Stage 3 and 3.5 Serial Numbers

[Peter Matthes]

Red has announced that they will begin serving Stage 4 customers while the "long" process of Stage 3 and 3.5 are under way.

But I'm telling you.. the whole send your camera in, have it checked etc, is going to be a long process. and because we are at the mercy of customer's own timelines on when they can send their camera in.. it is absolutely impossible to put any timeline on it whatsoever.

This means that a late Stage 3 and/or Stage 3.5 customer, who has been a Red customer for several years, will more than likely receive an Epic-X with a serial number much higher than a brand new stage 4 customer.

Since all future upgrades (like Dragon) will be served based on your Epic or Scarlet serial number, this will really suck.

Stage 2 has taken (4) months ... and it is not complete. How "long" a process will Stage 3 and 3.5 be? I'll bet the better part of a year ... and I will be right.

Since Red knows EXACTLY how many people have committed to Stage 3/3.5 as of the 15th, I believe that those serial numbers should be assigned and reserved, before Stage 4 cameras are issued a serial number. This would, this should be done now before it's too late to be instituted.

If you want to do away with preferential treatment for older customers, that perfectly fine, and it might be a good move. However, it should be done across the board.

Please add your voice and opinion to this.

 

[Ivan G]

I agree Pete, I've been bummed at how long this is taking and people talking about a new sensor when we still might be months away. You can't get Epics out fast enough but decide to let stage 4 jump in front. Just doesn't make sense. I'm extremely thankful for what Red has done to swap our old Red ones but time is money and I hope it's not gonna be even trade in delay. Like I said before, I hope I made the right choice. Epic M, stage 2 and Scarlet now shipping. We're thrown with new customers? Sorry but I'm frustrated as hell.

 

[Mike Van Laanen]

It seems like Stage 2 has ground to a slow crawl. There have been 41 white names left now on the list for the past week plus. I know this is not an offical list, but you'd expect to see more coming off the line than that. I set aside my Red One thinking I'd be getting a note to send it in sometime around now. I can send mine now and would love to. Do you think it might have anything to do with the flare guard retrofit?

 

[George Butterfield]

Since all future upgrades (like Dragon) will be served based on your Epic or Scarlet serial number, this will really suck.

I think we have seen the last of "preferential" treatment. After Stage 3.5 Red will have cleared out all the backlog and will be in a more mature operational mode. I think everything will be put on a first to order, first served basis.

I believe that those serial numbers should be assigned and reserved, before Stage 4 cameras are issued a serial number. This would, this should be done now before it's too late to be instituted.

I believe serial numbers should reflect the actual manufacturing order as this might be needed to keep track of modifications etc.

 

[Stephen Lovett]

Hi Peter,

To my knowledge RED hasn't announced anything regarding the process or priority for RED Dragon upgrades.

It's a hard problem as they will have to decide if M owners or X owners or perhaps even RED One MX owners have priority along with other complexities like the one you raise.

RED's taken significant care in managing upgrades in the past and I for one am not particularly concerned about it.

Would I like to understand it better than I do, you betcha. Did I miss a post where the upgrade path was specified?

Cheers,

Steve

 

[Peter Matthes]

... and because we are at the mercy of customer's own timelines on when they can send their camera in.. it is absolutely impossible to put any timeline on it whatsoever.

I also believe that if Red waits for individual owners to be good and ready to send their camera in, they will be at the mercy of chaos, and we will be talking about this a year from now.

If my camera is working when my number comes up, please skip me and move on ... If only for the sake of the people that follow me.

 

[Peter Matthes]

Hey Ivan,

Happy Holidays!

Once again, we should be shooting in Detroit this February. Hope you'll join us. The client loved the footage you shot last year. However, from the look of things, we'll be shooting Red One instead of Epic. :mellow:

 

[Ramesh Jai]

If it's going to be a longer wait then I prefer to go the Stage 2 route - is RED willing to include me in the Stage 2 now? I think it'll be fair enough. I think everyone in stage 3 and 3.5, who wish to, should be given an opportunity to become part of stage 2 (again only if they wish too). RED what do you say?

 

[Rob Castiglione]

Thanks Peter. I hadn't seen that statement. I have to say that I am getting concerned about the open timeline. Customers who are ready to send in their cameras immediately they are notified should not be held up by those who can't.

 

[Ivan G]

Great news Pete, I had blast working with you and your crew! Please keep me posted. In the meantime I hope to receive my Epic soon.

Ramesh, as for me it's not worth jumping back on stage 2 as my red is non mx. I'm sure Red will take care of us as they have since day 1. I totally understand that all this is new to them as it is to us so changes will be made.

I'd like to hear what Red's thoughts are on how they'll handle the Dragon serial upgrades.

 

[Luis Otero]

Peter,This is a very sensible proposal of yours that Red should consider. Great idea indeed.

I think we have seen the last of "preferential" treatment. After Stage 3.5 Red will have cleared out all the backlog and will be in a more mature operational mode....

George, I hate to put words on someone eles' mouth, but if you statement is a reflection of a reallity to come, then Red is just turning into Sony, JVC, et al... and I do not think that is what they want to be, perceived, or behave. I still hope that Jim's initial vision and loyalty intention toward those of us early adopters will be maintained, being part of their business model. I really do not think that he will allow the excecive corporate/capitalistic greed we are all suffering from, and that has brought our contry to this debacle, to cloud his mind and interfere with his business decisions.

 

[Elsie N]

My guess is they are gearing up to handle Stage3/3.5 the same way they handled the MX upgrade. You will send your camera in to a separate facility, the camera is checked, your money is paid, then they reach over and grab an Epic X that has passed quality control and ship it back to you.

They got through the MX upgrade reasonably fast and I am confident what they learned during that program will help them go faster through this one. And, during the MX upgrade they were able to skip over eligible cameras that were working and still come back and clean up those skips when the owner was ready. The Stage 4 sales orders will be fulfilled at the same time, but maybe from another facility that waits until cameras come off the assembly line, so they appear to be coming during Stage 3/3.5 but are actually on an "off-the-assembly line schedule.

I'm thinking they may currently be stockpiling cameras for Stage 3/3.5 (just as they did MX sensors for that upgrade) so that when this whole business starts, it will go smoothly. That's what I would do.

 

[Peter Matthes]

Customers who are ready to send in their cameras immediately they are notified should not be held up by those who can't.

I could not agree more.

I'd like to hear what Red's thoughts are on how they'll handle the Dragon serial upgrades.

+1

... or just give some assurance that late Stage 3 and Stage 3.5 customers will not move further and further back in a seemingly endless line for future upgrades.

I have a great deal of respect and admiration for Red. The hours they put in, and the devotion to what they are doing, is truly unmatched. However, if they cannot see why these methods are frustrating for filmmakers trying to run a business, they need to stop for a moment and place themselves in the shoes of their own customers.