I know that I’m standing on “solid ground”, when I say Jim Jannard, Gramme Nattress, and Jarred Land mean what they say, and say what they mean! They continue to move forward with ever expanding options for their cameras, the camera has gone through several generations of up-grades, and they’re still moving forward to the places unknown to the human imagination. Just Saying!

Humberto Rivera

 

[David Kuhn]

I was kind of glad to that Pacific Rim seems to be INCHING forward ever so slowly to a breaking-even point!

I hope it makes it positive... I think it will do well in Asia (are they the biggest film market in the world yet?). Sure I groaned a bit at the dialog, and the plot was a lot of Top Gun mixed with a lot of Independence Day, but as an homage to the giant monster films of the past I think it worked really well - and it looked INCREDIBLE.

 

[Humberto Rivera]

David, we’re both on the same page, it was a giant effort to bring the Picture to the Stage, and the ILM images will serve a sequel well, and the current Video Game and Future Video Games. I think the Movie Business has GRADUATED to being First a Motion Picture Business, but also all the “Ancillary Markets” for which all can capitalized on the same “Advertisement and Promotion”, you’re not really selling one product any more, you’re selling a variety of products at the same time, and certainly “Pacific Rim” is one of those products. What is interesting is that no one ever talks about that market, its got-to be all gravy for the Copyright Holder! Also there are not too many comments about the 10 year live of Motion Picture, they just talked about the first weeks of the Film, curious!

I got to reading into the various things among Film Financing and came across this article; http://advice.cio.com/thomas_wailgu...w_science_behind_the_art_of_making_hit_movies “Prediction Software: The New Science Behind the Art of Making Hit Movies” Posted January 16, 2009 by Thomas Wailgum to Applications

It’s kind of interesting reading! Here is another from The New Yorker; “The Cobra Inside a movie marketer’s playbook” by Tad Friend http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2009/01/19/090119fa_fact_friend I suggest hitting PRINT on The New Yorker article!

Humberto Rivera

 

[Humberto Rivera]

I was reading The Hollywood Reporter this morning and came across this article; “5 Ways to Fix the Summer Movie Box-Office Crisis” 5:00 AM PDT 7/24/2013 by Pamela McClintock http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/5-ways-fix-summer-movies-590986

The five way were; 1. Stop Double Dating; 2. Control Those Cost; 3. Don’t Forget The Ladies; 4. Cool It With the Cartoons; and 5. Make Better Movies! I was thinking its all good advice, but will they follow it, can they break their habit of trying to outdo the competition, I drought it!

Humberto Rivera

 

[David Kuhn]

I was reading The Hollywood Reporter this morning and came across this article; “5 Ways to Fix the Summer Movie Box-Office Crisis” 5:00 AM PDT 7/24/2013 by Pamela McClintock http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/5-ways-fix-summer-movies-590986

The five way were; 1. Stop Double Dating; 2. Control Those Cost; 3. Don’t Forget The Ladies; 4. Cool It With the Cartoons; and 5. Make Better Movies! I was thinking its all good advice, but will they follow it, can they break their habit of trying to outdo the competition, I drought it!

Humberto Rivera

Good list... not necessarily easy to do but good. To that I would add "leave the politics at home". To get the grapevine label 'preachy' (After Earth) is the kiss of death unless you got enough heavy guns in other areas to pull it off (Avatar), and if people smell an agenda (White House Down) then you'll generally alienate a good percentage of your potential viewers. Some of my friends went to see 'The Lone Ranger', the only feedback I got was that 'the movie hates Ameraica and Europeans'. These are fairly frequent moviegoers, non-denominational (politically) average Joe types so if they reacted so strongly I think there's likely a fundamental problem there.

 

[Elsie N]

Good list... not necessarily easy to do but good. To that I would add "leave the politics at home". To get the grapevine label 'preachy' (After Earth) is the kiss of death unless you got enough heavy guns in other areas to pull it off (Avatar), and if people smell an agenda (White House Down) then you'll generally alienate a good percentage of your potential viewers. Some of my friends went to see 'The Lone Ranger', the only feedback I got was that 'the movie hates Ameraica and Europeans'. These are fairly frequent moviegoers, non-denominational (politically) average Joe types so if they reacted so strongly I think there's likely a fundamental problem there.

David, I think you have raised a very important point to consider when constructing a movie. I recently realized that my current project was, without saying it, discounting a very important world view... one which I neither ascribe to or disavow. It was so easy to include one simple prop in that scene so now when I shoot it, an added couple of lines could grow my audience by many multiples... or at least should head off any negative interpretation of the movie that would keep an important audience segment to stay away in droves. The perception of one character will change but only slightly, as she was very much the same character before the change as after.