Sabovic Adis
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So, Disney confessed, a? :biggrin:
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STAR WARS: The Thread of Spoilers
- Thread starter Christoffer Glans
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Craig W. Bickerstaff
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I think Sorkin can be very cinematic at times. just look at some of the things that happened in the west wing from the opening of the first episode to the finale of season 2 and the big moment in the debate at the beginning of Season 4. Sorkin is very cinematic.
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Christoffer Glans
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What? How can that be judgmental? The best writing in history in storytelling has been plays in theatre, most works dance around every film ever written, so if someone masters the art of dialogue rhythm like in a stage play, that's masterful. I've grown up with theatre and worked with it, films are rarely close to a perfectly crafted and performed play. There's also nothing wrong with it being like a stage play, I said that he feels like the only one who really masters that artform in filmmaking, The way he brings the rhythm of theatre into film and TV has never been done before, so if anything I'm doing the opposite of being judgmental.
Yeah, but it's not his strength, I've seen others do far better at pure cinematic writing together with directing. Sorkin masters the words and dialogue, that's his best game.
Wayne Morellini
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Growing up with plays is one thing, but it is like wanting to commit harri karri to some of us. A lot of pomp and ceremony yelling to the back of the audience, when you can sit in a theater and see real masterful face, body and tonal movements intermently spoken to you by a real master of the screen.
I dont know if a good play beats a good novel for writing. Novels have a good latitude of intricaties they can get into. Plays are often restricted, screen plays more so. But like sports the irrelevant cost and team effort make people value their plays more than a mere book, but.mere books seem often to have the top effect. Now movies are different, they have immense efforts, and the efforts to craft a performance, to visually and emotionally write a story on top of the screen play adds teal value. But for each Inconvenient Truth, how many such books are written each year with the substance of such effect. I have floating around here a book U git after seeing the author on TV about the ills of capitalism. If everybody took notice of what was written we would have major change like what the Inconvenient Truth sort, and there are pmkbably a number written each year. I collect major documentary works, from some mistaken notion of showing people them, to get them thinking. Like the corporation, etc. Such magnitudes of documentary effort does not come by too often. So the book is the oft silent spring of information (for those who know that book).
Don't get me wrong, I think plats ate significant, and am.interested in filming them for many years, as Les is doing. However, I like the first intimate firm of performance on screen where the actor talks to you quietly subtly face to face, not as much chest pounding fun for the axtir as bellowing power and passion, but it wasn't really about the actor anyway. I passed a small band of musos in the street after the fireworks tonight. They were jamming their crap with passion. I have a number of muso friends I've got an ear like a talent scout, and a lot of musicians do it because of how it makes them feel, and get stuck. But the reality is if you want people to support you in the self hobby, you had better do something som group likes.
Christoffer, I suppose, like sports, I just get a bit put back by theatre and its self entitlement. In Australia we have a national government news channel and on it is an incredible amount of sports news, interruptions to broadcast commentary on sports etc. Most of these lazy stupid people don't even play sports they are mad about. However video games are the biggest sports form in the country and even though most of its fans actually play the things themselves, you don't see them going mad and demanding air time and interviews, commentary and interruption to ACTUAL REAL HUMBLE NEWS programming, or even broadcast of live games on national, who gives a rats arse what the rest of you think or feel about our self entitled sports interrupting your say and proper programming, television. Instead they have just three programs for every computer sports under the sun. One a regular program, one a kids version and one for pocket games, covering tens of thousands of seperate digital sports, and these real digital sports participants are HUMBLY happy with that compared to the obnoxious sports addict. I amuse my self sometimes thinking what it would be like if we had even ONE DAY where all the sports references on TV were replaced with computer game references and tournaments, the outcry comimg from the self entitled sports adict would be incredible. So, we shouldn't get to much about sports and theater. They are good things there to be enjoyed, but that's it. Pass me the spiritual sauce.
Happy new year guys
I dont know if a good play beats a good novel for writing. Novels have a good latitude of intricaties they can get into. Plays are often restricted, screen plays more so. But like sports the irrelevant cost and team effort make people value their plays more than a mere book, but.mere books seem often to have the top effect. Now movies are different, they have immense efforts, and the efforts to craft a performance, to visually and emotionally write a story on top of the screen play adds teal value. But for each Inconvenient Truth, how many such books are written each year with the substance of such effect. I have floating around here a book U git after seeing the author on TV about the ills of capitalism. If everybody took notice of what was written we would have major change like what the Inconvenient Truth sort, and there are pmkbably a number written each year. I collect major documentary works, from some mistaken notion of showing people them, to get them thinking. Like the corporation, etc. Such magnitudes of documentary effort does not come by too often. So the book is the oft silent spring of information (for those who know that book).
Don't get me wrong, I think plats ate significant, and am.interested in filming them for many years, as Les is doing. However, I like the first intimate firm of performance on screen where the actor talks to you quietly subtly face to face, not as much chest pounding fun for the axtir as bellowing power and passion, but it wasn't really about the actor anyway. I passed a small band of musos in the street after the fireworks tonight. They were jamming their crap with passion. I have a number of muso friends I've got an ear like a talent scout, and a lot of musicians do it because of how it makes them feel, and get stuck. But the reality is if you want people to support you in the self hobby, you had better do something som group likes.
Christoffer, I suppose, like sports, I just get a bit put back by theatre and its self entitlement. In Australia we have a national government news channel and on it is an incredible amount of sports news, interruptions to broadcast commentary on sports etc. Most of these lazy stupid people don't even play sports they are mad about. However video games are the biggest sports form in the country and even though most of its fans actually play the things themselves, you don't see them going mad and demanding air time and interviews, commentary and interruption to ACTUAL REAL HUMBLE NEWS programming, or even broadcast of live games on national, who gives a rats arse what the rest of you think or feel about our self entitled sports interrupting your say and proper programming, television. Instead they have just three programs for every computer sports under the sun. One a regular program, one a kids version and one for pocket games, covering tens of thousands of seperate digital sports, and these real digital sports participants are HUMBLY happy with that compared to the obnoxious sports addict. I amuse my self sometimes thinking what it would be like if we had even ONE DAY where all the sports references on TV were replaced with computer game references and tournaments, the outcry comimg from the self entitled sports adict would be incredible. So, we shouldn't get to much about sports and theater. They are good things there to be enjoyed, but that's it. Pass me the spiritual sauce.
Happy new year guys
Martin Stevens
REDuser Sponsor
I loved "The Force Awakens", and really enjoyed this article....
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/seth-abramson/10-reasons-star-wars-the-force-awakens-_b_8895598.html
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/seth-abramson/10-reasons-star-wars-the-force-awakens-_b_8895598.html
Ryan Sauve
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Great article! Thanks for sharing.
Totally agree with Sebastian Moretto's critique. I'm in no hurry to see TFA again, even though there was much to enjoy in the return to the Star Wars universe.
I would add my opinion is that Abrams has always been all about the set pieces and doesn't care if the connecting plot between them is paper thin. All his films have MASSIVE unsatisfactory coincidences, and internal logic breaks which don't hold up to any kind of scrutiny. The sad thing is that many of those could be made to work with minor script tweaks if only someone on his films actually did a bit of extra script work. Also, his TED Talk about "the mystery box" is basically his liking of setting up unanswered questions. While this is cool to the extent that leaving some ambiguity for an audience can work really well, like the originally unanswered question of whether Deckard is a replicant himself in Blade Runner, it does not excuse filmmakers/writers not knowing the answers themselves because that allows really lazy writing. Far easier to set up "cool" premises and characters, if you don't care to make them internally logically consistent or have a satisfying resolution.
Sure, fans can twist & turn to explain those coincidences and thin plot as if it was all some great storytelling that lesser mortals just haven't understood - but like Prometheus justification, none of this should be required in a major blockbuster intended for the masses. A great film should work great on every level, including the first viewing.
It's sad because he has most of the skills and talents to be a great filmmaker, not just a crowdpleaser. Of course, his films generally make huge box office, so there's not really any incentive for him to change his working methods.
I would add my opinion is that Abrams has always been all about the set pieces and doesn't care if the connecting plot between them is paper thin. All his films have MASSIVE unsatisfactory coincidences, and internal logic breaks which don't hold up to any kind of scrutiny. The sad thing is that many of those could be made to work with minor script tweaks if only someone on his films actually did a bit of extra script work. Also, his TED Talk about "the mystery box" is basically his liking of setting up unanswered questions. While this is cool to the extent that leaving some ambiguity for an audience can work really well, like the originally unanswered question of whether Deckard is a replicant himself in Blade Runner, it does not excuse filmmakers/writers not knowing the answers themselves because that allows really lazy writing. Far easier to set up "cool" premises and characters, if you don't care to make them internally logically consistent or have a satisfying resolution.
Sure, fans can twist & turn to explain those coincidences and thin plot as if it was all some great storytelling that lesser mortals just haven't understood - but like Prometheus justification, none of this should be required in a major blockbuster intended for the masses. A great film should work great on every level, including the first viewing.
It's sad because he has most of the skills and talents to be a great filmmaker, not just a crowdpleaser. Of course, his films generally make huge box office, so there's not really any incentive for him to change his working methods.
Sean Connery Smith
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I loved it also. My only problem with it was this.
The Kylo Ren seems to have a good amount of ADVANCED JEDI TRAINING -- Mind Reading, Stopping the phaser blast in mid air and holding it there like a piece of cake.
But despite all that Chewbacca shot him in the gut - He couldn't sense that and it was far away. Plus he got his butt handed to him by Ray "newbie" discovering force - Not even a Jedi when Ray fought him.. Even Fin was holding his own with that sabre against Kilo.- I know he was hurt but - Mind reading .. I only remember seeing that in the Star Trek vulcan mind melt. Maybe I am reaching.
I did like how they show him immature and breaking up the equipment when he got mad.. But still he should have some control. I would figure those are the basics that one has to learn first.
Not for nothing.. Chewbacca was pissed and he prob said.. " I'mma shot you a$$ for killin' my homee" - that was a good shot though.
SHOUTING HERE
HECK I SAY BRING BACK DARTH MAUL AND FORGET ALL THESE OTHER WIMP DARK SIDE JEDI's
When he pulled that double light sabre.. I was sayin Wooohhh dat's a BASS A$$ muther!!!! - I am sure other people was saying that to.
CASE RESTED FOR NOW!!!
The Kylo Ren seems to have a good amount of ADVANCED JEDI TRAINING -- Mind Reading, Stopping the phaser blast in mid air and holding it there like a piece of cake.
But despite all that Chewbacca shot him in the gut - He couldn't sense that and it was far away. Plus he got his butt handed to him by Ray "newbie" discovering force - Not even a Jedi when Ray fought him.. Even Fin was holding his own with that sabre against Kilo.- I know he was hurt but - Mind reading .. I only remember seeing that in the Star Trek vulcan mind melt. Maybe I am reaching.
I did like how they show him immature and breaking up the equipment when he got mad.. But still he should have some control. I would figure those are the basics that one has to learn first.
Not for nothing.. Chewbacca was pissed and he prob said.. " I'mma shot you a$$ for killin' my homee" - that was a good shot though.
SHOUTING HERE
HECK I SAY BRING BACK DARTH MAUL AND FORGET ALL THESE OTHER WIMP DARK SIDE JEDI's
When he pulled that double light sabre.. I was sayin Wooohhh dat's a BASS A$$ muther!!!! - I am sure other people was saying that to.
CASE RESTED FOR NOW!!!